💊 Manosphere Jordan Peterson - Internet Daddy Simulator, Post-modern Anti-postmodernist, Canadian Psychology Professor, Depressed, Got Hooked on Benzos

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The thing about JBP is whether or not you agree with things he says, his message of "take care of yourself, be diligent and find meaning in life" obviously resonated with a lot of people. And something is quite wrong with society, because not only these things have to be told by a public intellectual, but it's enough for people to see him as an either greatest philosopher of our time or an evil nazi cult leader.
 
And its not like we don't have 50 other gurus essentially saying same thing. Why did his message stick? Was it entirely due to his anti-SJW hype?
 
And its not like we don't have 50 other gurus essentially saying same thing. Why did his message stick? Was it entirely due to his anti-SJW hype?

Well, he does have some credentials ... So he's more "legit" than your average angry YouTubing pandhandler to a lot of people.

He also expressed his opinions with a calm and collected demeanor.

Personally, I can see why people have been looking up to him for these past few years.
 
Do we know anything at all about his son or wife? I'm curious about them because it would provide insight into how much he gets high on his own supply (philosophy, not benzos) vs is just a sleazy used car salesman, and given his history as a clinician the distinction is especially interesting.

And its not like we don't have 50 other gurus essentially saying same thing. Why did his message stick? Was it entirely due to his anti-SJW hype?
It probably helped that he had already been advocating self help guru views on a smaller scale as a professor and practitioner, long before he got big, and that in general he's been very good at not falling for the usual tricks used to destroy people they don't like. He found fame later in his career, when he had already learned how to handle himself in front of a camera, an audience, etc, and written one book. Jung sounds really deep and profound if you've never seen it before and don't think too hard about it (Star Wars is pretty popular...), and repackaging it along with the internet daddy simulator shtick really was quite clever*.

What fascinates me is the sheer hatred he inspires from those who have been told to hate him when his main product is generic self help sourced from reheated Jung. Random people in my life will bring him up as that awful Nazi cult leader surprisingly often, and that's all they know about him. I know he slips in enough stuff about women bad or commies bad or whatever, but the typical person googling him is just going to see lobsters and clean your room memes vs all these takedown attempts in psychologytoday or whatever, and get a little clownpilled from all the screeching about Nazis and what looks like a coordinated attempt to destroy someone who seems harmless. I suspect this was a big factor in his success. In particular, the pronouns thing he got big on is now years old, so continuing to bring it up like it was yesterday to try to destroy him isn't going to get much traction outside the true believer set.

I thought he was ridiculous even before I knew he sounded like Kermit, but I also enjoy the helpless floundering of his enemies, and respect that he seems to be legitimately helping people. Needing to be told to wash your penis and clean your room is sad, but not doing it is sadder still. His fate is unfortunate, but I'm glad it was his own hubris that destroyed him rather than yet another scalp taken by the screeching mob. Assuming he's actually gone, that is.

TL;DR I think his success is dependent on the anti-SJW thing, but he exploited it well, and has fed on it since. It's like he's renting out living space in his enemies' heads and collecting a tidy profit doing it.

* The Mythopoetic Men's Movement may be of interest to some here as a related phenomenon. They're still around here and there, but less of a footprint in the public consciousness than in the 80s.

I genuinely thought Peterson was going to transition.
I don't find his equivocation on religion that funny due to Jung, which unlike postmodernism or Marx he actually seems to understand. My personal theory is that either it's a habit he picked up during clinical practice as an atheist who believed faith was good for his patients, or he's more of of a deist/believes it in a mythological sense. Watching him squirm and ask people to "define transition" after having undergone one would be even better than watching him be eaten by the Dragon of Arrogance while he thinks he's fighting the Dragon of Addiction.
 
To be fair, a lot of Canadians don't know our immigration laws. They think immigration into Canada is a slice of pie and that we are colour blind/culturally mosaic. They have not a clue. Africans are deliberately kept out of Canada, I could link some articles talking about ''how'' but basically it comes down to wait listing their application and telling them they're not educated/skilled/financially stable enough to come to Canada. The preference for many years has been wealthy mainland Chinese.

Canada does not admit only 'skilled' immigrants. I don't know where you live or what sector of the economy you work in, but out west virtually entire sectors are dominated by a largely brown and unskilled workforce. Trucking and logistics, for instance. I see this every day in my work for my union. As a consequence, wages, health, and safety have gone into the shitter, and unions are weaker than ever. Many of these immigrants are brought in under the auspices of chain migration; one of them gets in, and suddenly every distant cousin or family friend gets in, too. Some are TFWs brought in despite/because of persistently high unemployment and low wages locally. That's why they're here: to depress wages, undermine unions, and enlarge the reserve army of labour (e.g. unemployed). They have nothing to offer most of us.

I always get a good laugh when someone suggests Canada's immigration is skills based. We admit more per capita than the States ffs.
 
he has a new grandchild. i wonder if he knows?

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My prediction is that JP is going to retire from public life. His only interaction with people via social media is going to be done in service of transferring credibility to his daughter and doing what he can to cement her future as some kind of life style and health advice guru. I don't think this will be the result of any sort of masterful plan of his....unfortunate daughter, rather a decision made by him.
 
My prediction is that JP is going to retire from public life. His only interaction with people via social media is going to be done in service of transferring credibility to his daughter and doing what he can to cement her future as some kind of life style and health advice guru. I don't think this will be the result of any sort of masterful plan of his....unfortunate daughter, rather a decision made by him.

He should have continued to teach at U of T until retirement as he would have had an excellent pension. Doing all of this literally ruined his life and caused him to lose his job. He can never go back to teaching again because of the anti-trans comments. After this huge break down and medically induced coma I doubt he'll be able to make much as a self help guru anymore. He's pretty much done.
 
The thing about JBP is whether or not you agree with things he says, his message of "take care of yourself, be diligent and find meaning in life" obviously resonated with a lot of people. And something is quite wrong with society, because not only these things have to be told by a public intellectual, but it's enough for people to see him as an either greatest philosopher of our time or an evil nazi cult leader.

The problem with this advice is that it will resonate in meaningful way mostly with people who already apply it in their own lives. Everyone else might just think that he is going to apply it, but it will end like any other futile attempt to stop being a loser. If only it was so simple as having an Internet Daddy to tell you how to live your life...

Back to his medical issues. What was really off-putting before he gave himself brain damage, was the story about insomnia after apple cider vinegar. I was thinking about it recently, and while I am a bit younger than JBP, I don't remember at any point in my life having a strong emotional reaction to any food. I had some sugar crashes after overloading on carbs, but it wasn't an emotional reaction, but rather a temporary weakness. This story sounded to me like hysterical exaggeration, or a florid way of speaking at best.
 
To be fair, a lot of Canadians don't know our immigration laws. They think immigration into Canada is a slice of pie and that we are colour blind/culturally mosaic. They have not a clue. Africans are deliberately kept out of Canada, I could link some articles talking about ''how'' but basically it comes down to wait listing their application and telling them they're not educated/skilled/financially stable enough to come to Canada. The preference for many years has been wealthy mainland Chinese.

Yeah well we traded up for the Chinese and while we get to enjoy way less rape and violence, we get to enjoy foreign government subversion and ethnic enclaves where they still smell like shit and eat bats they just threw at the wall. Oh and also literally everyone in charge of anything in the Federal government is apparently Indian, who are basically Africans except they're clever enough to incessantly sexually harass instead of rape.

He should have continued to teach at U of T until retirement as he would have had an excellent pension. Doing all of this literally ruined his life and caused him to lose his job.

Doing this made him a world-famous multi-millionaire, you think having a teacher's pension is comparable to getting like 50K/month on Patreon for like 3 years straight? Not including the royalties from 12 Rules For Life, that tour where tickets were $80-$100 each, that Self Authoring Suite, and everything else? He could pronbably re-open his private practice if he wanted to and coast on that. That's why I think he'll either retire, or take a break until he comes out with another book. He was talking about a sequel to 12RFL but I think his days as a self-help speaker are over.
He could, however, go back to talking about gender dynamics and mythology and all the stuff that made him famous to begin with. That stuff was always way more interesting anyway. That's where that huge debate with movie-obsessed NEET Slavoj Zizek could have been great.
 
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Doing this made him a world-famous multi-millionaire, you think having a teacher's pension is comparable to getting like 50K/month on Patreon for like 3 years straight? Not including the royalties from 12 Rules For Life, that tour where tickets were $80-$100 each, that Self Authoring Suite, and everything else? He could pronbably re-open his private practice if he wanted to and coast on that. That's why I think he'll either retire, or take a break until he comes out with another book. He was talking about a sequel to 12RFL but I think his days as a self-help speaker are over.
He could, however, go back to talking about gender dynamics and mythology and all the stuff that made him famous to begin with. That stuff was always way more interesting anyway. That's where that huge debate with movie-obsessed NEET Slavoj Zizek could have been great.

If he just had a teacher's pension he would have been able to live a comfortable life and not burn out and wind up a vegetable.

Oh, yes, and now that I think about it, Zizek was always going to wipe the floor with Peterson. A man who only reads the Communist Manifesto to prepare for his debate (and not, say, any of the man you're debating's works) is not a man who takes this seriously, and that's why Zizek won.
 
My prediction is that JP is going to retire from public life. His only interaction with people via social media is going to be done in service of transferring credibility to his daughter and doing what he can to cement her future as some kind of life style and health advice guru. I don't think this will be the result of any sort of masterful plan of his....unfortunate daughter, rather a decision made by him.
Mikhaila isn't appealing enough to make a big splash as a health guru on her own, without her dad routinely shilling for her--she's not all that attractive, her personality is shit, and despite watching her own father's experience with the spotlight, she's learned nothing from it and makes an ass of herself online. Thirsty guys might think about how they'd bang her, but that's not a high bar. Women (who are by far the biggest spenders when it comes to health/nutrition info, products, and services) are going to be turned off by her. She's not likeable, doesn't seem to care that she's not, and she's only going to be relatable to people just like her, who manage to solve intractable autoimmune disorders through a carnivore diet. And how far can she take that, really? Her core message ("just eat meat, and only meat") is too simple to build on.

I try to be somewhat sympathetic toward her because I know her childhood and adolescence were spent battling a painful, chronic condition with no end in sight; you don't have joint replacement surgery as a teenager unless your shit's really fucked up, and there's no way that didn't mess with her head, too. But the fact remains that she comes across as really fucking unpleasant, and even kind of dodgy and underhanded--she pings my distrust radar pretty hard, and I can't be the only one.

As for Peterson himself, I can't recall where I heard it, but Dave Rubin, his sidekick on the big world tour, says he's been in communication with Peterson, and that he's still recovering but doing well. No details, and no assurances that he's getting back to work, but it's something. Whether he'll ever fully come back, however, remains to be seen.
 
If he just had a teacher's pension he would have been able to live a comfortable life and not burn out and wind up a vegetable.

Oh, yes, and now that I think about it, Zizek was always going to wipe the floor with Peterson. A man who only reads the Communist Manifesto to prepare for his debate (and not, say, any of the man you're debating's works) is not a man who takes this seriously, and that's why Zizek won.

I'm not trying to play the bank account game but he can live a comfortable life right now, as I said he is a multi-millionaire. He is the Jerry Seinfeld of internet debates, he can effectively be retired at any moment. There's enough to take apart without believing he is somehow destitute, that's r etarded.

The problem with the debate was Zizek didn't mop the floor with anyone. Neither of them did. Zizek got up there and essentially gave an unrelated talk and if I remember correctly he established immediately at the start that he had no interest in a Communism Vs. Capitalism debate. Peterson wanted to but came ill prepared, Zizek had no interest and went off on some other shit, and the whole thing was just ships in the night and nobody who saw it was able to declare a winner. If you legitimately think Zizek or anybody won you're letting your hate boner obscure your vision.
 
Kind of a random thought but Jordan probably did some diagnostic work as a psychologist at one point. Unless he was privately operating (selectively dealing with patients who could pay out of pocket) he would be mandated by OHIP to diagnose and treat some pretty severely mentally ill people. It's interesting how a psychologist of all people was getting into political debates promoting unfettered capitalism. Jordan knows his patients are f*cked by this type of system, so what gives?

There are Schizophrenic's eating out of garbage cans and sleeping in bins in Canada (as with many other countries). The system has really let these people down. Does he even give a fuck about anyone? many people in his profession are horrified about how many mentally ill people are in prisons and on the street and all his bottom line mentality was is ''Let's not tax the rich. Pull up your pants''.

Edit: Also when Jordan was teaching at Ryerson University he refused to give students with learning disabilities any accommodations for an exam. He wanted ''equal treatment'' for them. This is yet another card he could only play here in Canada, if tried to pull that shit in the U.S he would have been blocked by ADA laws.
 
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Canada does not admit only 'skilled' immigrants. I don't know where you live or what sector of the economy you work in, but out west virtually entire sectors are dominated by a largely brown and unskilled workforce. Trucking and logistics, for instance. I see this every day in my work for my union. As a consequence, wages, health, and safety have gone into the shitter, and unions are weaker than ever. Many of these immigrants are brought in under the auspices of chain migration; one of them gets in, and suddenly every distant cousin or family friend gets in, too. Some are TFWs brought in despite/because of persistently high unemployment and low wages locally. That's why they're here: to depress wages, undermine unions, and enlarge the reserve army of labour (e.g. unemployed). They have nothing to offer most of us.

I always get a good laugh when someone suggests Canada's immigration is skills based. We admit more per capita than the States ffs.
I remember back when Obama was president Canada accepted like 5x the amount of Syrian migrants the US did despite having 1/10th of our population lol
 
There are Schizophrenic's eating out of garbage cans and sleeping in bins in Canada (as with many other countries). The system has really let these people down. Does he even give a fuck about anyone? many people in his profession are horrified about how many mentally ill people are in prisons and on the street and all his bottom line mentality was is ''Let's not tax the rich. Pull up your pants''.
Choose one of the following:
  • Clinically insane people should be institutionalized, because they wouldn't be left roaming the streets, eating garbage, never having access to necessary medical treatment
  • Clinically insane people should never be institutionalized, because insane asylums and similar mental institutions are always cruel, uncaring places where patients are left to rot
  • Clinically insane people should be released to their families, and given professional care and treatment, all paid by the state, plus their legal guardian, because they're going to be out of a job
There's just no perfect solution, or even one that works for each and every case.
 
Choose one of the following:
  • Clinically insane people should be institutionalized, because they wouldn't be left roaming the streets, eating garbage, never having access to necessary medical treatment
  • Clinically insane people should never be institutionalized, because insane asylums and similar mental institutions are always cruel, uncaring places where patients are left to rot
  • Clinically insane people should be released to their families, and given professional care and treatment, all paid by the state, plus their legal guardian, because they're going to be out of a job
There's just no perfect solution, or even one that works for each and every case.

Yeah but post Stephen Harper (former conservative Canadian Prime Minister) there's a lot more of these people out on the street. Doing ''nothing'' doesn't solve this problem.
 
I always get a good laugh when someone suggests Canada's immigration is skills based. We admit more per capita than the States ffs.
It depends on what you consider skilled I guess, but the majority of arab immigrants where I grew up ended up working the trades or running their own construction companies. Mind you that was years ago and I can't comment on what things are like now.

People far smarter than me have said this before, but the problem with the immigration system in Canada is that while we are lacking in some job sectors that we desperately need more people in (healthcare being the big one) due to regulations immigrants can't work in said fields due to the fact that they don't have a Canadian education.

I remember seeing a story on the news about a Syrian refugee who was a fully licensed and experienced doctor, but he couldn't actually work as a doctor here without going back to university (which he couldn't afford to do because he had kids). So basically the everyday tax payer is paying for Trudeau to bring in refugees that are legally not allowed to give anything useful to the country even if they can.
 
Yeah but post Stephen Harper (former conservative Canadian Prime Minister) there's a lot more of these people out on the street. Doing ''nothing'' doesn't solve this problem.

But that's Peterson's position... on global warming, at least.
 
I don't know a ton about Peterson but I'm a bookfag and can probably shed some light on this

Russia was one of the few countries to retain it's religious identity during the enlightenment (even today it's still a very religious country despite communism and what-not) and this is heavily reflected in Russian literature from the period. Particularly Dostoyevsky. Humanitarian belief was widely accepted by Russia's intellectual elite but far differently than the rest of Europe-Christianity and Christian values were not heavily criticized or attacked, but instead embraced.
Getting a bit ot here but Russia does is pretty irreligious even today. The Russian orthodox church is powerful because they play a large role in politics
 
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