IndyCar Thread - Discussion on IndyCar races and its drivers

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A.P. Hill said:
I don't want to get all doom and gloom but it's blatantly obvious that Nascar wants to kill all domestic competition. They're not content with going after just ovals anymore. They're also trying to lure away Hy-Vee, it seems like. It would be really sad for one of the premier races in the world to be forced into stage cautions and OVERTIME!

My tinfoil hat is that they're trying to interfere and kill IndyCar so much that Penske has no choice but to sell the series to them, just like with IMSA.
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People are even pointing to IMSA now as how 'but nascar buying indycar would be good aktually'. Like... No. People underestimate how much the France family wants to be the absolute entirety of racin' in the US.

They have amassed a close-to-monopoly (along with SMI) on ovals, and they will not share with anyone else with only some very narrow exceptions. They keep seeing the successes that Indycar does have (Iowa, Gateway) and move in to take over. Their cars need second lines open up so it's all resin all the time, which junks the track for Indycar. They want the 500 to be a Cup race and Daytona to be the undisputed greatest spectacle in racing. People say they wouldn't introduce stage racing and the playoffs because IMSA doesn't. The only reason they haven't is because those don't fit with the sports car formula. Also you don't need to bunch up the field for The Big One when some lawyer in a GT3 will take out the lead Prototype at the drop of a hat.

I stayed away from motorsports for years because the decline of Champcar was too damn depressing. Now it's feelin' the same. Even if this doesn't succeed.
 
I wouldn't want to even imagine what sort of contrived gimmick the France family would introduce to the 500.
 
The Grognard said:
I wouldn't want to even imagine what sort of contrived gimmick the France family would introduce to the 500.
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Y'awl know what this race has been missin'? Five hundert mile race nothin'. It's gonna be one of two Cup races here this year and for the Spring Race it's gonna be Indy Dirt. We're taking the 500 back to its ROOTS.

(whut, this place was paved before the five-hunnert started? wut?)
 
Mikoyan said:
Y'awl know what this race has been missin'? Five hundert mile race nothin'. It's gonna be one of two Cup races here this year and for the Spring Race it's gonna be Indy Dirt. We're taking the 500 back to its ROOTS.

(whut, this place was paved before the five-hunnert started? wut?)
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Guys, guys, what if? COMPETITION CAUTIONS IN THE INDY 500!!!! [snorts a mountain of cocaine]
 
Gerry Fuckin' Forsythe bought out the rest of the Long Beach Grand Prix: “If [any series] has its sights on Long Beach please tell them to look elsewhere. This [is] an IndyCar event, and it will be into the future.”

If only Penske had promo that good on the series. And yes, I know Gerry ran it into the ground once before.
 
Mikoyan said:
Gerry Fuckin' Forsythe bought out the rest of the Long Beach Grand Prix: “If [any series] has its sights on Long Beach please tell them to look elsewhere. This [is] an IndyCar event, and it will be into the future.”

If only Penske had promo that good on the series. And yes, I know Gerry ran it into the ground once before.
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At least some businessmen can learn from their mistakes. However, there are a few promo issues that I will have to put a snooty European Elitist hat on so here we go: In the eyes of those outside the Americas, the Indy 500 is not that big of a deal because a lot of idiots think it's just guys turning left for a few hours. The rest of the series might as well not exist except as the place where retired F1 drivers occasionally go to. It still has more prestige to it than Formula E, but that might at well be damning with faint praise.

And now that I will take the hat off, I do think it is in a tolerable place for now but in dire need of money to be more than a series in maintenance mode.
 
The Grognard said:
At least some businessmen can learn from their mistakes. However, there are a few promo issues that I will have to put a snooty European Elitist hat on so here we go: In the eyes of those outside the Americas, the Indy 500 is not that big of a deal because a lot of idiots think it's just guys turning left for a few hours. The rest of the series might as well not exist except as the place where retired F1 drivers occasionally go to. It still has more prestige to it than Formula E, but that might at well be damning with faint praise.

And now that I will take the hat off, I do think it is in a tolerable place for now but in dire need of money to be more than a series in maintenance mode.
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In a sense it doesn't matter that Euros don't get the 500. It's literally fine and not just in a cope way. Superspeedways are almost uniquely American motorsports and the inclusion of them is what makes "American Open Wheel Racing" unique. Not being a huge oval guy myself, I love how Indycar (and CART before it) really is a well rounded demo of all the major types of racing. Street and road courses, as well as speedways.

The 500 suffers - like the Daytona 500 and Nascar's Coke 600 - by the fact that none of them are what they started out as. They're all big races, but a 5 or 600 mile superspeedway race isn't really an endurance event for man or machine anymore. It's just a longer than normal race. The closest you can get to a real enduro in ovals now is doing the Double like Kyle Larson's going to do this year.

What the hell you do with Indycar at this point is a fucking good question. The Split really destroyed AOWR, but dwelling on that isn't the way forward. I've resisted the overt interest of Liberty because first their influence on F1 isn't that great and second they'd probably turn it into an explicit F1 feeder when I think it should be a destination on its own. You need new hardware in the series, for sure. I think this is going to mean collaboration is needed. I rather like the idea people have been tossing around of unifying the engine spec with prototypes. Good power and it should help affordability for everyone involved. I don't like the new spec engine talk but I'd like to hear what other makes have to say about it. I think Honda is looking for only an excuse to put their finger on to concentrate on Cup.

New chassis for sure. If for nothing else to shape up the now very cut and dried notebooks everyone has.
 
Mikoyan said:
What the hell you do with Indycar at this point is a fucking good question. The Split really destroyed AOWR, but dwelling on that isn't the way forward. I've resisted the overt interest of Liberty because first their influence on F1 isn't that great and second they'd probably turn it into an explicit F1 feeder when I think it should be a destination on its own. You need new hardware in the series, for sure. I think this is going to mean collaboration is needed. I rather like the idea people have been tossing around of unifying the engine spec with prototypes. Good power and it should help affordability for everyone involved. I don't like the new spec engine talk but I'd like to hear what other makes have to say about it. I think Honda is looking for only an excuse to put their finger on to concentrate on Cup.

New chassis for sure. If for nothing else to shape up the now very cut and dried notebooks everyone has.
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The things I would focus on at first is ensuring there is cash to do any of this in the first place. Secondly, the new hardware should ideally have enough spectacle to it that it inherently markets itself well. Think some real screamer V8s and V10s. The chassis development would ideally be so that there would be multiple versions for different engines and their respective configurations, but it is also a fairly large project so it would require hiring more than just Dallara to start drawing aerofoils and weaving carbon fiber. I would phone at the very least; DOME, Wirth Research, Tatuus, Ligier and for a long shot, Ferrari. Ideally, the Andretti's failed F1 bid can also be developed to design and make the chassis.
 
The Grognard said:
The things I would focus on at first is ensuring there is cash to do any of this in the first place. Secondly, the new hardware should ideally have enough spectacle to it that it inherently markets itself well. Think some real screamer V8s and V10s. The chassis development would ideally be so that there would be multiple versions for different engines and their respective configurations, but it is also a fairly large project so it would require hiring more than just Dallara to start drawing aerofoils and weaving carbon fiber. I would phone at the very least; DOME, Wirth Research, Tatuus, Ligier and for a long shot, Ferrari. Ideally, the Andretti's failed F1 bid can also be developed to design and make the chassis.
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I too would love banging V8/10 engines - a no electric turbo 6 like the CART days also would be fine, but a bit less detuned. The problem we constantly hear over here is the manufacturers want that, they all want to show off their electric prowess. So I don't know.

A second chassis would be great but might be expensive. Of your list, Indycar already has experience with Tatuus since they make the chassis for the USF Pro feeder series. Dallara's stranglehold on the market is actually a thing that concerns me. They run soooooo many series now, including Indycar and Nascar Cup (shhh).

I'm not sure you could migrate an F1 chassis successfully to current indycar, the sizes and engine formulae are so far apart.
 
Mikoyan said:
I too would love banging V8/10 engines - a no electric turbo 6 like the CART days also would be fine, but a bit less detuned. The problem we constantly hear over here is the manufacturers want that, they all want to show off their electric prowess. So I don't know.

A second chassis would be great but might be expensive. Of your list, Indycar already has experience with Tatuus since they make the chassis for the USF Pro feeder series. Dallara's stranglehold on the market is actually a thing that concerns me. They run soooooo many series now, including Indycar and Nascar Cup (shhh).

I'm not sure you could migrate an F1 chassis successfully to current indycar, the sizes and engine formulae are so far apart.
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The thing that Ferrari can do is that they still have a shitload of talent and machinery to make whatever the series needs. The problem with it would be that they are already the biggest name ever in the whole racing industry and would likely see the idea of IndyCar as a distraction from the other programs that they already have ongoing. The idea of a long-shot is more that they'd make the whole IndyCar package from the engine to the chassis as a ready-to-go Indy 500 machine, just built to specs that IndyCar has ongoing.

As for the electric stuff, it's part of the ESG shit. As public companies in need of fiscal capital, they have to put whatever green development shit that weird neoliberal lizard people want the plebeians to drive. They can't just make a proper screamer again because some activist investor would throw a fit.
 
A.P. Hill said:
Theo Pourchaire is in Indianapolis to test with Chevy. All signs point to him filling in the #6 at Long Beach.

I love Lil Dave, but the guy may have pulled an Oliver Askew. If one of his replacements impresses, he's getting dropped.
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I can't imagine living with that. Big big chance, blown by a bike ride.

I'm going to Indiana tomorrow to hit up the eclipse or try to. I may just stay down there the week and try to go to the open test.
 
The Grognard said:
Scott Dixon doesn't age at all.
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If you look at the old recordings you do go 'man he's young here' but in general I agree.

Annnnd holy fucking shit: 2/3rds of Team Penske DQed from St. Pete due to hybrid test day firmware allowing push to pass on restarts. O'Ward now the winner. Only Will Power escaped the DQ axe but got a ten point penalty for having the software but not using it.
 
More steadily great fucking racing that nobody watches. I was at the Indy GP and it was a pretty good show overall despite lack of drama.

Qualifying day 1 for the 500 on now. Only thing Larson's done wrong all week was backing out after a plenum kaboom.

Rahal's having a repeat of last year, that should be 'fun' to watch. Hondas seem to enjoy failing this year.
 
Mikoyan said:
More steadily great fucking racing that nobody watches.
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It would help if someone yanked Penske's sleeve and gave them a good overview of how to massmarket the whole thing without fucking up the racing formula, like how there's always some boomer out there complaining that "HURR NOT ENOUGH AMERICANS AND OVALS" when it actually does benefit from having a more international appeal than NASCAR.
 
The Grognard said:
It would help if someone yanked Penske's sleeve and gave them a good overview of how to massmarket the whole thing without fucking up the racing formula, like how there's always some boomer out there complaining that "HURR NOT ENOUGH AMERICANS AND OVALS" when it actually does benefit from having a more international appeal than NASCAR.
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The intricacy of how historical open wheel and Indy (and thus Indycar) interact is really neat. Strangely I think this is one of the few things Roger DOES get, given his history, not because I think he's perceptive about the current state of things.

It's amusing that most of the recent influx of people into watching Indycar are in fact foreign - Latin Americans obsessed over O'Ward and Canapino.
 
Mikoyan said:
More steadily great fucking racing that nobody watches. I was at the Indy GP and it was a pretty good show overall despite lack of drama.

Qualifying day 1 for the 500 on now. Only thing Larson's done wrong all week was backing out after a plenum kaboom.

Rahal's having a repeat of last year, that should be 'fun' to watch. Hondas seem to enjoy failing this year.
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Qualifying was a spectacle. It seemed the Chevrolets in the final hour had trouble coping with the heat, with engine failures for Daly, Rasmussen, Carpenter, and Canapino. I will give Veekay credit, after being in the wall just a few hours earlier, that was a spectacular final run to get into the top 12 right when it mattered the most.
 
Peristaltic Pump said:
Qualifying was a spectacle. It seemed the Chevrolets in the final hour had trouble coping with the heat, with engine failures for Daly, Rasmussen, Carpenter, and Canapino. I will give Veekay credit, after being in the wall just a few hours earlier, that was a spectacular final run to get into the top 12 right when it mattered the most.
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Notably though the engine kabooms ended all those runs the engines themselves seem to be fine. Going to be interesting if they've solved the problem at 1.5 bar overnight.
 
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