General Wrestling Discussion

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AEW barely tops WWE's developmental program for ratings. WWE is absolutely a monopoly as far as wrestling companies go, although they'd probably just say they're an entertainment company if it went to court
Classic Vince lol. When Ted Turner bought WCW he told Vince he's in the wrestling business and Vince told him were in the entertainment business. Trips would just give a serious answer. I wonder how the mnw would fare if hhh was running things. WCW would have killed raw.
 
AEW barely tops WWE's developmental program for ratings. WWE is absolutely a monopoly as far as wrestling companies go, although they'd probably just say they're an entertainment company if it went to court
Since the UFC antitrust lawsuit ended with them paying hundreds of millions of dollars in compensation, WWE has gone out of its way to mention the existence of other wrestling promotions (aside from AEW) every chance it gets, which never happened under Vince when they actually were a monopoly. It's also hard to argue that WWE is a true monopoly when AEW formed and right away was able to get a national television deal without WWE having the ability to prevent it. Just because AEW has been mostly incompetently run after a strong first couple of years of business doesn't mean that's WWE's fault, which I'm sure would be their argument if for some reason they were taken to court for an antitrust case.
 
Classic Vince lol. When Ted Turner bought WCW he told Vince he's in the wrestling business and Vince told him were in the entertainment business. Trips would just give a serious answer. I wonder how the mnw would fare if hhh was running things. WCW would have killed raw.
You're probably right because Austin/Vince is what really drove the Attitude Era and HHH wouldn't have worked as well for the boss.

Attitude Era was great but honestly a lot of it was also complete shit. A lot of it didn't age well, either. For example, even teenage me thought that the Godfather gimmick was try too hard and stupid. Then you had Beaver Cleavage and other similar shit
 
WWE is absolutely a monopoly as far as wrestling companies go
Legally, i'd disagree. maybe from after buying WCW and ECW to whenever TNA got on Spike, it was.

But right now, you have a competitor (while smaller) in AEW who has MAX, TBS/TNT, and PPV, pulling a profit independently.
 
Legally, i'd disagree. maybe from after buying WCW and ECW to whenever TNA got on Spike, it was.

But right now, you have a competitor (while smaller) in AEW who has MAX, TBS/TNT, and PPV, pulling a profit independently.
We don't know that AEW is profitable. All we know is that Meltzer claims they're profitable, but given his track record, I don't think I'd put too much stock into that.

But yeah, AEW existing probably does make it not a monopoly in the legal sense, even though their ratings are dogshit. They still have the TV deals, like you said, and them sucking isn't WWE's fault
 
We don't know that AEW is profitable. All we know is that Meltzer claims they're profitable, but given his track record, I don't think I'd put too much stock into that.

But yeah, AEW existing probably does make it not a monopoly in the legal sense, even though their ratings are dogshit. They still have the TV deals, like you said, and them sucking isn't WWE's fault
I would personally put it at 65/35 that it's profitable to SOME degree. not 20 million dollars in profit, but it's pulling a small one. Plus even then, Khan owns the Jags, Fulham, a car bumper company, he can keep it afloat as long as it doesn't start going down to 100 million dollars of losses a year. That'd be when they can't even sell PPV's. if they get to half of tna's level, or get kicked off TNT/TBS/MAX, I'd say their screwed, unless they end up on Hulu or something
 
I would personally put it at 65/35 that it's profitable to SOME degree. not 20 million dollars in profit, but it's pulling a small one. Plus even then, Khan owns the Jags, Fulham, a car bumper company, he can keep it afloat as long as it doesn't start going down to 100 million dollars of losses a year. That'd be when they can't even sell PPV's. if they get to half of tna's level, or get kicked off TNT/TBS/MAX, I'd say their screwed, unless they end up on Hulu or something
Yeah, profitable or not, there's no chance of them going under anytime soon. Tony's dad is absolutely loaded and is funding AEW so that Tony is occupied with that and not fucking up the Jaguars and Fulham.

Even if his dad stopped funding it, he could make his spending a bit more reasonable (like not paying $10 mil a year for Mercedes Mone) and stay in business a lot longer. I don't think he gives a shit about a profit, to be honest
 
Between not having to waste tens of millions on terrible flop video game and the new deal that WBD gave to AEW, I think it's safe to say they're profitable. They're lucky that WBD is run by retards desperate enough to pay out for any original content.
It doesn't matter though because this is Tony's personal plaything that he's been dreaming about doing since he was a kid, he can fund it as long as he wants to. Even if AEW got kicked off streaming and television, Tony would probably just upload every show on YouTube for free and continue on.
 
Just for the record Vince has legally labeled the fed as basically a stage performance in order to get around the New Jersey athletics commission. That being said the last Dark Side is going to be Mohammed Hassan? That should be interesting I'm hoping they do cover how in the beginning the idea was actually pretty sharp with him wearing a suit and tie before they got lazy and fell back on the ol' foreign heel stereotype.
 
Yeah, profitable or not, there's no chance of them going under anytime soon. Tony's dad is absolutely loaded and is funding AEW so that Tony is occupied with that and not fucking up the Jaguars and Fulham.

Even if his dad stopped funding it, he could make his spending a bit more reasonable (like not paying $10 mil a year for Mercedes Mone) and stay in business a lot longer. I don't think he gives a shit about a profit, to be honest
I mean, tony's job with the Jags is to find UDFA's (actually not a bad haul this year, wait till training camp though), and with Fulham, he's the guy in charge with transfers iirc. And their a yo-yo club between the Championship and the Prem. right now, their 10th in the Prem, which isn't that bad. but there's a 29 point difference between them and Liverpool. I mean, take it as is, he isn't fucking up too badly, Jags might be decent if Travis Hunter works well.

AEW, as is, it's going to always be a passion project for Tony. Sure, Deathriders stink, and they really have a problem with so many people on the roster cutting into payroll, but you gotta give props for it being there and shaping the industry. it's like IMO, McDonalds vs In and Out. Everyone has had a big Mac, but there are people who will die for a Double Double. some people might not like it, or even heard of it. but it's considered the best serviced fast food chain (west coast wise).
 
You're probably right because Austin/Vince is what really drove the Attitude Era and HHH wouldn't have worked as well for the boss.

Attitude Era was great but honestly a lot of it was also complete shit. A lot of it didn't age well, either. For example, even teenage me thought that the Godfather gimmick was try too hard and stupid. Then you had Beaver Cleavage and other similar shit
My main criticism of the AE is that angles moved too fast, too much crash TV. By the time the Monday night wars were over it felt like wrestling blew its load. Still a very fun time, don't get me wrong. Personally I like 87-92ish WWF the best though.
 
Just for the record Vince has legally labeled the fed as basically a stage performance in order to get around the New Jersey athletics commission. That being said the last Dark Side is going to be Mohammed Hassan? That should be interesting I'm hoping they do cover how in the beginning the idea was actually pretty sharp with him wearing a suit and tie before they got lazy and fell back on the ol' foreign heel stereotype.
Not really sure what there is to say about the Muhammad Hassan thing other than it was a case of very bad timing. Even if the bombings didn't happen, the story doesn't make sense. Vince tried to do the "foreigner heel makes a point about racism" story a few different times. During Jinder Mahal's world title run, he would speak some phrases in Punjabi while the crowd booed but he was always saying positive things. No shit they're booing, you just spent the last five minutes berating them. It doesn't work in wrestling because the heel is cheating during his matches and acting like an asshole while showing no remorse for it, but you're supposed to sympathize with him because muh racism? In the case of Hassan, he had a group of random thugs in masks beat the shit out of Undertaker then they all prayed while Hassan put the camel clutch on him. Are the crowds not supposed to think Hassan is a bad guy because he then complains about stereotypes? It was all a contradiction.
 
Not really sure what there is to say about the Muhammad Hassan thing other than it was a case of very bad timing. Even if the bombings didn't happen, the story doesn't make sense. Vince tried to do the "foreigner heel makes a point about racism" story a few different times. During Jinder Mahal's world title run, he would speak some phrases in Punjabi while the crowd booed but he was always saying positive things. No shit they're booing, you just spent the last five minutes berating them. It doesn't work in wrestling because the heel is cheating during his matches and acting like an asshole while showing no remorse for it, but you're supposed to sympathize with him because muh racism? In the case of Hassan, he had a group of random thugs in masks beat the shit out of Undertaker then they all prayed while Hassan put the camel clutch on him. Are the crowds not supposed to think Hassan is a bad guy because he then complains about stereotypes? It was all a contradiction.
The gimmick itself was short sighted. As weeks went by especially when Daivari began speaking in Farsi/Arabic, everyone knew it was a disaster waiting to happen. Then TNA gave Daivari that not so subtle intro to his theme
Some of the comments on the video
I rate this theme a solid 9/11
Theme so fire that it melts steel beams

I wonder, how things would be if they had him feud with Chavo in his Kerwin White gimmick, where he would make insensitive comments about the pair, or even against Kenzo Suzuki who loves America. Like during a promo he berares Daivari for speaking in Arabic, telling him in broken Engrish "This America, so speak Engrish, do you understand?"
 
You're probably right because Austin/Vince is what really drove the Attitude Era and HHH wouldn't have worked as well for the boss.

Attitude Era was great but honestly a lot of it was also complete shit. A lot of it didn't age well, either. For example, even teenage me thought that the Godfather gimmick was try too hard and stupid. Then you had Beaver Cleavage and other similar shit
this, a lot of the lower card during the AE was borderline shit, the tag division was very good with the Hardys,Dudleys,and Edge and Christian, but the midcard was basically filler, and the womens division was just coomerbait, with HHH the product is more even with good stuff whereas the AE is a god-tier main event but most of the other show not being that good
I like 87-92ish WWF the best though.
Hulkamania,Attitude Era, and to some extent the Ruthless Aggression era and current WWE were and are overall, generally a good product, imo 93-96 WWF and 2013-2020 WWE were the two worst periods in the history of the company, a lot of good talent was squandered and creative was a complete mess, the New Generation Era especially could have been so much better then what Vince actually booked, he should have trusted Bret to carry the company during that, mind you WCW was also shit during this period but they had Hogan and Macho Man so they werent going to out-compete them anyway, Diesel as Champion was uninteresting
 
Say whatever we will about the AE/Monday Night Wars in General insofar as booking below the Main Event Scene - even if WCW's Main Event Scene was a clusterfuck by the end - I'm still giving that era's Russo my one bit of praise. Russo would at least try to find things for people in the lower card to do, even if they were shit ideas.

Considering how much bigger TV was back in the 90's, I'd take anything over the modern "Yeah just hang out in catering"
 
Not really sure what there is to say about the Muhammad Hassan thing other than it was a case of very bad timing. Even if the bombings didn't happen, the story doesn't make sense. Vince tried to do the "foreigner heel makes a point about racism" story a few different times. During Jinder Mahal's world title run, he would speak some phrases in Punjabi while the crowd booed but he was always saying positive things. No shit they're booing, you just spent the last five minutes berating them. It doesn't work in wrestling because the heel is cheating during his matches and acting like an asshole while showing no remorse for it, but you're supposed to sympathize with him because muh racism? In the case of Hassan, he had a group of random thugs in masks beat the shit out of Undertaker then they all prayed while Hassan put the camel clutch on him. Are the crowds not supposed to think Hassan is a bad guy because he then complains about stereotypes? It was all a contradiction.
Yeah, Hassan started out awesome. Was a "foreign" (actually NYer but whatever) heel who was sick of being stereotyped. Made some real good points; he was American, he was not a terrorist, etc... Then he slowly got more and more like a terrorist, including having hooded goons come out and kidnap the Undertaker. Basically he proved the fans were right which killed the entire basis of his character

If they had kept up the first part and not gone the latter, it would've worked pretty well. Even without the London thing, it would've worked for a little while. Eventually it'd have gone stale and they couldn't have really turned him face after that though.

Fun fact: Hassan was originally going to beat Taker and then beat Batista for the world title until the London thing happened and they had to get rid of him due to pressure from UPN
 
as an early Gen Zer myself scrolling through twitter after RAW and SmackDown gets fucking exhausting, younger wrestling fans are so dopamine-addicted and dont even realize it, they expect every single RAW and SmackDown to completely blow them away and get mad if the show is a 7 or even 8 out of 10, Romans 4-year title run really exposed how fucked these people are, they want the weekly TV to be PPV quality
Yeah, Hassan started out awesome. Was a "foreign" (actually NYer but whatever) heel who was sick of being stereotyped. Made some real good points; he was American, he was not a terrorist, etc...
If im being perfectly honest I think that the whole "America Good, Foreign Country Bad" trope is way too overdone in wrestling, second to Heel Authority figures it just gets exhausting after awhile, Hogan in the 80s and 90s beating up random Arabs,Russians,Japanese,etc. is entertaining for awhile, especially at a time when people were less cynical about the US Government then they are today, but if you tried that shit today people would be calling it shit,boring,cheap heat,etc.
 
Yeah, Hassan started out awesome. Was a "foreign" (actually NYer but whatever) heel who was sick of being stereotyped. Made some real good points; he was American, he was not a terrorist, etc...

If im being perfectly honest I think that the whole "America Good, Foreign Country Bad" trope is way too overdone in wrestling, second to Heel Authority figures it just gets exhausting after awhile
What if they went the comedy route and just paired him with an obvious white guy playing a heel while cosplaying as a Middle Eastern stereotype while speaking perfect English like so
 
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