Metal Gear

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SSj_Ness said:
He's in MGS2, until that was retconned. Fuck MGS4 btw.
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I still don't get what Kojima was going for there, he introduced The Sorrow in MGS3 who could communicate with the dead and Ocelot is his son, to explain the connection between him and Liquid, only for him to... drop that for MGS4 and just say it was hypnosis? How does hypnosis cause the physical changes to your body as seen in MGS2 where Ocelot not only becomes more buff like Liquid but also speaks in his voice?

It's funny how trying to retcon things into not being supernatural only makes it more ridiculous, there's no reason why the supernatural can't exist in Metal Gear's universe, Kojima getting cold feet about that is one of the more bizarre changes and one big reason why the series is just not all that great post Snake Eater.

It really makes it seem like 4 and 5 are not even the same universe as 1, 2 and 3 as what we're told does not match up with what we saw.

Every time I feel like I'm being too hard on MGS4 I'm reminded just how stupid it and I get angry all over again, it doesn't sting any less after 14 years, just why? Is Kojima genuinely kind of mentally ill? A lot of choices he's made really are just downright bizarre, once upon a time that madness lead to genius, but it seems like at some point it veered off into just crazy territory, I wonder why?

Because I mean let's face it, he wanted to end the story with Sons of Liberty originally, nowadays we can easily say we wish it had given how stupid things got, but what was he thinking making a game that ends in obvious cliff hangers if he never intended to continue? It's downright crazy.

You can say it was a bold decision to leave things up to our imagination, but why reintroduce Liquid and his rivalry with Snake if you intended that to not be followed up on? It doesn't make any sense.
 
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Dom Cruise said:
I still don't get what Kojima was going for there, he introduced The Sorrow in MGS3 who could communicate with the dead and Ocelot is his son, to explain the connection between him and Liquid, only for him to... drop that for MGS4 and just say it was hypnosis? How does hypnosis cause the physical changes to your body as seen in MGS2 where Ocelot not only becomes more buff like Liquid but also speaks in his voice?

It's funny how trying to retcon things into not being supernatural only makes it more ridiculous, there's no reason why the supernatural can't exist in Metal Gear's universe, Kojima getting cold feet about that is one of the more bizarre changes and only big reason why the series is just not all that great post Snake Eater.

It really makes it seem like 4 and 5 are not even the same universe as 1, 2 and 3 as what we're told does not match up with what we saw.

Every time I feel like I'm being too hard on MGS4 I'm reminded just how stupid it and I get angry all over again, it doesn't sting any less after 14 years, just why? Is Kojima genuinely kind of mentally ill? A lot of choices he's made really are just downright bizarre, once upon a time that madness lead to genius, but it seems like at some point it veered off into just crazy territory, I wonder why?

Because I mean let's face it, he wanted to end the story with Sons of Liberty originally, nowadays we can easily say we wish it had given how stupid things got, but what was he thinking making a game that ends in obvious cliff hangers if he never intended to continue? It's downright crazy.

You can say it was a bold decision to leave things up to our imagination, but why reintroduce Liquid and his rivalry with Snake if you intended that to not be followed up on? It doesn't make any sense.
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apparently kojumbo got sent death threats to make mgs4, even back in 2008
they could've done so much more with the concept of nanos retaining the carrier's psyche
 
Neurotypical Mantis said:
apparently kojumbo got sent death threats to make mgs4, even back in 2008
they could've done so much more with the concept of nanos retaining the carrier's psyche
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Yeah but let’s be honest, the people who sent those death threats couldn’t do anything anyway. If I was Kojima I just would’ve given them the middle finger and told them to fuck off.
 
Neurotypical Mantis said:
apparently kojumbo got sent death threats to make mgs4, even back in 2008
they could've done so much more with the concept of nanos retaining the carrier's psyche
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But he had to have expected a negative reaction by leaving everyone hanging like that, imagine if George Lucas ended Star Wars with Empire Strikes Back and then said "I prefer to leave the rest to everyone's imaginations!"

I know back then I wouldn't have accepted that either, although I wanted Kojima to continue the story down the path of crazy, mess with your head shenanigans of 2, but I would never have accepted the idea of just being left hanging.

Ending it with so much left hanging was a pretty crazy idea and it only seems acceptable today because when it continued it got so stupid.


I've been meaning to mention too that another thing that sucks about 4 is it's whole plot involving "PMCs" which was obvious commentary on the Iraq war and companies like Blackwater, all that shit feels so incredibly dated now, it's as dated and irrelevant as 2 is spookily prophetic and relevant.
 
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Dom Cruise said:
I still don't get what Kojima was going for there, he introduced The Sorrow in MGS3 who could communicate with the dead and Ocelot is his son, to explain the connection between him and Liquid, only for him to... drop that for MGS4 and just say it was hypnosis? How does hypnosis cause the physical changes to your body as seen in MGS2 where Ocelot not only becomes more buff like Liquid but also speaks in his voice?
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To play devil's advocate, maybe it was a not really his voice but was a creative decision to better communicate to players what was happening. Doesn't really explain why Snake recognized his voice though...

Kojima is like Miyamoto, equal parts genius and retard. They shouldn't be in charge, just used as creative forces, with someone to filter the bullshit.

Dom Cruise said:
It's funny how trying to retcon things into not being supernatural only makes it more ridiculous, there's no reason why the supernatural can't exist in Metal Gear's universe, Kojima getting cold feet about that is one of the more bizarre changes and only big reason why the series is just not all that great post Snake Eater.
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The MGS science is practically magic anyway, he should have embraced it.

Dom Cruise said:
It really makes it seem like 4 and 5 are not even the same universe as 1, 2 and 3 as what we're told does not match up with what we saw.
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Tbh I just pretend MGS ended at MGS2 and we're still on a cliffhanger.

Dom Cruise said:
Every time I feel like I'm being too hard on MGS4 I'm reminded just how stupid it and I get angry all over again, it doesn't sting any less after 14 years, just why? Is Kojima genuinely kind of mentally ill? A lot of choices he's made really are just downright bizarre, once upon a time that madness lead to genius, but it seems like at some point it veered off into just crazy territory, I wonder why?

Because I mean let's face it, he wanted to end the story with Sons of Liberty originally, nowadays we can easily say we wish it had given how stupid things got, but what was he thinking making a game that ends in obvious cliff hangers if he never intended to continue? It's downright crazy.
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I think he had no idea where to go from there so he went backwards, that's why half the games are prequels.

Dom Cruise said:
You can say it was a bold decision to leave things up to our imagination, but why reintroduce Liquid and his rivalry with Snake if you intended that to not be followed up on? It doesn't make any sense.
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Fans are partially to blame. The backlash about Raiden probably didn't instill confidence in Kojima. I'll never not think it was blown out of proportion, I was mildly disappointed too, but Raiden was a good character in his own right.

They tried adding the "Snake Tales" mini missions kinda showing what Snake was up to while Raiden was running around, but it wasn't enough. If the game is ever remade they should do a full Resident Evil 2 thing, with fully separate campaigns for each character.
 
SSj_Ness said:
I think he had no idea where to go from there so he went backwards, that's why half the games are prequels.
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I'm pretty sure they're all chronological sequels in the sense that you play as Raiden's brain in a jar or whatever (Raiden might not be a single dude) being subjected to VR brainwashing, so trying to put together a historical canon with the tech or characters or whatever is just gonna be frustrating unless you take a really meta approach.

MGS4 made no sense until PW/V (which were planned together as "5") came out. I kind of like it now but the level of autism necessary to piece everything together is a pretty brutal thing to expect of an audience.
 
I like MGSV's gameplay but I hate most plot points, for example I don't like the whole "Venom Snake is a double", hell I even have a headcannon that Venom Really is Big Boss, and Ishmael was just a hallucination, mostly based on one particular scene during mission 1, but like I said its just headcannon.
I disliked MGS2 at first, but the game grew on me as the story went on, I liked MGS3 and its my favorite, and I have never played MGS4
 
Internet War Criminal said:
im really surprised so many of you enjoy mgs2

how many of you who prefer it over mgs3 actually played at the time it came out? It was literally shat on by everyone at the time and even more after mgs3 came out, it was seen like a mistake in the series but final things were back on track
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I played them both around the times they released, not at launch but shortly after for MGS2 and still during PS2's lifespan for MGS3.

MGS3 was too damn corny, and nobody was as likable as in previous games. Always changing camo to be optimal, no radar, worse level design, etc. It doesn't do anything better, maybe graphics but I didn't like the earthy, dark look.
 
What do you mean it doesn't have anybody more likable than previous games it has

1) Big Boss
2) The Boss
3) Ocelot
4) That Twink
5) That Nuclear Scientist

Who the fuck was even in MGS2? That fat dude on roller skates? The vampire?


The whole sniper fight with The End is better than all of MGS 2 combined. It was one of those 'Holy shit' moments in gaming when it happened, when something like that had never been done or seen before.

The only time that happened in MGS2 is when you switch to Raiden, and, well, not the same kind of holy shit.
 
Internet War Criminal said:
What do you mean it doesn't have anybody more likable than previous games it has

1) Big Boss
2) The Boss
3) Ocelot
4) That Twink
5) That Nuclear Scientist

Who the fuck was even in MGS2? That fat dude on roller skates? The vampire?


The whole sniper fight with The End is better than all of MGS 2 combined. It was one of those 'Holy shit' moments in gaming when it happened, when something like that had never been done or seen before.

The only time that happened in MGS2 is when you switch to Raiden, and, well, not the same kind of holy shit.
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Lol The Boss was dumb, Ocelot became a cringy howling furry, etc. In MGS2 you get Raiden, Vamp, Solidus, and of course the MGS1 cast, plus the creepy fungus people impersonators. Way more memorable.

"Fat guy in skates" is at least as good/bad as fire astronaut, bee guy, old guy (he dies by waiting him out which is cool but that's it), etc.

And in fact, I just fought him normally and didn't know about waiting him out originally.
 
Mary the Goldsmith said:
I like MGSV's gameplay but I hate most plot points, for example I don't like the whole "Venom Snake is a double", hell I even have a headcannon that Venom Really is Big Boss, and Ishmael was just a hallucination, mostly based on one particular scene during mission 1, but like I said its just headcannon.
I disliked MGS2 at first, but the game grew on me as the story went on, I liked MGS3 and its my favorite, and I have never played MGS4
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This subject exhausts me too much to post seriously about but if it makes you feel better, literally everyone in the game is lying to you and at the end when they pretend to tell you the truth they're still lying, that's the joke. Hence the renewed Escape From New York references.

Game takes place after 4: you're a brainwashed PMC cyborg mascot with cutscenes playing in your head. hth
If you want to go deep on this the Paz tapes/spot-the-difference helicopter flashbacks are a thread you can pull which will lead to a months-long nightmare world of first poring over every line and texture in Peace Walker, then the rest of the series, until your walls are covered with red string and you can't talk about the games anymore without people getting mad at you. I don't recommend it.
 
Bennytehsmeghead said:
GET FUCKED AND BACK OFF, FANFAGGOT.

People like YOU are the reason why Metal Gear Solid 2 was made in the first place!

EDIT: You want another reason why I'm so mad? Because you're forcing your opinion on someone who just disagrees with you. THAT is why I call you a fanfaggot. You're going after someone over something as trivial as METAL GEAR SOLID 3: SNAKE EATER, and you're forcing YOUR opinion on someone who disagrees with it. When you do that, you lose all your credibility and come off as a butthurt, biased fanboy.

Look, it's okay to like Solid 3 and consider it your personal favourite and/or the best from an objective standpoint. I understand that it's either 2 or 3 that checks out as most people's favourite. But to force your opinion on someone who disagreed with you and insult them for not agreeing in the process is genuinely retarded and I will not stand for it. Good evening, bye.
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Lmaoooo what a glorious assmad faggot.
 
Resunoit said:
If I was Kojima I just would’ve given them the middle finger
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That's kind of what MGS4 is, I think.

Mary the Goldsmith said:
I like MGSV's gameplay but I hate most plot points, for example I don't like the whole "Venom Snake is a double", hell I even have a headcannon that Venom Really is Big Boss, and Ishmael was just a hallucination, mostly based on one particular scene during mission 1, but like I said its just headcannon.
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There are so many inconsistencies with "the truth" (and various other things in the rest of the game) that despite what Kojima fanboys say, the idea that MGSV is just Big Boss losing his mind or being in a coma dream are perfectly valid interpretations.

I've always found it interesting that a group of faggots who desperately began to cite the "MGS2 was a VR simulation!" theory in the 2010's as a reason Kojima is a genius are so obtusely against the idea that MGS V is a coma dream or psychosis event.
 
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