Hazbin Hotel / Helluva Boss Thread - Now a Griefing Thread

[Doctor of Autism]

I know that some people say that the animation in the actual show is much "cleaner" and more "consistent", but the pilot is definitely more expressive and fluid.

And I'd still argue the animation in the show isn't the greatest anyway. There are so many errors, with lines missing, spots being uncolored, and just many other issues. There's the infamous "Vaggie disappearing in the next frame in the first song", but there are also just many scenes where the error can be easily fixed or it took more effort to produce said error.
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All they had to do was copy Vaggie from the first shot and place here in the next one. It took more time and effort to redraw here in the exact same pose.

It doesn't help that by Hazbin being picked up by a studio, it was sourced to people who were more used to pretty grounded and normal character designs for episodic sitcoms like Bob's Burgers while Hazbin Hotel has a lot more going on visually in comparison.

 

[Local User]

"when an actual teenager calls you out like this (again, assuming this isn't a troll), you know you screwed up. Kicker is that most of the comments are agreeing with her.
.....I honestly don't know how to feel about this."

I swear this is a trend with both of Vivziepop's shows, the pilot is okay-ish and is more interesting than the actual show itself.
And both shows barley commit to the premise after the pilot (More so for Helluva boss than Hazbin Hotel)

 

[Doctor of Autism]

I swear this is a trend with both of Vivziepop's shows, the pilot is okay-ish and is more interesting than the actual show itself.
And both shows barley commit to the premise after the pilot (More so for Helluva boss than Hazbin Hotel)

Hazbin at least is still related to the idea of redeeming sinners and stuff with the hotel and its residents with the tone of the actual show consistent with the drama and musical aspects of the pilot but doesn't have too much of the funny

Helluva Boss went from workplace comedy where occasionally the boss has to deal with some dipshit harassing him for sex who may be evil to a soap opera about the boss and said dipshit being a loving couple who are being oppressed by society and the mean wife who is just a misogynistic idea of an angry wife (like if Blitzo was a woman, I think everyone would see how misogynistic Stella's writing is).

 

[InJailOutSoon]

I swear this is a trend with both of Vivziepop's shows, the pilot is okay-ish and is more interesting than the actual show itself.
And both shows barley commit to the premise after the pilot (More so for Helluva boss than Hazbin Hotel)

It's because the pilots are written by different people. We already know about the Kendraws situation, but two other writers were involved in the Hazbin Hotel pilot: Dave Capdevielle and Raymond Hernadez. And with the Helluva Boss pilot, Brandon Rodgers was the main writer.

We don't know for sure how Hazbin Hotel would fair if the original writers had stayed on, but we do know what we would have sort of gotten if Brandon had stayed. The three episodes he is the main writer for in season 1 are Murder Family, Spring Broken, and CHERUBS. These are are more similar to tone with the pilot, and would fit in a comedic episodic show that was initially advertised. The rest of the episodes in season 1 either have Viv as the main writer or sole writer, and the tone for them are much different than the ones that I mentioned with Brandon. They're more dramatic and serious, and are more in line with episodes that fit in a serialized show.

 

[Grand Duke Snowfall]

Found another post about how the sinners kinda deserve to be in hell. Only one of the replies was really interesting.



“By my lofty moral standards, you (allegedly, by my own judgment) having a political position that I disagree with means that you will be doomed to spend your afterlife in a dimension of eternal torment. But for what it’s worth, I don’t think you should be slaughtered like a lamb, which would probably put that torment to an end depending on who you ask.”
How classy.

 

[Doctor of Autism]

Found another post about how the sinners kinda deserve to be in hell. Only one of the replies was really interesting.
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“By my lofty moral standards, you having a political position that I disagree with means that you will be doomed to spend your afterlife in a dimension of eternal torment. But for what it’s worth, I don’t think you should be slaughtered like a lamb, which would probably put that torment to an end depending on who you ask.”
How classy.

To be fair both these people are wrong since one takes the naive assumption that everyone deserves to go to Hell and the other doesn't even use evidence of actual innocent people that went to Hell.

Since the Hellverse is pretty fucked up given countless innocent people or people that are good but flawed are actively being killed by Demons paid by those who went to Hell. Even then there are Demons who also cause people to die.

Since reminder that a naive girl got killed by a demon for pointless online shipping discourse, a teenager got killed because they got in the way of a Demon's drug trafficking operation, and lots of teenagers were slaughtered relentlessly due to some petty bet between a Demon hitman service and succubi who were mind controlling people.

There's also how people could just be doing whatever they want in Hell because let's face it, if you lived a pious and strict life only to end up in Hell, wouldn't you want to unleash your carnal impulses since you have nothing left to lose.

The most important thing though about all of this is in Hazbin Hotel which is...

1. No one knows what gets you into Heaven

2. The exterminations existed because of the false idea of a uprising due to a retarded angel's paranoia despite having the resources to know otherwise, and letting the openly sadistic douchebag lead these cullings.

 

[GoodWinSon]

We are winning the zoomers, comrades! Soon all shall know the evil of the homosexual demons!

 

[The tired cat]

We are winning the zoomers, comrades! Soon all shall know the evil of the homosexual demons!

I think its more once the hype fo S1 died and people began looking over the series, they just started to realize how rushed and poorly written it was.

 

[Smity Werbenjagermanjensen]

Found another post about how the sinners kinda deserve to be in hell. Only one of the replies was really interesting.
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“By my lofty moral standards, you (allegedly, by my own judgment) having a political position that I disagree with means that you will be doomed to spend your afterlife in a dimension of eternal torment. But for what it’s worth, I don’t think you should be slaughtered like a lamb, which would probably put that torment to an end depending on who you ask.”
How classy.

I'm assuming this is being talked about because this section of some review is making the rounds lately.

As @Doctor of Autism said, I think the point is that once someone ends up in Hell, they inevitably shed their empathy and virtues since they're surrounded by other flawed people who already did so, plus a ton of murderers, rapists, and others who already who completely awful before they ended up in Hell. But the show doesn't show it.

 

[Autistic Gunspergings]

I told someone on twitter that hell is a place for bad people so they called me a christofash and blocked me. Apparently actually knowing Bible stuff makes you a fascist now.

I just find this entire situation ironic, isn't "forgiveness" like a core tenet of Christianity? they're fans of a show that very obviously tries to be anti-christian despite the fact that the morals it pushes are rooted in Christian ideology. It's like the perfect microcosm of everything wrong with this show and it's fans.

 

[The Nothingness]

Found another post about how the sinners kinda deserve to be in hell. Only one of the replies was really interesting.
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“By my lofty moral standards, you (allegedly, by my own judgment) having a political position that I disagree with means that you will be doomed to spend your afterlife in a dimension of eternal torment. But for what it’s worth, I don’t think you should be slaughtered like a lamb, which would probably put that torment to an end depending on who you ask.”
How classy.

Seems like a thought terminating cliché. Like how Republicans treat due process.

Did this person sleep through #MeToo and Democrats seeing any police-related death of a black person as an act of racism?

Back to the subject at hand, others have stated the show has made no effort at hinting characters want to better themselves and not be a slave to their vices. Even in the pilot, Charlie was laughed at by her own subjects. It's hard not to sympathize with them when they don't give a shit about themselves or others #AdamDidNothingWrong

 

[Grand Duke Snowfall]

I just find this entire situation ironic, isn't "forgiveness" like a core tenet of Christianity? they're fans of a show that very obviously tries to be anti-christian despite the fact that the morals it pushes are rooted in Christian ideology. It's like the perfect microcosm of everything wrong with this show and it's fans.

Well, it seems like a majority of fans are leftists and SJWs. The kind who will dig for dirt on you if they hate what you’re saying because forgiveness is not allowed. You can never grow as a person, once you say or believe something bad, that’s it, you’re evil forever. Speaking of which…

 

[Autistic Gunspergings]

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Don't make me tap the sign...

 

[Grumpy Pickle Rick]

Don't make me tap the sign...
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Sometimes, I can’t tell if these people are retarded, crazy or both.

 

[Outer Space Traveller]

I'm assuming this is being talked about because this section of some review is making the rounds lately.
fECrRP4ALEn4hzMR.mp4

As @Doctor of Autism said, I think the point is that once someone ends up in Hell, they inevitably shed their empathy and virtues since they're surrounded by other flawed people who already did so, plus a ton of murderers, rapists, and others who already who completely awful before they ended up in Hell. But the show doesn't show it.

Where is this 'toss review from? I swear I saw it in this thread, but I can't find it now.

 

[Re(Runner)48]

Honestly they could make some interesting sinners "who shouldn't belong in hell". That would be an interesting concept and actually refreshing. Some examples of morally grey sins that could of been tackled on.

-A war veteran who killed alot of people for his country. Who was merely following orders. And accidentally killed innocent people from the war without his knowledge. Murder and killing are still a sin.

- A theif who was stealing for people to survive. Such as relics and or other rarities and only got a cut for their work. They could of been super poor, as stealing is still a sin.

- A guy sees a crime that's commited. And it could of been someone they were related to or close to, so when they testified against them. They lied though they know the person commited the crime. And got into more crime because of them. As it's someone they are close to its alot harder to want to go against someone in your family, or someone who is your friend.
(Ignoring Sir Pentious as that story made no sense, they didn't even question him or do anything that they suggested)

- Someone hails a fake god they didn't know. Goes to hell.

- A billionaire is more obsessed with his money than his family. Coveting money and being a scrooge, he ignores his children growing up he doesn't rasie them himself and has maids do it, his wife keeps trying to fix their marriage but he ignores her just throws money at her for the problem to go away. Children grow up distant don't even want his money because of what they've seen first hand of what it does to someone. His wife dies he doesn't care, some of his children dies, he doesn't care, only until he's dying he realizes how lonely he is still doesn't attone for his sins before death.

- Someone who cheats on their partner, and was selfish in life didn't appreciate what they had and ruined their child's life on earth. (Instead of excusing the cheating because of GAY SHIT)

- A person who's a home wreaker goes around ruining marriages. Only for the thrill of it, a tempter who goes to wives and husband's to tempts them only because they enjoy spreading chaos. Perhaps they have trouble with their autonomy and can't produce children of their own, so they live vicariously through others because they are infertile.

- Someone who's an addict falling down the wrong path. A younger person perhaps (not AngelDust who's like fucking 30-40+ and is a mafioso's son) could be a woman who got into drugs in her teens and spirals, steals, cheats, becomes a day walker. Dying before she can even legally drink. It would make the sinner more sympathetic as it's a younger unexperienced person who gets caught up and was manipulated at a very young age.

These are just some ideas to make them somewhat sympathetic  Viv.

Not fucking rapists, cannibals, abusers, sexual deviants, murders, neptobabies coddling grown people who all exhibit these traits. Which make them unredeemable and reprehensible. Undeserving of redemption because you can't redeem these people. She unironically made Alastor be her own version of Jeffrey Dahmer, with only peppering in that he's black targeting white people, does voodoo, and he's not fucking the corpses/ is ACESEXUAL.

Dahmer was a white guy who targeted black people, was a former of Satanist, who was turbo gay and had a drinking problem. I hope I'm not the only one seeing the similarities of these two as hes just a "edgy" deviantart oc version of a real life cannibal serial killer.

 

[Tablet County]

Honestly they could make some interesting sinners "who shouldn't belong in hell". That wo7kd be an interesting concept and actually refreshing. Some examples of morally grey sins that could of been tackled on.

I remember hearing a long time ago something along the lines of "you're only a prisoner of Hell by choice" and that idea's always fascinated me. The idea that there's an entire group of people who are only in Hell not necessarily because they're bad people, but because they're people who are so conscientious that they're wracked by guilt from some great wrongdoing and they loathe themselves. They see themselves as beneath absolution and so don't even attempt to ask for it. I think there's a rich vein of drama there.

 

[FK009]

I just find this entire situation ironic, isn't "forgiveness" like a core tenet of Christianity? they're fans of a show that very obviously tries to be anti-christian despite the fact that the morals it pushes are rooted in Christian ideology. It's like the perfect microcosm of everything wrong with this show and it's fans.

It is, but that’s one side of the coin, and not the side they take issue with. Forgiveness goes hand in hand with the other core tenet, repentance, and that’s where the breakdown starts happening with these sorts of things. God will forgive us and we should forgive, however, God also requests that we truly try and repent of the sins we commit to be forgiven, and we need others to repent of their sins as well, which comes in the form of trying to be better.

These people love what I call Hippy Jesus, where he tells you to be nice to everyone no matter the sin, and be cool to one another, and that so long as you’re generally nice, you’re good. This ignores actual Jesus, who says “Your sins are forgiven”, which everyone loves, but then adds a line, that they don’t like.

What they absolutely despise is: “Go and sin no more.” Which indicates you need to stop the behavior that was sinful. In their view, those standards are evil and oppressive, because you should be able to do whatever you want, whenever you want, without thought to either the future or other people. So long as you don’t do something really bad, like murder someone (and if Luigi M. taught me anything, even murder isn’t that evil, depending on who you kill, which should worry everyone and anyone who has ever interacted with those sociopaths because they have a very loose and liquid definition of who’s deserving to be killed) then Heaven isn’t something that is given, Heaven is owed to you. You are perfect the way you are, and if someone tries to hold you to a moral standard, they’re the issue, not your behavior, God included.

As an afterthought, People here also joke about the Sad Backstory thing excusing all actions, I have met people that actually think that if someone does something like steal or rob someone, it’s not their fault for making the choice, no they’re has to be a reason they’re doing it that’s understandable and thus, just need some kindness.

Source for this: Atheists and Leftists in the family/People that utterly despise Christianity, but constantly try to co-opt the church for their own shitty beliefs.

 

[InJailOutSoon]

I'm assuming this is being talked about because this section of some review is making the rounds lately.
fECrRP4ALEn4hzMR.mp4

As @Doctor of Autism said, I think the point is that once someone ends up in Hell, they inevitably shed their empathy and virtues since they're surrounded by other flawed people who already did so, plus a ton of murderers, rapists, and others who already who completely awful before they ended up in Hell. But the show doesn't show it.

Again, it's one of those lines that needs fixing. If Emily has said something along the line of "murdering countless souls", that would have worked fine. But no. She says "bringing misery to thousands of innocent people". Sweetie. The people were already bringing their own misery to each other down in Hell without the angels contributing. In fact, it's you could argue that the angels are bringing a sense of mercy to those people since they're ending their eternal suffering. Also, yeah...the people in Hell aren't innocent either. The majority of them are causing suffering to one another and even enjoying it.

Now, maybe the original line could have work if it was to show how naive Emily was. But it's not really framed that way. Sera, the supposedly wiser and older angel, doesn't counteract that question. She doesn't bring up any of the points that I did to make Emily rethink her previous stance. She just tells her that she shouldn't be questioning these ort of things, otherwise there could be a chance that she could fall like Lucifer did. This is why many of the villains and antagonists in these shows don't work. They never bring up any valid points that could make the protagonist question themselves. The "good guy" is always 100% correct, while the "bad guy" is always 100% incorrect.

I'll also talk about the other thing that has been brought up here a lot: the idea of a Sinner that has not committed as egregious crimes. We get that with Sir Pentious, as his worst crime is not reporting a murder he witnessed. I can't remember if he also sold his inventions to the murderer, but the point is that compared to the other characters, his sins are not as bad.

The thing is that once he got into Hell, that's a different story. He's actively trying to make himself be a threat and a Mastermind villain. He's engaging in turf wars, destroying property, and attacking other people. Now, here's another argument that can be made. If people become worse in Hell because there's nothing preventing them from engaging in their bad vices, it could be stated that people also become worse to survive in Hell. Because, let's face it; trying to be a good person in Hell is nearly impossible. Sin is not only encouraged, it is rewarded. So if you don't want to be actively prey on by shit-stains, you yourself have to become a shit-stain.

This could be an interestin to go in to more depth in the show; that for some Sinners, they have to be terrible people because that's really the only way to live in such an environment as Hell. But I doubt this will even be a point that is brought up.

 

[Saxxon]

My favorite part of keeping up with the merch drops is to see the creative ways that Viv and Spindlehorse find to rip off their loyal fans;

Like how about 66 dollars plus tax and shipping for a giant piece of cardboard with you favorite gay spider on it?


Or more coomer merch for a minor side character that feels that should have come in February along with the others?