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Western decadence has wrought nothing good to the world, compare only the peaks of America and Europe with the peaks of Saudi Arabia and the MENA and you can see immediately which culture is superior, infidel scum

LOL, Saudi Arabia has only existed since the 30's. They are "Western decadence."

And the problem is less the West than modernity in general. All modernities are rotten.

by western standards I'm firmly right- anyone right of me is straying towards a brown shirt.

I'm fall into the Rene Guenon/Julius Evola area of the right wing spectrum.
 
PS you are saying a whole bunch of bullshit about Hanafi school not condemning homosexuals to death after repeated offenses

The story of Abu Bakr Al-Siddiq when Khalid Ibn Al-Waleed wrote to him on this matter is famous and can be referenced in many sources. [The story referred to above goes as follows: "In his book Fat-h al-Qadir, the famous Hanafi scholar, Ibn al-Humam states “Al-Bayhaqi reported in his book Shu`ab al-Iman on the authority of Abu ad-Dunya that Abd al-`Aziz ibn Abi Hazim related from Dawud ibn Bakr who related from Muhammad ibn al-Mukadir the following: “Khalid Ibn al-Walid wrote to Abu Bakr [seeking the legal ruling] concerning a man with whom another man had sexual intercourse. Thereupon, Abu Bakr gathered the Companions of the Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, and sought their opinion.

`Ali, may Allah be pleased with him, was the strictest of all, saying, 'Only one nation disobeyed Allah by committing such sin and you know how Allah dealt with them. I see that we should burn the man with fire.’ The Companions unanimously agreed on this.” This incident is also mentioned by al-Waqidi under the subject of apostasy at the end of the section on the apostasy of Bani Salim.]”


It was always seem that way and you're either trying to fool yourself or fool us if you say otherwise.

LOL, Saudi Arabia has only existed since the 30's. They are "Western decadence."

A Western muslim convert who thinks that Saudi Arabia is decadence and classifies himself as a fascist on top of approving the death of tons of people

We're so getting shut down and @Null is getting thrown in Guantanamo when he Allahu Akbars himself
 
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PS you are saying a whole bunch of bullshit about Hanafi school not condemning homosexuals to death after repeated offenses

The story of Abu Bakr Al-Siddiq when Khalid Ibn Al-Waleed wrote to him on this matter is famous and can be referenced in many sources. [The story referred to above goes as follows: "In his book Fat-h al-Qadir, the famous Hanafi scholar, Ibn al-Humam states “Al-Bayhaqi reported in his book Shu`ab al-Iman on the authority of Abu ad-Dunya that Abd al-`Aziz ibn Abi Hazim related from Dawud ibn Bakr who related from Muhammad ibn al-Mukadir the following: “Khalid Ibn al-Walid wrote to Abu Bakr [seeking the legal ruling] concerning a man with whom another man had sexual intercourse. Thereupon, Abu Bakr gathered the Companions of the Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, and sought their opinion.

`Ali, may Allah be pleased with him, was the strictest of all, saying, 'Only one nation disobeyed Allah by committing such sin and you know how Allah dealt with them. I see that we should burn the man with fire.’ The Companions unanimously agreed on this.” This incident is also mentioned by al-Waqidi under the subject of apostasy at the end of the section on the apostasy of Bani Salim.]”


It was always seem that way and you're either trying to fool yourself or fool us if you say otherwise.

1. It's cited from a Hanafi book, but al-Bayhaqi is a Shafi'i. Also, al-Waqidi's narrations are weak. Another problematic issue in this narration from a fiqh perspective is that Mawla 'Ali (karramallahu wajhu) is alleged to have prescibed fire as punishment, when the Prophet (sallallahu alayhi wa aalihi wa sallam) forbade punishment with fire in a sahih hadith.
2. It's recorded in all the major compendia of fiqh that the Hanafi opinion is that sodomy is always punished by ta'zir. You are the only person I've ever seen claiming that the Hanafi opinion is otherwise.

Citing a narration is different from citing fatawa.

A Western muslim convert who thinks that Saudi Arabia is decadence and classifies himself as a fascist on top of approving the death of tons of people

We're so getting shut down and @Null is getting thrown in Guantanamo when he Allahu Akbars himself

Traditionalist Sunnis don't "Allahu Akbar" themselves. That's for modernists and cucks like Hamas and ISIS.

Also, Evola wasn't a Fascist. He was to the right of Fascism.

How can someone not think Saudi Arabia is decadence? Do you know what decadence means?
 
Rene Guenon/Julius Evola
both of those thinkers (Evola in particular) were heavily connected to fascism. As I said anyone to the right of me is likely to wear a brownshirt.

If you are attempting to present islam as reasonable you are failing terribly- your arguments and irrelevant theological quotations divorced from the reality of life in islamic states and connected to your own admission of extreme views read like the sophistry of ironmarch dressed in a dish dash.
 
2. It's recorded in all the major compendia of fiqh that the Hanafi opinion is that sodomy is always punished by ta'zir. You are the only person I've ever seen claiming that the Hanafi opinion is otherwise.

Literally every Hanafi book or website I've read unquestionably says first its corporal punishment then its death penalty the second they repeat the offense. Same for the imams I've heard.

lol at you decrying Wahhabists as some kind of modern invention when you follow a modern strand of Hanafi jurisprudence that goes against how its been applied for literally over a thousand years.
 
So, he was super-fascist?

He was a Meme-ist.

http://sneed.quickmeme.com/img/71/7191adb2c9355de5a91a136866663e2a8e687401f2e83183629574e639ed44e7.jpg

Literally every Hanafi book or website I've read unquestionably says first its corporal punishment then its death penalty the second they repeat the offense. Same for the imams I've heard.

Name your sources then.
 
By the way I know you're trying to make Islam look better through the Hanafi prism but for those who don't know: ISIS justified burning people alive by quoting Hanafi jurists lol
 
By the way I know you're trying to make Islam look better through the Hanafi prism but for those who don't know: ISIS justified burning people alive by quoting Hanafi jurists lol

I'm not trying to make Islam look better. I was responding to your question about whether the state should execute gays.

Also, they misquoted several of their sources in that fatwa and their whole methodology was pick-and-choose sophistry. They justified it by citing a minority opinion allowing fire as a hadd, then claimed it was done as retaliation, when the same jurists they cited don't allow retaliatory punishments in warfare.

Furthermore, by the standards of the Maturidis and Ash'aris (which the majority of Hanafi and Shafi'i jurists are, respectively), the members of ISIS are bughat (seditious rebels) and apostates.
 
What is the closest model to the best Islamic society possible when it comes to the current countries governed by Sharia law?
 
I just don't get why adultery should be punishable by death. Assuming that it is recent (as in bastard infants) just abandoning them and blacklisting the adulteresses should be sufficient.
 
What is the closest model to the best Islamic society possible when it comes to the current countries governed by Sharia law?

Given that shari'ah is not just hadd punishments, I'd say Morocco and Jordan, because they are the most prominent semi-traditional monarchist Islamic states. They're also the Muslim countries I'd be most likely to move to because they both officially support Sufism. They both fulfill the maqasid ash-shari'ah (aims of the law) fairly well. I'm not crazy about them, but they're the best there are, at least in the Arab world.
 
What are you views on Hamas, Islamic Jihad and Hezbollah?

Hamas and Islamic Jihad are modernists who follow the Muslim Brotherhood ideology. Fuck them. Also, their operations have all been stupid from a strategic standpoint and dubious from a religious standpoint.

Hezbollah are a bunch of Iran-proxy faggots.

I'm not really sure why you're asking me these questions as I'm not a political Islamist. I may think that things should be done a certain way, but I don't actually believe there is any imperative to establishing "a pure Islamic state," which is a bullshit pie-in-the-sky modernist dream born out of third world frustration and quasi-communist utopianism. Muslim states have been screwed since Yazid killed Sayyidina al-Husayn (alayhis salam).
 
Well, this thread certainly took a turn.

LOL, Saudi Arabia has only existed since the 30's. They are "Western decadence."
I think I could find some women who would disagree with you. Most of them are dead, but I'm pretty sure they'd disagree.
 
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