LGBTQiwis

[Vitrealis]

So for example, a trans female, born as a male

A trans identified male*

, recognizes that he is biologically a male, but amongst other things experiences gender dysphoria. This is the result of an extreme desire of being born as the opposite sex, and is not necessarily tied to what you've said, like self-hatred; it is of course dissatisfaction with reality (that's the whole point), and it's the reason why they'd rather live as how they would if they were born a female, and everything that goes along with it (like social expectations).

I completely disagree with the idea that the extreme desire to be the opposite sex isn't borne out of self-hatred (unless we're talking about autogynephilia), since you're rejecting who you are on an essential level. I would say the same of someone who gets plastic surgeries because they're not satisfied with their biology. I don't think it makes sense that you love yourself when you're modifying your face or your body in extreme ways.
This self-hatred can arise for different reasons, but it is self-hatred.

Now like you, I myself believe that I would have been happier if I was born as a female

In the present day? Myself, I no longer believe this. Why do you think so?

If someone was like me, and wanted to live their life like a female, I would see no problem, they would not be harming themselves in any way, and they would in fact pursue happiness to a greater degree.

It depends on what you mean by "living their life like a female". (what do you mean? can you give any specific examples?)

But merely claiming "I'm a woman" (without even getting into hormones and surgeries), while being a man, is already harmful for themselves. Because every single time they say this, it's an act of self-rejection. You live inside your body, there's no other way, and your body is male, you are male.
A transracial woman is also self-hating when she says "I'm white" if she's black or "I'm black" if she's white. No matter how much she tans or bleaches her skin, her ethnicity, her biology, will never change.

This can be applied to many other cases of delusion. I've had the displeasure of being very closely connected to women whose husbands treated them like shit, but they just wouldn't acknowledge it. They lived in a fantasy land where their partners could do no wrong. Any abuse would be excused and swept under the carpet. This can only happen when you don't think it's that big of a deal, when you think you may deserve such treatment. You could argue that they're happy, because they have an extreme desire to be with those men, but in the process of being with those men, they're pushing themselves aside, they're allowing to be disrespected and degraded.

That can never be an attitude that's the result of a healthy state of mind. They're living in an overlay, and I think the concept of an overlay can perfectly be applied to any individual who claims to be trans-anything.

We actually agree on a bunch of things, not all, but I am more lenient with certain ideologies when I recognize that such way of life would bring happiness to the person. I know trans women who are living happily (far more than a lot of Kiwifarmers on here, from what I've seen), more accomplished, and with a brighter future. Their way of life is not hurting them, on the contrary. Does this mean everyone is like this? No.

I think people should be free to do what they want with their lives, someone doing something out of their own free will is the only thing that can bring happiness, so unfortunately, I feel like lots of TIMs and TIFs have to go through the experience before being able to realize why it's wrong, we learn from our mistakes, after all. (I still think it's 100% unethical for doctors to facilitate fantasies and delusions while harming the bodies of their victims patients).

You can look happy and be accomplished while a part of you is being neglected. You can keep trauma buried for decades before it resurfaces with a vengeance.

On the ideology side of things, I have 0 leniency. I despise an ideology that teaches that you can be "born in the wrong body". Your body is your vessel in this lifetime and you couldn't have been born in any other body. It's an extremely harmful, dangerous and despicable idea, and I abhor it with a passion. I despise an ideology that's based on rancid sexist (for both sexes) and homophobic stereotypes that preys on people's self-hatred.

 

[We Are The Witches]

In the present day? Myself, I no longer believe this. Why do you think so?

Because of several main reasons, anywhere where I don't have to deal with Islam, but that would be regardless of sex.

First of all, I'd prefer to have such genetics (what I've already mentioned about genetic differences between men and women, in general), and because life in general seems easier and more rewarding. For example, when it comes to jobs, I already have many real instances where they outright discriminate men and say they only want women, even when it's not legal to do so (it's not for a role in a movie as Queen Elizabeth, or showing in a lipstick ad), but nobody has time or money to get in court for this.

You get many more advantages by society, example: I was about to do like an internship, and the process of becoming an employee there afterwards involves the company to be compensated in some form to a greater degree if the subject is female. I'm not going into the specific laws to not powerlevel, but it is incentivized to hire females in such instances. No one here will turn me down for being a female requesting a job unless it's for destroying my back moving heavy furniture, but I will be turned down in fucking retail, selling, telemarketing, advertising, hospitality industry, care for the elder/kids, waiteress/waiter jobs, etc if I'm a male (or they outright request women from the get-go), and don't tell me it's not real, because I know. Go ahead and justify to me why should I be a woman in order to sell ice-cream (real example), you cannot; that shit is accepted but the reverse would be outrageous, and no, not everyone is in the mood for suing and wasting time and money in court.

Female hardships are taken more seriously, not only as a society but also legally. Specially when it comes to harassment, sexual assault, domestic violence, etc, sometimes it's a fucking joke, example: I know a case where a man saved a woman's life through CPR, and he got sued by this woman for sexual assault, she won. This was taught to me and the rest of students by our female teacher who was responsible of teaching us security at work, and some other things. And some other bullshit things about preference towards women, the reverse is never the case.

Women generally getting softer sentences in some instance; I also have a close relative dealing with domestic violence bullshit at court (as a worker), so I get very real life experiences, not seen or known in social media and the whole circus with the same clowns. It's not that you'd want to be a female to get away with wrongdoings, is that the law may not fully protect you if you're dealing with one, if you're male. Some retards don't want to acknowledge, but they don't know anything.

Financial help for abused women (but not men) and mandatory classes (wasted time) on how women deserve financial advantages because there are bad men out there. One of the jobs I had hired a woman (who didn't know anything about the job), with 2 more guys on the side, who knew more, but she was hired to "increase diversity". Next job I had, >90% women, no men was hired for increasing diversity.

Those are some real life examples' advantages that retards on here and Reddit would insult with sexist remarks, because they don't know shit.

I also prefer female fashion, but if you present yourself as a male in here in a dress adn lipstick on for the average job interview, I assure you your chances will drop like a brick. I like things that are generally catered towards females, and specially when younger (in school, highschool), leaning towards that as a male would have entailed having to physically defend myself against a horde of retards more physically developed (until highschool), and the girls would not have been better, they're also prejudicial as hell, so they'd try and add insult to literal injury. I know this because of the environments (plural) I was raised in.

Grass is always greener on the other side, or so they say, but in this case, the advantages are far greater than disadvantages. The only thing you can bring as a "negative" is having the period (what a joke), which is nothing, as I've endured abuse, cuts, and lots of scalding water when I was weak (all perpetrators of major emotional abuse are now dead), and that I assure you would have not happened if I was born a girl.

 

[Vitrealis]

This further cements my belief that most trans identified individuals aren't going for something as much as they're running away from something.
I don't like injustices either, so I completely understand your dislike of "inclusivity" and "diversity" policies. They're retarded.

No one here will turn me down for being a female requesting a job unless it's for destroying my back moving heavy furniture, but I will be turned down in fucking retail, selling, telemarketing, advertising, hospitality industry, care for the elder/kids, waiteress/waiter jobs, etc if I'm a male

Is that really the case? The way you put it you'd think that there would only be women working, but, at least in the part of the world I live in, there are plenty of men in all those sectors. I think it's perfectly understandable to only want women in childcare, as most child predators turn out to be male, and plenty of them seek out jobs where they have easy access to children.

If you're having difficulty securing a job because you're a man, I completely understand your frustration and I'm sorry that you're going through that. It sucks.

Female hardships are taken more seriously, not only as a society but also legally. Specially when it comes to harassment, sexual assault, domestic violence, etc, sometimes it's a fucking joke, example: I know a case where a man saved a woman's life through CPR, and he got sued by this woman for sexual assault, she won. This was taught to me and the rest of students by our female teacher who was responsible of teaching us security at work, and some other things. And some other bullshit things about preference towards women, the reverse is never the case.

This might be the case in these instances, but even in these areas, it's not always true. I also know a couple of real life cases of unjust preferential treatment towards women, but that doesn't make it the rule. Yes it happens, and I wish it didn't. But sometimes women also get treated unfairly and I also know some real life cases of this.

In my opinion, even if it were the case that you could benefit from some of these things as a woman, if you could press a button that'd magically make it so you had been born female instead of male, you'd be accepting defeat as a man and taking the easy way out. If these things happen we should seek ways to fix them, not go against our own selves in order to adapt to an unfair status quo. (Not saying this is you, just what I think about this hypothetical).

Life isn't always easy, I'm sure a lot of the male athletes who decided to troon out did so because they found that competing against men was too hard. They took what they thought would be the easy way out, but they're now meeting a lot of resistance and they might have trooned for nothing, losing their chances in sports as well as respect from most people, simultaneously.

If you magically became a biological women, I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but menstruating wouldn't be the only hardship you'd come across. When you haven't lived as a woman it's very easy to romanticise the idea of being a woman.

Spoiler: related

I think anyone thinking life would be easier as the opposite sex may benefit from watching these with an open mind:

The same is often the case for TIFs, their perception of what being a man entails is very different from actual reality. What often happens when either TIFs or TIMs "transition" is that they get preferential treatment for being "trans", but that doesn't mean they're getting the advantages of "being male" or "being female", of whatever sex they're supposedly "transitioning" into. But this might create the illusion in their minds that their life is now easier as the opposite sex and that now everything's better for them (even though they're constantly bombarded with how very hard life is for them, and how very oppressed they are). In reality, most people perceive them as untouchables socially and feel the need to walk on eggshells around them, but this may be mistaken for a new sense of respect from others and a renewed sense of safety.

I also prefer female fashion, but if you present yourself as a male in here in a dress adn lipstick on for the average job interview, I assure you your chances will drop like a brick.

If you think that's the case, you can always dress more stereotipically "masculine" to said job interviews and dress however you like the rest of the time.

I like things that are generally catered towards females, and specially when younger (in school, highschool), leaning towards that as a male would have entailed having to physically defend myself against a horde of retards more physically developed (until highschool), and the girls would not have been better, they're also prejudicial as hell, so they'd try and add insult to literal injury. I know this because of the environments (plural) I was raised in.

I know this is painful because I was also shamed for liking "girl things" as a child growing up. But the good news is that now we can do whatever we want and nobody gives a damn. It can be hard because you might have unresolved trauma from childhood, but that is solved by therapy, not by daydreaming about how life would have been so much easier as a woman. You don't know how life would have been as a girl because you haven't lived through it, but you might have gone through equally painful experiences.

Grass is always greener on the other side, or so they say, but in this case, the advantages are far greater than disadvantages. The only thing you can bring as a "negative" is having the period (what a joke), which is nothing, as I've endured abuse, cuts, and lots of scalding water when I was weak (all perpetrators of major emotional abuse are now dead), and that I assure you would have not happened if I was born a girl.

You don't know that. There are many girls who also get bullied, for many different reasons. I'm very sorry you went through those experiences though, that sucks, no child should ever have to go through something like that. It must have been awful.

 

[We Are The Witches]

This further cements my belief that most trans identified individuals aren't going for something as much as they're running away from something.

It can be both, if you are going for something it also means you might be running away from something else.

Is that really the case?

Yes it is. I literally just told you examples where men are discriminated for basic things such as retail. Can you be in retail as a man? Of course, but there are instances where women are clearly privileged, when it's not the case for men. No one is turning me down for retail, as a waitress, telemarketing, selling, etc as a female, but they will (and have) if I'm a male, because as said they outright demand women. And that is a toxic aspect of society, because it's also accepted.

I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but menstruating wouldn't be the only hardship you'd come across. When you haven't lived as a woman it's very easy to romanticise the idea of being a woman.

You're being very polite with me, so I do not wish to antagonize you, but really, I'll tell you to politely fuck off with those videos, I started watching one, and she is talking about fearing for your life as a woman vs a man, and men supposedly not raising their hands. I stopped watching, and I won't continue.

That is complete bullshit, maybe the one who should open her eyes is her. I am several times more likely to get robbed on the street as a male (and stabbed), than anything a female would face around here.

I've already had to deal with multiple malicious attackers on the street (they're never alone), as opposed to nearly all women I know IRL, who have never faced anything remotely similar. Luckily they didn't manage to steal from me at that time, well, now I am a bit more cynical & pissed off at scumbags, so the next one will have to eat their own teeth even if it costs me a deadly situation.

Also, toxic chivarly here is a thing, me getting stabbed to death is not nearly as important by society as a random woman getting inappropriately touched.

If you think that's the case, you can always dress more stereotipically "masculine" to said job interviews and dress however you like the rest of the time.

That's not just the only problem, the rest of the time is being outside as such and seeing someone you know IRL, it's that it's not accepted in the first place, so doing any of that is like a ticking bomb and a bandaid trying to mitigate a beheading.

You don't know how life would have been as a girl because you haven't lived through it, but you might have gone through equally painful experiences.

I know obvious consequence from causality. Sure, maybe if I was a girl I would have been ran over by a car given all paths I'd have taken from life, but chances are I would have lived far more happier as one, and I for sure know I would have not faced the same level of violence, abuse, and dismissal. On a base level, it would have been an easier and more advantageous life, apart from living how I would want to.

There are many girls who also get bullied, for many different reasons.

It's not like I'm new to life, we can say that for everyone. But in my world, how and where I was raised, apathy towards women is to a lesser degree by everyone, than towards men.

It seems like my life as male is less valuable to everyone, my problems are not taken seriously, toxic spaces always paint men as violent yet weak yet privileged, when it's not the case. And of course, the opposite for females, that is one of the many reasons why I think society is toxic as hell, because humans are not logical and unbiased. They're filled with prejudice, fucking apathy and general maliciousness, and that is reflected in the law, treatment of each other and how things work. You should know this better than most people in here, that a lot of humans are incapable of empathy when it goes against their disgusting desires.

But I'm not a defeatist, even while being born as this I can try to achieve happiness. Would have been far easier as the opposite sex (the whole point of this conversation), but I am proud of my values, what I am, and how I am; probably someone else in my situation and the emotional difficulties I faced (I was a very weak kid, physically and specially emotionally) would have suicided by now, or resorted to drugs, but I never had, and my diligence remains ironclad.

 

[LeChampion1992]

I'm probably going to get hate but honestly I'm thinking of taking the HRT plunge, and yes I am more attracted to guys and hate being masculine. But at the end of the day its my choice and im not gong to have kids I'm tired of having to put on a facade to be me.
That being said what would make me want to detransition isn't the Alt right chuds spamming YWNBAW!!!
If anything its the crazed "OMG drumpflr and nick Fuentes nazis are going to murder us on the street guise we must support antifa and brain maga people!!!" The mild transphobic jokes here don't bother me most of the people making them don't have new material.
But fuck keffels, fuck the groomers trying to take down the farms, fuck mark levin, and fuck the reddit faggots who spin unrealistic we're all gonna die hysterical stories.

@We Are The Witches I dunno where you are on your journey but I wish you luck. Im just happy with being myself. And want to take the hrt plunge soon, I know the risks and dont want a family to any kiwis who feel like they need to save me. (Also im not doing bottom surgery.)

 

[gagabobo1997]

I'm probably going to get hate but honestly I'm thinking of taking the HRT plunge, and yes I am more attracted to guys and hate being masculine. But at the end of the day its my choice and im not gong to have kids I'm tired of having to put on a facade to be me.
That being said what would make me want to detransition isn't the Alt right chuds spamming YWNBAW!!!
If anything its the crazed "OMG drumpflr and nick Fuentes nazis are going to murder us on the street guise we must support antifa and brain maga people!!!" The mild transphobic jokes here don't bother me most of the people making them don't have new material.
But fuck keffels, fuck the groomers trying to take down the farms, fuck mark levin, and fuck the reddit faggots who spin unrealistic we're all gonna die hysterical stories.

@We Are The Witches I dunno where you are on your journey but I wish you luck. Im just happy with being myself. And want to take the hrt plunge soon, I know the risks and dont want a family to any kiwis who feel like they need to save me. (Also im not doing bottom surgery.)

if you are a cute twink then i'd say go for it but otherwise it's not gonna work out bro

 

[LeChampion1992]

if you are a cute twink then i'd say go for it but otherwise it's not gonna work out bro

I feel what you're saying thankfully I dont want to be a Trans fat lol.

 

[gagabobo1997]

I feel what you're saying thankfully I dont want to be a Trans fat lol.

It's very difficult to be an attractive tranny. If you are already a feminine man it may be possible but it's not so simple if you are particularly masculine.
It is your life of course, but I think you would be better off accepting yourself as you are than trying to chase something you aren't. The vast majority of gay men like normal men so you'd be restricting your potential pool of partners too. Trooning out won't make you a women that straight men want to fuck, it'll make you a tranny that chasers and some gay/bi men want to fuck.

Do you think it's a case of AGP? Or do you really feel like your attraction towards men warrants attempting to become a women because you think that would help you get with men?

 

[LeChampion1992]

It's very difficult to be an attractive tranny. If you are already a feminine man it may be possible but it's not so simple if you are particularly masculine.
It is your life of course, but I think you would be better off accepting yourself as you are than trying to chase something you aren't. The vast majority of gay men like normal men so you'd be restricting your potential pool of partners too. Trooning out won't make you a women that straight men want to fuck, it'll make you a tranny that chasers and some gay/bi men want to fuck.

Do you think it's a case of AGP? Or do you really feel like your attraction towards men warrants attempting to become a women because you think that would help you get with men?

Honestly man I kinda want to be with a Trans girl and I have always felt feminine. For years I forced myself to be a "normal dude have kids" but ive realized not this life or time.
As for me I'm somewhat feminine already and basically packed on weight to more or less boymode. Honestly I am saying this im still a man legally, I just want to take hrt and get facial feminization surgery. Yeah I don't expect to be that but its my body and im happy with it.

 

[gagabobo1997]

Honestly man I kinda want to be with a Trans girl and I have always felt feminine. For years I forced myself to be a "normal dude have kids" but ive realized not this life or time.
As for me I'm somewhat feminine already and basically packed on weight to more or less boymode. Honestly I am saying this im still a man legally, I just want to take hrt and get facial feminization surgery. Yeah I don't expect to be that but its my body and im happy with it.

Best of luck to you then.

 

[Hellbound Hellhound]

I've known I was bi since I started puberty, but recently, I've been slowly coming to the realization that I have no romantic interest in the opposite sex. I am definitely sexually attracted to women (I'm a guy), but I have never felt a romantic spark with one, and truthfully, I can't imagine myself ever developing one. Could this be a consequence of the feeling that I have little to nothing in common with most women, or is it perhaps the symptom of something much deeper?

I'm not an especially romantic person to begin with, and don't develop emotional attachments easily, so it probably shouldn't be surprising that it's taken me so long to confront this, but I'm still unsure about how to process it. Does this mean I am gay? Has anyone else here gone through a similar thought process?

 

[Ghostface Killah]

Not gonna lie, y'all are still weird as fuck. Wack ass motherfuckers.

 

[Otis Boi]

I've known I was bi since I started puberty, but recently, I've been slowly coming to the realization that I have no romantic interest in the opposite sex. I am definitely sexually attracted to women (I'm a guy), but I have never felt a romantic spark with one, and truthfully, I can't imagine myself ever developing one. Could this be a consequence of the feeling that I have little to nothing in common with most women, or is it perhaps the symptom of something much deeper?

I'm not an especially romantic person to begin with, and don't develop emotional attachments easily, so it probably shouldn't be surprising that it's taken me so long to confront this, but I'm still unsure about how to process it. Does this mean I am gay? Has anyone else here gone through a similar thought process?

I dont think it something really deep. Can you form emotional/romantic connections with men? I am kind of similar to you where I find wemon attractive but being in a relationship feels like work. As for men I have always enjoyed it and find it easy to do.

 

[Hellbound Hellhound]

I dont think it something really deep. Can you form emotional/romantic connections with men? I am kind of similar to you where I find wemon attractive but being in a relationship feels like work. As for men I have always enjoyed it and find it easy to do.

It's difficult for me to say, because I don't form these sorts of emotional attachments easily, and when I do, they tend to be quite fleeting. I have definitely developed emotional/romantic feelings for men in the past, but I would say that only rarely have these feelings ever been actualized towards a specific person. Usually, it manifests more as a pining for a hypothetical person, and whenever I allow myself to fantasize about who this person might be, I almost always imagine them as male.

I think it could simply be that I emotionally relate to other men more, because when it comes to the purely physical side of sexual attraction, I'm pretty much 50/50.

 

[Otis Boi]

It's difficult for me to say, because I don't form these sorts of emotional attachments easily, and when I do, they tend to be quite fleeting. I have definitely developed emotional/romantic feelings for men in the past, but I would say that only rarely have these feelings ever been actualized towards a specific person. Usually, it manifests more as a pining for a hypothetical person, and whenever I allow myself to fantasize about who this person might be, I almost always imagine them as male.

I think it could simply be that I emotionally relate to other men more, because when it comes to the purely physical side of sexual attraction, I'm pretty much 50/50.

Maybe you are just the inverse of "I have sex with men and relationships with wemon" meme. Honestly nothing wrong with that. Being happy and a good person is all one can hope for in life.

 

[mister meaner]

However as far as ideology, I think people in here hold more malice towards trans women than trans men, and put everyone in the same basket, and so they believe that these trans females are all bad & horrible people.

In the real world transphobia towards trans men is infantilising, while transphobia against trans women is usually more violent and offensive. They see the former as misled women, and the latter as depraved perverts

 

[a-Lager]

If God did not want faggots then why did he give men a bundle of pleasure spindles in their ass and made dicks the most aesthetic genitals?
Checkmate 'theists

 

[Ewan McGregor]

If God did not want faggots then why did he give men a bundle of pleasure spindles in their ass and made dicks the most aesthetic genitals?
Checkmate 'theists

Our ancestors worshipped cocks and big muscles.

RETVRN

 

[mister meaner]

If God did not want faggots then why did he give men a bundle of pleasure spindles in their ass and made dicks the most aesthetic genitals?
Checkmate 'theists

If god didn’t want faggots then why did he make me unafraid to use my penis if necessary

 

[gagabobo1997]

Has anyone used those at-home STI tests? How good are they?