Disaster Gab got blacklisted by Visa - Another free speech site has trouble with payment processors.

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Gab Has Been Blacklisted By Visa
Gab has been blacklisted by Visa for “promoting hate speech.”

Gab does no such thing. This is like saying Google “promotes hate speech” because you can search racial slurs on their search engine and get results. Gab is a neutral technology platform. We follow the law, have an excellent relationship with law enforcement, and have a clear set of community guidelines that detail what is allowed on our website and what is not.

The bottom line is that Gab is not controlled and cannot be controlled by the oligarchic elite who are working to overthrow our counties and infect them with communism. It’s no coincidence that Katie Hopkins was banned from Twitter today, Zerohedge and The Federalist had their comment sections censored by Google, and VDARE is getting banned by their domain registrar. All of this is coordinated. It’s targeted.

Where is the President? Where is Congress?

Tweeting and “monitoring the situation.” That’s where.

No one is coming to save us and no one is coming to save you.
It’s on all of us to save ourselves.

So we have lost credit card processing yet again after a year and a half of working to get it restored. We have been under attack at the payment processing level all month long. In early June we were abruptly banned by two separate underwriting banks without cause.


“Risk related reasons” is the excuse. These banks have no problem processing payments for pornography websites which are loaded with child exploitation, human trafficking, and more. They have no problem processing payments for cannabis, which is still illegal at the federal level. They have no problems processing payments for gambling websites.
Gab sells t-shirts, hats, and a software subscription service.
I guess that’s “high risk” to these people.

We still accept payments via echeck, check by mail, and bitcoin. If you’d like to support us through any of those options you can do so by upgrading to GabPRO here.

You can also send a check or money order donation/payment for GabPRO:
Gab AI Inc
PO Box 441
Clarks Summit, PA
18411
We will not go gently into the good night. We will rage, rage, against the dying of the light.
Ephesians 6:12
12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

As many of you already know we learned last week that Visa blacklisted Gab and we are now unable to process credit and debit card transactions. We learned more information this week and I think it’s important that I share it as a warning for others.

It’s not just Gab that is blacklisted. It’s also my family.

In China there is something called the Social Credit System, which was developed by the Communist Chinese Party as a “national reputation system.” This system tracks the “trustworthiness” of individuals, businesses, and organizations. “Trustworthiness” here means total and complete submission to the Chinese Communist Party. If the Communist Party deems you to be untrustworthy, you are denied access to plane tickets, train tickets, opening and operating businesses, and more.

As of June 2019, according to the National Development and Reform Commission of China, 26.82 million air tickets as well as 5.96 million high-speed rail tickets have been denied to people who were deemed “untrustworthy (失信)” (on a blacklist), and 4.37 million “untrustworthy” people have chosen to fulfill their duties required by the law.

To most Americans this sounds horrifying, and it is. I now know from first-hand experience because this social credit system exists in the United States. While it may not be sanctioned by the United States government, it most certainly has been deployed by US corporations who today have in many ways more power, data, and control over our lives than our government does. Many of these corporations also happen to be endorsing and raising money for communist organizations, revolutionaries, and the domestic terrorists burning down our cities.

We were told this week that not only is Gab blacklisted by Visa as a business, but my personal name, phone number, address, and more are all also blacklisted by Visa. If I wanted to leave Gab tomorrow (something that isn’t going to happen) and start a lemonade stand I wouldn’t be able to obtain merchant processing for it.

Simply because my name is Andrew Torba.

If my wife wants to start a business she won’t be able to obtain merchant processing because she lives at the same address as me and would be flagged by Visa.

This is obviously very concerning. We have done nothing wrong. Gab is and always has been a legally operated business. We sell hats, shirts, and a software subscription service that unlocks new features on Gab. My personal credit score is in the 800’s. I pay my bills. I have a wife and daughter to provide for, yet we are all being punished and defamed because someone at Visa has it out for me.

We were told that Visa has someone camping on our website watching our payment processing. As soon as we get a new processor up they find out who it is on their end and contact them. They tell the processor that Gab is flagged for “illegal activity” and if they do not stop processing payments for us they will be heavily fined.

When the processor inquires about this alleged “illegal activity,” Visa tells them that Gab has been flagged for “hate speech.” “Hate speech,” is of course not illegal in the United States of America and is protected by the First Amendment. As I have written, it’s not real and I refuse to acknowledge it as term. Visa doesn’t agree with me.

The reason I share all of this is that I hope it serves as a wakeup call and as a warning. If they can do this to me, they can do it to you and they likely will.

Christians need to be especially concerned and aware of this. The Communist revolutionaries taking over the United States are coming for us all. It’s only a matter of time before the Bible is labeled as “hate speech” and churches start to experience what I am going through right now.

And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. Revelation 13:17

Andrew Torba
CEO, Gab.com
June 26th, 2020

@Null you're not the only one facing trouble with payment processors.

 

[4STA]

Ok, if I understand correccly Visa doesn't want to do business with Gab.
What exactly is the problem with that? How about the other credit card companies, mastercard, amex? Did they decline to do business with them too?

Tbh, I find it highly amusing that even the right wing German AFD can do business worldwide using creditcards, bank accounts and even PayPal but some harmless dude like the owner of Gab can't.
By the way if you're a German your donations to the AFD are tax deductible. Just sayin.

Read the OP? Nor can Torba now use Visa, nor can his family. That's right, no credit cards for wrongthinkers or their family, which is the same as no money for the wrongthink family in the modern world.
Indeed this is just a stepping stone to the China policy, and it was obvious this was going to happen, and soon.

How was it obvious? Because the Credit Card Monopolies could if they wanted to ban money transactions from their customers. But would they want to? Ever since Commies and Far Lefties infiltrated the company, yes they do.

Things are only going to get worse, before theoretically perhaps one day getting better.

 

[Wilhelm Bittrich]

Read the OP? Nor can Torba now use Visa, nor can his family. That's right, no credit cards for wrongthinkers or their family, which is the same as no money for the wrongthink family in the modern world.

I did read the OP and no where did it mention that Mastercard or Amex did decline to do business with them. Therefore my question again, what's the fucking problem when Visa don't want to do business with you?

 

[4STA]

I did read the OP and no where did it mention that Mastercard or Amex did decline to do business with them. Therefore my question again, what's the fucking problem when Visa don't want to do business with you?

Are you not able to envision all three doing so? Because these companies absolutely parrot each others moves constantly. You can't see one step ahead?

For arguments sake let's say they do "decline business," would it be a problem then?

 

[Joshuan Moon]

Ok, if I understand correccly Visa doesn't want to do business with Gab.
What exactly is the problem with that? How about the other credit card companies, mastercard, amex? Did they decline to do business with them too?

Tbh, I find it highly amusing that even the right wing German AFD can do business worldwide using creditcards, bank accounts and even PayPal but some harmless dude like the owner of Gab can't.
By the way if you're a German your donations to the AFD are tax deductible. Just sayin.
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I dont know the exact details of how merchant processing goes but basically for Gab to accept credit/debit they have to go through a payment processor. The processor has all the agreements in place with the credit networks like Visa and MC and Amex to use their networks. The payment processor takes the credit card info and passes that to the right network and then disburses funds back to the merchant account. The payment processor also provides all the security and tokenizing of the payment processing so that Gab doesn't have to store or recieve any financial information directly. The issue is that if they go to a new payment processor Visa will tell them to dump Gab beacuase they're illegal. Payment processor doesn't want to lose their access to the Visa network so they comply. They could probably just disable Visa processing but more likely after being told they're illegal the processor is dropping Gab entirely because money and illegal activities is no good and not worth it. It's too much liability to accept. So effectively they can't use any credit/debit services that work with Visa.

I suppose in theory say Amex is totally cool with them they could get an agreement to use the Amex network but then they would be responsible for directly accepting people's CC info and securely handing the transaction and that's just not something a regular old website can or even should think about doing.

ETA: He is also personally banned. He will no longer be able to use any credit or debit cards on the Visa network. He could still get a MC or AmEx CC until they decide to ban him but if his bank only issues Visa debit cards then he would lose the ability to even pay directly from his bank account at most places. Lots of places don't take checks so he better hope they take Amex (lots don't take that either) or he has enough cash on hand. If his bank doesn't issue ATM only cards (those aren't debit cards and therefore aren't tied to Visa or MC) and instead uses debit cards as the ATM card then I doubt he could even withdrawal cash from an ATM.

 

[Wilhelm Bittrich]

I dont know the exact details of how merchant processing goes but basically for Gab to accept credit/debit they have to go through a payment processor. The processor has all the agreements in place with the credit networks like Visa and MC and Amex to use their networks. The payment processor takes the credit card info and passes that to the right network and then disburses funds back to the merchant account. The payment processor also provides all the security and tokenizing of the payment processing so that Gab doesn't have to store or recieve any financial information directly. The issue is that if they go to a new payment processor Visa will tell them to dump Gab beacuase they're illegal. Payment processor doesn't want to lose their access to the Visa network so they comply. They could probably just disable Visa processing but more likely after being told they're illegal the processor is dropping Gab entirely because money and illegal activities is no good and not worth it. It's too much liability to accept. So effectively they can't use any credit/debit services that work with Visa.

I suppose in theory say Amex is totally cool with them they could get an agreement to use the Amex network but then they would be responsible for directly accepting people's CC info and securely handing the transaction and that's just not something a regular old website can or even should think about doing.

Ok, that's an explanation. That means technically his only chance to do business would be leaving the US and go to a nation where this shit doesn't fly.

 

[Safir]

You can only deny someone credit if their credit history is shit (which tbh is likely with hard leftists who hate your ass) and you have to refer them to the credit reporting agency that you based your denial on. You also have to keep records as to why you denied them credit.

If you deny someone credit on the basis of sex, race, religion, etc, you're in a world of shit.

Edit: you probably wouldn't get completely shut down, but getting written up by the Treasury auditors will hurt your reputation and rating.

Serious question: a lot of data science-adjacent Americans are complaining organizations, including banks, base their approvals and rejections on unaccountable neural network output. I know there's a law in Russia that explicitly prohibits it and requires all criteria to be transparent and legible to humans, which is never used because haha lol seriously now. How are things in the US?

 

[Joshuan Moon]

Ok, that's an explanation. That means technically his only chance to do business would be leaving the US and go to a nation where this shit doesn't fly.

I don't think escaping to a different country could really make a difference here. Visa and Mastercard are basically the entirety of US credit and debit cards everything else is just scraps of a few %. Any international credit processor is going to accept both if they're at all interested in taking money from Americans and then the same problem occurs. I don't see Sketchy Russian Credit Processor sticking its neck out for a foreigner who is causing them issues.

 

[The Final Troondown]

Couldn't they just use a burner account transfer system like roid UGLs use?

You place an order, the vendor gives you that months burner account, you transfer the funds to it and they take the funds out and mail you your stuff. Theyclose the account regularly, setting up a new one to prevent losing access

 

[Gravityqueen4life]

time to make our own bank guys!

 

[Exterminate Leftists]

Cute thread you guys have here. It's odd that you guys never heard of Muammar Gaddafi or Saddam Hussein. Start your own bank? Hope you don't like living.

 

[Notgoodwithusernames]

Gab is a fucking shitshow but this is fucking wrong.

Banks need to have regulations put on them to prevent this Kind of stuff from happening

 

[Meat Target]

Maybe make political beliefs a protected class? Or even all beliefs? They used to talk about not discriminating based on "creed". That would seem applicable here. Political beliefs are a type of creed. Pushing to enforce non-discrimination against creeds in finance would be a solution within the existing structure, which the authorities would obviously prefer. It would still be a huge fight, but the fight might be winnable for enough people and maybe a billionaire or two. It would mean "defending Nazis", that's how it would be framed, but it would really be defending everyone.

Gab is a fucking shitshow but this is fucking wrong.

Banks need to have regulations put on them to prevent this Kind of stuff from happening

Yeah, it would be an uphill battle, because having political views listed as "creed" (aside from the fact that it'd codify politics as the national religion) is a hard sell, because then agents of ISIS, North Korea, the mafia, etc. could be allowed into the US financial system, because "hey, that's just their political views, who am I to judge?"

It's the Paradox of Tolerance.

 

[Slimy Time]

INB4 "It's a private company, it can do what it wants" from the libertarian fags on Twitter.

 

[TerribleIdeas™]

I agree. Modern commerce requires electronic payments and people need to freely exchange money for our world to function. This is just another area where the "free market" can't provide a solution because this market isn't actually free.

Control over the currency is wholly within the scope of the federal government. I see no reason why there can't be a Federal payment processor that works like the Federal postal service. We could give it a monopoly on processing tax payments too like how the USPS have a monopoly on standard mail delivery. If the Constitution was written today's technology around I could almost see stuff like internet infrastructure and electronic payments being given a treatment similar to what they gave the postal service.

Are we ready for another slow-ass, unwieldy, bureaucracy-choked morass?

 

[HumanHive]

Gab is a fucking shitshow but this is fucking wrong.

Banks need to have regulations put on them to prevent this Kind of stuff from happening

Between the liberals, the neocons, and the lolbertarians; you'll never get it passed.

 

[George Floyd Sneed]

Anyone who is a libertarian in 2020 is an idiot. Big businesses are far more tyrannical than government and if you still bleat about free markets, you are an idiot.

 

[Jimjamflimflam]

The left is sowing the wind and the entire earth is going to reap the whirlwind. In the future, there's gonna be a rightwing facist and all the things the left has done to the right is going to be put on them. And no one will come for them since everyone wants the left's shit kicked in.

That's the part most bleak about the current state. We only got to this because it was tolerated in the beginning as part of the free exchange of ideas.

If you're any non left opinion but want to keep exchange of ideas open as a principle, it feels like you will need to betray it out of self preservation to prevent a tyranny of the left.

 

[Joshuan Moon]

Are we ready for another slow-ass, unwieldy, bureaucracy-choked morass?

Oh yeah don't get me wrong it would have the same problems every government run system has. I just think a shitty slow government payment processor that's required to respect the First Amendment as an option is better than not having it as an option.

I don't want the government to fix all the ills of the world but they created this mess with their shit laws and so they need to fix it. I'd rather them just get rid of all the stupid laws but I know that isn't going to happen. So it's either force the processors to provide service to everyone like we do with utilities or create a Federally run processor. I don't find any of those options to be incompatible with the philosophical concept of "liberty" but I do recognize the government will find a way to fuck it up no matter what.

 

[Krokodil Overdose]

That's the part most bleak about the current state. We only got to this because it was tolerated in the beginning as part of the free exchange of ideas.

If you're any non left opinion but want to keep exchange of ideas open as a principle, it feels like you will need to betray it out of self preservation to prevent a tyranny of the left.

The Paradox of Tolerance is bullshit because Popper was a disingenous piece of shit who couldn't face his own conclusion, so he inserted an epicycle in the form of (basically) the Noble Lie: Intolerance of Intolerance. The conclusion from to draw from "unlimited tolerance is unsustainable" isn't "ACKSHULLY it isn't as long as you have a Central Committee of Though Police to gulag all those dang dirty intolerant people," it's "unlimited tolerance is a bad idea."

 

[Krimjob]

Pretty sure the end result will be Asian banks moving into the western territory. I've already done a bit of work for AliPay in the past for Europe and I'm fairly certain they are planning larger moves over here. Not that I'm against it though, I highly doubt China gives a fuck about what some westerner tweets about western politics, and it definitely can't be worse than the current state of payment processing we have here.