💼 Careercow Mark Waid / William Mark Waid - Comics legend turned laughingstock, SJW lunatic, Dislikes Asians, Sued for Tortious Interference, King Baby, “The Strong Protect The Weak”

[Zvantastika]

I'd actually like to see some actual critique from industry pros or reviewers whose opinion carrys some weight outside their vacuum.

Probably not going to happen soon, as some posts mentioned earlier, this is a shitfest were everyone involved is getting smeared all over. I'm guessing the important opinions and big reviews will come later, basically when things are already done for and the important people will just report the results of all this crap rather than who is right and why. I could be wrong of course and being honest, I want to be wrong on this one and see this shitstorm get bigger with some famous names in the middle, but I don't get my hopes up of this happening.

 

[Pozzingmyfilthyneghole]

Probably not going to happen soon, as some posts mentioned earlier, this is a shitfest were everyone involved is getting smeared all over. I'm guessing the important opinions and big reviews will come later, basically when things are already done for and the important people will just report the results of all this crap rather than who is right and why. I could be wrong of course and being honest, I want to be wrong on this one and see this shitstorm get bigger with some famous names in the middle, but I don't get my hopes up of this happening.

Why can't the spergy tards just ignore ya boi Zach? Let him cough in peace and just ignore his online rants. This is worse than Milo Yabbadoopolis and Jordan "Lobster King" Peterson combined.

 

[AJ 447]

Not the Waid isn't a hack and cow but using d&c videos to prove points is getting tired. We get it, he has nothing good to say about marvel (in general because he was quite positive about moongirl once) so I'd actually like to see some actual critique from industry pros or reviewers whose opinion carrys some weight outside their vacuum.

Why don't you hit up ye olde googler and try to find some content yourself, buddy?

 

[AnOminous]

Fire up them "Autistic" ratings boys! I'm going in;

Agreed on most of this, except Waid himself probably will face repercussions for this. Whether that takes the form of him essentially having his career ended or something not quite so publicly visible, such as not getting career advancement, not getting his calls returned, and just stagnating, he's not getting off scot-free.

Any lawsuit will harm Marvel Comics. Disney barely has any reason to give a shit, and I think their liability, at worst, is limited to nuisance value settlement. Still, what Disney considers a nuisance value settlement is a pretty penny to a normal person and a normal lawyer. The most likely outright loser? Waid himself. He has no legal defense for this shit. He also may have no money to pay a judgment, especially if he does end up out of a job, so that may be what determines whether a lawyer is willing to go after this on contingency.

D&C would be dumb to pay up front for legal counsel since it's such a crapshoot, but tons of lawyers take dicey lawsuits all the time.

Interesting points.
I suspect that ya boi Zach will not use all of his Kickstarter money to print copies of his comic.
Instead, he will print enough copies to send to all his backers and then pocket the rest, blaming the boycott/conspiracy against him when people ask why the comic isn't in stores.
I'm not saying Zach will do that, I'm saying that's what I would have done.

I'm pretty sure the vast majority of his backers would have no issue with it if he did, or if he fulfilled all the backer rewards, sold whatever else he could and threw the rest into a lawsuit against Waid. If I'd backed him, I'd be thrilled at such an outcome.

He'd still be miles ahead of all the SJW swindlers who kickstart projects and then literally never do anything at all.

As I understand it, Marvel and DC go to great pains to ensure that most of their creators are considered freelancers (i.e. contractors). For the most part, only editors and other folks who work in the front office are actually salaried employees, while most writers and artists are paid page rates to do the work that is assigned to them.

A lot of employers do similar things and deceptively label employees "contractors" to try to evade their responsibilities like unemployment insurance. Whether they actually are contractors for any given purpose, though, is a functional description depending on a long list of factors, many related to how independent their actual actions are.

Waid consistently signed his emails as a Marvel employee, and if he regularly communicated with them and they didn't tell him not to do that, it really indicates what the relationship was. If he repeatedly bullied people with his "Marvel Comics" signoff, using that in their name, and they knew that and did nothing, I think they're still liable.

I think Waid is going to be quickly gone at Marvel. Not simply for this. There have been rumors that C B Cebulski is really pissed at him from long before this blow up.

I'd heard Cebulski already wanted this assclown gone from as soon as he got put in charge, but that Brevoort had shielded him. I think his armor has evaporated at this point, though, and nobody can save his ass now.

It's actually kind of hard to drop repercussions on the SJW's as most of their lives are what would be repercussions to anyone else.

That's a beautiful way of putting it, and it's why SJWs continually do shit that sane people with actual lives wouldn't do. It's also more generally descriptive of lolcows at large.

@KillThemCrackasBabies and everyone responding to these autistic ramblings with autistic ramblings.

Tbh he actually has some good points and I think it is healthy to have an occasional contrarian tell people to curb their irrational exuberance. I happen to think the latest turns of events offer a lot of hilarity even just with what's already happening and am the future is good.

I seriously don't think the contributions he's made in this thread are threadban-worthy, unlike the other thread where he copped a ban where frankly, he really was just shitting it up.

 

[RodgerDodger]

so I'd actually like to see some actual critique from industry pros or reviewers whose opinion carrys some weight outside their vacuum.

So you’re waiting until Santa Claus, Bigfoot and a Unicorn weigh in? Because you have a greater chance of finding those than an industry “pro” reviewer who’s opinion carries any weight outside their vacuum sealed ever shrinking bubble. This is pure niche consumer fan community bs. Nobody and I mean nobody in the real world general population really gives a shit unless it effects the next Avengers movie. Which the comics haven’t been recognizably connected to in years. There is no expert opinion to consult. “Ya boi Zach”s opinions are just as valid, or rather just as petty insane and stupid as Jude Terrors or Rich Johnston’s or any of those other autistic carbon dioxide farms.

Why can't the spergy tards just ignore ya boi Zach? Let him cough in peace and just ignore his online rants. This is worse than Milo Yabbadoopolis and Jordan "Lobster King" Peterson combined.

That’s just it. They can never ever seem to just ignore it. They can’t not take the bait. Ever. And in the rare case when one is bright enough to ignore it or dismiss it as pointless and meaningless, they themselves will be turned on and devoured by the rabid pack. It’s like watching the worlds most gruesome nature documentary. Feeding habits of the canibalistic feral ghoul. Now with more autism!

 

[AnOminous]

Why does it matter? This is a comedy board not a politics board. The perceived politics of Marvel will not engender comedic or salient discussion that is in any way entertaining.

But the only reason any of this happened is politics. Marvel is flopping hard because they put politics ahead of satisfying their customers. Mark Waid nuked his own career because he was sperging about politics.

How exactly do you completely divorce politics from discussing this when it's literally about politics?

 

[RodgerDodger]

But the only reason any of this happened is politics. Marvel is flopping hard because they put politics ahead of satisfying their customers. Mark Waid nuked his own career because he was sperging about politics.

How exactly do you completely divorce politics from discussing this when it's literally about politics?

Maybe a better way to put it is it is all about the freaks sperging out about politics. Just like you can’t divest Moviebobs constant political spergoutd from the Moviebobs thread, because without the political sperging all that’s left is enough fat to light a city with whale oil. Even when mocking these tarts you can’t completely ignore their ravings or the “get woke, go broke” life lessons that they all inescapably point to.

 

[MMX]

So you’re waiting until Santa Claus, Bigfoot and a Unicorn weigh in? Because you have a greater chance of finding those than an industry “pro” reviewer who’s opinion carries any weight outside their vacuum sealed ever shrinking bubble. This is pure niche consumer fan community bs. Nobody and I mean nobody in the real world general population really gives a shit unless it effects the next Avengers movie. Which the comics haven’t been recognizably connected to in years. There is no expert opinion to consult. “Ya boi Zach”s opinions are just as valid, or rather just as petty insane and stupid as Jude Terrors or Rich Johnston’s or any of those other autistic carbon dioxide farms

I think one of the people I was waiting for already showed up - Ethan van Sciver. Having people with a long history in the industry and great body of work getting behind C&D. He's respected, he comes across as honest and without agenda and isn't a drama whore. I don't expect the likes of Brian Bendis to make a stand as he largely started the cancer but if names like Alex Ross, Geoff Johns or Ed Braubaker raised the issue then maybe the message would move beyond the niche level. Sadly until Marvels bottom line is severely hurt or any writer work a damn fucks off to the indys they are content to keep going in this direction.

Why don't you hit up ye olde googler and try to find some content yourself, buddy?

Like @Zvantastika said it's a hill no one wants to go die on. Waids work has been without criticism. Champions started with positive press but critics soon started to change their tune and sales dropped yet no one really focused on the socjus side of things but choose to focus on inconsistent art and dependence on tie ins.
Marvel has received lots of push back on its new direction (nazi cap, gay iceman, secret empire in general) but the core issue always remains unaddressed.

 

[AnOminous]

Even when mocking these tarts you can’t completely ignore their ravings or the “get woke, go broke” life lessons that they all inescapably point to.

Agree, and it's really not the politics themselves that are why these people are lolcows. There are plenty of people who hold far left and far right opinions but who are otherwise well adjusted, have lives, families, and don't fuck up their lives over their political sperging. Getting into huge tangents over SJWs in general or "all Republicans/Democrats/liberals/conservatives are lolcows" shit is a derail.

In this case, though, it is woke Marvel and the particular woke dude Mark Waid who has specifically and spectacularly imploded his career over his moonbattery that is inextricably intertwined with a particular strain of politics. It's not even the specific beliefs that are a problem. Practically nobody outside of the "alt-right" (whatever that is) thinks that a black guy, a lesbian, a transgender person, or whatever putting on a cape and saving people is a menace to society. Even D&C is very specific about saying "this specific comic sucks," not that anything even remotely like it sucks. He's even been conscientious about pointing out examples of such things he actually likes, and that have existed for literally decades in the industry.

So the issue isn't representation or even representation for its own sake, but the beliefs of SJWs, specifically Marvel SJWs, that being "woke" and "on the right side of history" justifies literally any tactics, no matter how horrendous.

What is actually funny about this, rather than merely infuriating, is the extent to which the specific topic of this thread, Mark Waid, has been willing to go full kamikaze and nuke his own career, while actually benefiting the target of his rage and being too stupid to understand exactly what he's doing. That's the hilarious part. That's where this whole thing starts to resemble a Road Runner episode.

I imagine Mark Waid thinking of himself as a Super Genius, rubbing his grubby cum-flaked hands together as he cooks up his nefarious schemes, orders something from Acme, and proceeds to self-immolate, and that's why I love this guy and this thread.

The thing is, somewhere along the way, you're going to have to deal with politics. I get it. Politics is unfunny and stupid. So is legal sperging. But you can't really get the comedy if you don't know the landscape.

 

[RodgerDodger]

I think one of the people I was waiting for already showed up - Ethan van Sciver. Having people with a long history in the industry and great body of work getting behind C&D. He's respected, he comes across as honest and without agenda and isn't a drama whore. I don't expect the likes of Brian Bendis to make a stand as he largely started the cancer but if names like Alex Ross, Geoff Johns or Ed Braubaker raised the issue then maybe the message would move beyond the niche level. Sadly until Marvels bottom line is severely hurt or any writer work a damn fucks off to the indys they are content to keep going in this direction.



Like @Zvantastika said it's a hill no one wants to go die on. Waids work has been without criticism. Champions started with positive press but critics soon started to change their tune and sales dropped yet no one really focused on the socjus side of things but choose to focus on inconsistent art and dependence on tie ins.
Marvel has received lots of push back on its new direction (nazi cap, gay iceman, secret empire in general) but the core issue always remains unaddressed.

I like Ethan, but he is just as deeply on the spectrum as everyone else in this little three ring circus of freaks. Heck at the rate his seemingly unstoppable “Rose Tico” obsession keeps growing he will himself be threadworthy soon enough.

As for the core issue, it’s that Marvel Comics will no longer pay for quality. So they end up with a steady parade of pink haired tumblrinas that willingly and happily seek status instead of compensation. Fleshed out by a handful of psychotic lunatics that nobody else in their right mind would ever hire. The problems at Marvel Arlen’t Caused by politucs. They are caused by Perlmutter obsessive penny pinching in the vein of a Dicken’s villain. The over the top non stop obsessive politics is the result or side effect of hiring these otherwise unhirable lowest common denominator autists.

 

[MMX]

I like Ethan, but he is just as deeply on the spectrum as everyone else in this little three ring circus of freaks. Heck at the rate his seemingly unstoppable “Rose Tico” obsession keeps growing he will himself be threadworthy soon enough.

Had to look up what you meant.
His hater boner for Rose is almost as strong as Waids devotion to her, it's near Dobson levels of rage.
Atleast he was worth having around to have the danger hairs scream about how he draws LITERAL space nazis only to be informed it's his job and he neither created nor wrote Sinestro.

 

[AnOminous]

Had to look up what you meant.
His hater boner for Rose is almost as strong as Waids devotion to her, it's near Dobson levels of rage.

It's funny how traits like this seem to cluster, so that people like Waid and EVS end up on opposite sides of both of them, even though they're seemingly unconnected.

 

[Jigglyjogglers]

Considering how it's obvious something's very cracked in Waid's head (wailing like a baby, smashing his phone on the ground) is he a diversity/disability hire?

I think this has more to do with his, and a lot of other peoples', perceptions of how a "true artist" behaves. They grow up with these tales of great names who have all these eccentricities attached to them, not realizing that those eccentricities were 1) probably magnified in the telling and likely different in context and 2) almost certainly frustrated and annoyed the shit out of all the real people that knew them. Instead they think these eccentricities are the mark of a great person, and either deliberately cultivate their own or just take the restraints off of themselves.

Basically so-called creative types like Waid take stuff like "Van Gogh was fucking crazy" as an excuse to do absolutely nothing to reign in their emotions and behave like spoiled children.

 

[MMX]

It's funny how traits like this seem to cluster, so that people like Waid and EVS end up on opposite sides of both of them, even though they're seemingly unconnected.

Just as for every C&D you have a proto linkara/Dobson insisting comics are still problematic and everything's being over sexualised.
Autistic ying to autistic yang

 

[RockVolnutt]

Just as for every C&D you have a proto linkara/Dobson insisting comics are still problematic and everything's being over sexualised.
Autistic ying to autistic yang

Most Dobsons don't actually read though and strangely brag about being "confused" because they're unwilling to ask people about good starting points. Linkara, sure, but nobody takes him seriously.

I think this has more to do with his, and a lot of other peoples', perceptions of how a "true artist" behaves. They grow up with these tales of great names who have all these eccentricities attached to them, not realizing that those eccentricities were 1) probably magnified in the telling and likely different in context and 2) almost certainly frustrated and annoyed the shit out of all the real people that knew them. Instead they think these eccentricities are the mark of a great person, and either deliberately cultivate their own or just take the restraints off of themselves.

Basically so-called creative types like Waid take stuff like "Van Gogh was fucking crazy" as an excuse to do absolutely nothing to reign in their emotions and behave like spoiled children.

You're probably right. Could also explain the "Only artists are allowed to criticize other artists" thing you see tossed around.

 

[AnOminous]

You're probably right. Could also explain the "Only artists are allowed to criticize other artists" thing you see tossed around.

This is one of the dumbest things ever, like claiming you have to be a chef to point out that there's a fly in your soup.

 

[Ponderous Pillock]

I think this has more to do with his, and a lot of other peoples', perceptions of how a "true artist" behaves. They grow up with these tales of great names who have all these eccentricities attached to them, not realizing that those eccentricities were 1) probably magnified in the telling and likely different in context and 2) almost certainly frustrated and annoyed the shit out of all the real people that knew them. Instead they think these eccentricities are the mark of a great person, and either deliberately cultivate their own or just take the restraints off of themselves.

Basically so-called creative types like Waid take stuff like "Van Gogh was fucking crazy" as an excuse to do absolutely nothing to reign in their emotions and behave like spoiled children.

I can see that, everyone wants to be the next Bohemian, yet doesn't realise that the Bohemians were a very specific time and place and a lot of the shit they pulled back then is no longer seen as particularly weird, so they have to keep pushing themselves further to be "quirky" and "different".

People like Waid seem rotten to the core though, creepily so. It's not even the emotional reigning in, or lack there of, it's the creepy as fuck shit like leaning on a competitor, or sending a fucking wreath, or even being revealed as so fucking useless that you were made to just turn up sometimes to consult on a story (and there's no hint how much shit he did went into the comic).

 

[Jigglyjogglers]

People like Waid seem rotten to the core though, creepily so. It's not even the emotional reigning in, or lack there of, it's the creepy as fuck shit like leaning on a competitor, or sending a fucking wreath, or even being revealed as so fucking useless that you were made to just turn up sometimes to consult on a story (and there's no hint how much shit he did went into the comic).

It happens a lot with fans-turned-pros. I talked about this in the Wil Wheaton thread, but what happens is that shallow people with no real idea of who they are come to look upon the creators of entertainment media as something akin to deities. It's one of the things they fill the spiritual void in their life with because they have nothing else that gives them fulfillment, nothing that they simply take joy in on its own merits. So when they get into the profession they once put on such a high pedestal, in their mind they've effectively ascended to Olympus and become one of the gods.

It's like the emotional equivalent of a poor person winning the lottery. They have no concept of how to handle having this (perceived) power, so they flaunt it, wallow in it, throw it around. So when one of these people is already a nasty little shit like Waid clearly is, was, and always has been, they now feel they're immune from consequences because they (feel that they) have power... power means they no longer have to fear consequences for something like spitting in someone's face for getting fired and simultaneously mocking their late spouse. Too often they're right... right up until they cross that line they thought no longer existed, like Waid finally seems to have done.

 

[GS 281]

Tbh he actually has some good points and I think it is healthy to have an occasional contrarian tell people to curb their irrational exuberance. I happen to think the latest turns of events offer a lot of hilarity even just with what's already happening and am the future is good.

It was dragging things off-topic and was more of a debate than a stream of funny, informative or salient commentary. I agree with the idea of people being contrarian being a good thing and don't think this was as bad as @KillThemCrackasBabies efforts in the comicsgate thread, but once you're responding several times on the same point and your posts gather size, its more an argument than a discussion about comedic content and frankly it chokes out the thread from interest when people are shotgunning their arguments back and forth for pages on end. A good rule of thumb is that after you drop 3 posts supporting your position, anything further is belaboring an issue and it is best taken to PMs or if you feel passionate about the core of the topic, just make a deep thoughts thread about it because these threads re for pages and pages of content discussion not argument.

But the only reason any of this happened is politics. Marvel is flopping hard because they put politics ahead of satisfying their customers. Mark Waid nuked his own career because he was sperging about politics

Not entirely true. This may sound like semantics, but I think this is the key to why Mark is a lolcow.

It isn't that he is sperging about politics, it is that he is sperging that makes him a lolcow. Politics is only the vehicle which took him there. It could have been anything. There are plenty of people who are passionate about politics that don't take it to the point that they are a mouth-frothing sperg. Perhaps I didn't articulate my point last night well enough, and if so I apologize, but I am not saying you cannot mention politics, what I meant was that his politics do not matter. Whether he is an SJW, Alt-Righter, LaRoushe follower, etc., people just want to see the funny. If discussion was centered all around him believing in equal right for trannies or whatever he believed, then no, that's dumb. But if it is about him losing his shit about small political issues, tossing cookies at other comic spergs about it, etc., then that's funny stuff.

 

[AnOminous]

A good rule of thumb is that after you drop 3 posts supporting your position, anything further is belaboring an issue and it is best taken to PMs or if you feel passionate about the core of the topic, just make a deep thoughts thread about it because these threads re for pages and pages of content discussion not argument.

I actually have exactly this as a personal rule, although it's that if I find myself responding to the same person more than twice, over the same point, the second time is when to drop it. I try to avoid the situation where two duelists completely shit up a thread by arguing at each other. Every time I break this personal rule, it turns into a mistake.