Fire Emblem series

  • 🏰 The Fediverse is up. If you know, you know.
  • Want to keep track of this thread?
    Accounts can bookmark posts, watch threads for updates, and jump back to where you stopped reading.
    Create account
I don't think it even got the animations right either; granted I didn't get through but eight or nine chapters, but the amount of hair clipping I noticed in cutscenes was absurd.
Yeah, that shit is nothing new. But I think that they've always have been cutting corners with their cutscenes. It's just that it went from being unfamiliar with the limitations of the 3DS (no feet in Awakening) to still refusing to use actual props instead of portraits
 
I discovered fire emblem within the last year and path of radiance on gamecube was one of the best games I've ever played
 
it's why I think the people who maintain they only care about gameplay are either lying, burned out or just desperate for a decent traditional-esque FE game and why SRPGMaker will unfortunately never take off as genuine competition, even with Shouzou Kaga himself giving it his blessing.
I'm not really following your logic. From my perspective as Grognard, gameplay-focused players seem to quite like Engage, though usually not as much as Fates, and it's more people who are mad about non-gameplay elements in nu-Emblem (many of whom played the Engage equivalent of FE7 Lyn mode, at most) that keep trying to convince me, Grognard, that my fun with Engage/nu-Emblem is fake, ironic, and/or lesser somehow, and that I should be playing Vestaria Saga instead. The same people who don't even know or care that VS1 got a big update this year. I've played them, and I didn't like them. I don't like Kaga's design philosophies and I think his games are ugly, unpolished, dull, and hugely padded and bloated in the context of Fire Emblem as a series. Even disregarding rom hacks that explicitly aim for Kaga's style, it's not hard to find traditional styled SRPGs in current year. Me, Grognard, is desperate for more experimentation and re-iteration on Fire Emblem's unique mechanics (or 'gimmicks' as they're called when Kaga didn't make them), not something traditional. I've played traditional to death and I'm sick of it. For anyone who wants traditional, there is an ocean of options new and old. I don't care how much the game is like Legend of Galactic Heroes when none of my decisions for most of the game are going to be as significant as equipping my chapter 1 mounted unit with a javelin or a hand axe.

No offense, but I also get the impression that your interpretation of the "the only thing that matters is gameplay" argument is grounded in the most literal possible interpretation of that sentence. I'm sure that flavor of Grognard is very much real, but fwiw, what I mean when saying that, is that I don't let it bother me that the minutiae of the story doesn't make sense, or that the models having clipping issues, or that the game looks kind of gay. I like Slay the Spire even though I think it's ugly as sin, and I don't really care when, in Thracia, Manfroy, Veld, Ishtar, Julius, and probably someone else I've forgotten all sit around eating cheetos and jacking off throughout the entire Munster escape because otherwise the story can't happen.

At the very least the production value of what was supposed to be the anniversary game for the series seemed amateurish compared to 3H.
absolutely fuckin not mate, come on now. we are not going to just ignore the muted color scheme, basic lighting-less background designs, and zero aliasing. please do not tempt me and say this is cherrypicking. please. you can call these comparisons as lopsided and unfair as you want, but i hate looking at 3H so much, man. i'm not going out of my way to hunt down examples for a more balanced comparison



Also, I'm just going to get it off my chest, not to anyone in this thread specifically just to be clear, but the wannabe oldfags and their persecution complex, storyfag elitism, double standards, and general defensiveness, hypocrisy, and refusal to look at and appreciate these games and the overall series objectively has done a huge part in souring my perceptions and enjoyment of the older games and Kaga games in general. I can't really play them anymore without some insipid nu-Emblem criticism gnawing at the back of my mind which always ends up being just as, if not way more, applicable to whatever pre-Komuro game or heckin based Kagakino hidden gemerino I'm playing at the time. I used to be that kind of Fire Emblem fan during Awakening era until I hate-played Fates, ended up really enjoying it, and had to re-think a lot of things about what it is I like about and want from the series. Not to suck myself off as a navel-gazing brain genius or whatever, but that's just not something that most people will be willing to go out of their way to do when it's so much easier and comfortable to say that FE7 (my first one) or <insert your first FE here> is the platonic ideal for one of these games, in a series whose identity is constantly reinventing itself.
 
But with Engage? I haven't managed to play the game past chapter 6 or 7 because I have absolutely no connection to the main character or those he surrounds himself with.
It's just too much, there's nothing to relate to and it's all so flaccid and fake, no substance.
By chapter 7 in PoR I was heavily invested in the small shitty conflicts the Greil Mercenaries got into, by Chapter 7 in Engage I resented every character except the Jagen.


I just don't relate to someone who is called "the divine one" and is loved by everyone immediately. That's not a fun character to play as. I don't want to be god, I want to be a broke dude going from nothing to godslayer.
The world isn't very fun to me. I only played it for the first time a few months ago, and I've genuinely forgotten who almost everyone is. I think this was the game where I did the most "I don't like you, hand your weapons off and wander into the red zone for me" units. It was unremarkably sub-par, not atrocious. I think I might have preferred atrocious.

What I don't get is the people saying that the gameplay is stellar though. It's alright, better than some, but you just slap evasion abilities on people and have people bond with Marth and Sigurd and have obscene movement and avoid and the game just sort of solves itself naturally with minimal effort on anything under maddening which I haven't bothered playing yet.
 
I'm not really following your logic.
I'm not speaking specifically about grogs - apologies if that's how you took it - but from the perspective of someone who saw a lot of people who were saying something to the effect of 'I just want good FE gameplay' after 3H. I was one them and most people in that boat who I've spoken to agree it was a monkey's paw. Video games are fundamentally distractions; the majority of people who play Fire Emblem, even the majority of people who played before Awakening, need something other than mechanics to actually draw or hold them since other video games aside from Fire Emblem exist and time is precious. That's all I meant. I'm not denying that there are people who can have unironic fun with Engage by ignoring everything outside of the gameplay of the battles, but most people who I have seen say that was what they wanted either backtracked after getting it or started grasping at straws.
The same people who don't even know or care that VS1 got a big update this year.
Probably because it was never announced on Steam, hardly something to blame them for.
Me, Grognard, is desperate for more experimentation and re-iteration on Fire Emblem's unique mechanics (or 'gimmicks' as they're called when Kaga didn't make them), not something traditional.
If Kaga was the one who made Garreg Mach/Somniel I'd still call it a gimmick, which I think is the point of most people clamoring for something 'traditional', whatever that might mean in this context. FE has a core of unique mechanics, and those have remained relatively unchanged. It's the stuff around the battles or how they're facilitated that usually gets iterated on, or something is added to the maps to add another interface for those existing mechanics. It's why people can still occasionally bring up Radiant Dawn experimenting with removing the weapon triangle or gush about Fate's pair up system; IS was loathe to make fundamental changes to the formula, so they built around it, and most of it isn't clearly flavor or gameplay. I'd qualify preparing for a chapter as gameplay even if a lot of it is facilitated through seeing what units do between chapters, and getting some semi-random bonuses for it is nice and can alter my plans, but I don't want to have to spend as much time watching idle animations of mundane activities as I would playing a chapter just to facilitate that or miss it altogether.

From my experience, that is what most people nowadays talking about wanting traditional FE mean; they want stuff that was cut with Awakening back and the removal of unnecessary bloat in the gameplay around battles, not that they want Kaga to ambush spawn them. Still, you've been in this a lot longer than I have so I understand if it carries a completely different connotation for you.
I don't care how much the game is like Legend of Galactic Heroes when none of my decisions for most of the game are going to be as significant as equipping my chapter 1 mounted unit with a javelin or a hand axe.

No offense, but I also get the impression that your interpretation of the "the only thing that matters is gameplay" argument is grounded in the most literal possible interpretation of that sentence.
I think our mentalities are just fundamentally different; I can't really imagine myself enjoying wringing FE's mechanics like a dishrag I have Paradox games for that. To be clear there's nothing wrong with that and I don't think your enjoyment is lesser, but I also don't think most people, even those who would say they take the gameplay seriously, are going to view the marginal tradeoffs of who to allocate early game weaponry that will be lost after a few chapters as being more significant for the enjoyment of their downtime than which branching story path to take.

funnily enough in LotGH most of the space battles are written like line warfare, which rarely offers any meaningful benefit on most FE maps
or that the models having clipping issues
I mentioned this specifically because it's as much a polish issue as it is anything with flavor and frankly just comes off as being incredibly cheap. Older FE games would have had a CG or, rarely, a cutscene in moments where hair physics would actually be under scrutiny (such as cradling someone important who is dying). It probably doesn't matter to you, but it also gave me the impression it didn't matter to IS either, which is not what any sane developer would want for their anniversary game.
but i hate looking at 3H so much, man. i'm not going out of my way to hunt down examples for a more balanced comparison
The color scheme is, imo, a matter of preference but I'll readily admit I was wrong about the animations being amateurish compared to 3H. Like I said, I didn't play that much into Engage, so what I remember the most about the animations were a few of the cutscenes.
 
If Kaga was the one who made Garreg Mach/Somniel I'd still call it a gimmick, which I think is the point of most people clamoring for something 'traditional', whatever that might mean in this context.
When I talk about wanting something "traditional", I mostly mean "I want to play Fire Emblem in my Fire Emblem Game". Twists on the FE formula range from fine to great. I actually don't even like the Kaga games outside of FE4 that much mostly because supports don't exist which severs replay value to me.

Child units are my favorite mechanic (awakening) and gimmick (fates, because they don't belong story wise), because they let me play more FE per FE. I like building supports, I get rewarded for building supports with a new unit and a new map, that unit comes with customization and expression and those child units have even more supports with each other. That's a perfect gameplay loop for what I value in the game, I love everything about that. I can eugenics hypermaxx or just let my favorite dumbasses talk and make even more idiots.

What I don't like is setting up dinner plans, drinking tea, doing pushups, paying a secondary currency to build supports that is non-combat related, and writing lesson plans. To me, that's less FE per FE. It was less intrusive in Engage than 3H, but I still think the Tellius base did it better.

I discovered fire emblem within the last year and path of radiance on gamecube was one of the best games I've ever played
Welcome to FE! PoR is also in my top 10 games I've ever played. I really love how well it captures classic high fantasy within its own world and tone. Great choice of game. Im also new to the thread since I didn't know we had one.

I finished both, I have a few I wanna play on Citra and I played the remake of 1 on the DS
People religiously praise the pre-English games (mostly FE3 and FE4), known as the Kaga era after their lead designer who left after FE5. A lot of people worship FE3/FE4, and for good reason. If you like pure gameplay and either don't mind or are willing to speed up painfully slow gameplay, then you will probably enjoy them. You also may find them to be a bit obtuse and mechanically dated. I'll advocate for some of the non-Kaga-emblem games. FE1 and FE2 don't exist, if you want to play them some day out of historical curiosity than thats one thing, not even Kaga considers FE1 to be real.

If you like PoR's more medium scale story and types of character interactions, I'd recommend FE7 (officially just titled Fire Emblem in English, colloquially FE7 or Blazing Blade).

If you want more of a short game and direct character study, I really like FE8 Sacred Stones.

I think Shadows of Valentia, a remake of Fire Emblem 2, for the 3DS has the best presentation / music / art / story this side of Tellius, but parts of the gameplay can get obtuse (some people may say refined and cultured).

Awakening and Fates (fates is three games, don't worry about that yet) are good later on, I'd say. They have questionable to awful stories, but have IMO very fun mechanics to play with and a really exceptional cast. I would play them whenever you decide to either give retardation or minmaxxing a try.

Strange pick to throw in, but if you are willing to give Rom Hacks a try Vision Quest is genuinely better than almost every "real" game and probably is the closest to recapturing why I like PoR that I've seen.

We may call a game 'awful' but it's because we have high standards. If were judging on an even scale, even the worst fire emblems are a solid 6/10. You really can't go wrong.
 
Last edited:
Yea I have shadows of valentia downloaded it was the one for 3ds I personally found most appealing I just haven't played it yet.
 
the issue is that FE peaked with Kaga
Most everything came from his brilliance (ironically even the dating sim shit when you learn about FE4), at the very least he laid most of the foundational cornerstones. Even after "that debacle", he continued to tweak his formula and tried out drastically different things instead of playing it safe (Berwick Saga seems like a SRPG fan's wet dream).
Yea I have shadows of valentia downloaded it was the one for 3ds I personally found most appealing I just haven't played it yet.
The music/art/story is godly.
 
Yeah I have this soundtrack on at work all the time, Hereditors of Arcaidia is my favorite song in the franchise and I’d say it’s even underrated inside in the FE Fanbase. What a great game.
 
I think our mentalities are just fundamentally different
That's really the crux of my endless spergouts, is that individual preferences...exist. All of these games have a lot of moving components, and their value is going to vary a lot from player to player, let alone from game to game, or how well the components work within those games. It's why I dislike gamewarring, it rarely accounts for context in a series that's intrinsically highly contextual. It's dismissive of individual strengths and weaknesses of individual games, and it mostly just devolves into lame grabs for gotchas instead of any interesting conversation about what works, when, why, and for whom. Pretty much no matter what kind of player you are, there's going to be at least one FE that'll suck you off just right, and having that one really good game is a good thing, especially if you like it enough to play it more than once, not an excuse for dooming over how the newest game isn't enough like The Actually Good One. The contrast between games is a valuable and important thing to keeping the series fresh, innovative, and exciting whenever a new one is on the horizon (let's just ignore how easy it probably would be to make a game that pleases everybody with a basic good story and basic good gameplay with graphics that look like <insert 80's anime here>.) It's especially valuable in a series with this much history and variety, and a big part of why FE discourse is so 🧩. Sure, I make fun of javcav emblem, the 3H meter-filling watching simulator, and Awakening's...everything, but it's not like there isn't plenty of fun to have in all of those games if they click for you. Hell, I loved all of those games for at least a little while before grog kicked in and they didn't hold up as well to grog stress testing.

We may call a game 'awful' but it's because we have high standards. If were judging on an even scale, even the worst fire emblems are a solid 6/10. You really can't go wrong.
im just gonna be honest man i think PoR's speed combined with the lack of combat forecasts and ceaseless blaring fart orchestra is unforgivable
 
But with Engage? I haven't managed to play the game past chapter 6 or 7 because I have absolutely no connection to the main character or those he surrounds himself with.
There is no character there, the main character is surrounded by people lining up to worship the ground he walks on because he is a super special awesome divine dragon or something.
That's when I dropped it. If I wanted that experience I'd watch an isekai anime.
 
It's really disappointing that FE made their equivalent of the Halo/Metal Gear Rising ost and so few people even within the FE fanbase have even heard it.
I'm quite the sucker for military drums. I knew Awakening was going to be something I could gel with the moment I heard the menu music. Seeing a lone 3D candle flickering on a tactician's desk.

On that note, I started FE4 proper after recent talk hyped me up. Gotta say despite the antiquated quality of life, it's pretty fun. It's challenging, the music is good, the characters are still written with a bit of spunk despite the game's age, and the story is really interesting. Though the art leaves a bit to be desired (heroes spoiled us all). After a lengthy prologue we finally get to the barbarian kingdom which kidnapped Sigurd's friend. Turns out some cutey named Ayra is helping to guard the first enemy fort, but she's being blackmailed to do it. After dealing with the fodder I figure I can rush into the castle and destroy the enemy commander before Ayra or any of my units kill each other.

Ayra repeatedly kicks my ass. I hit the reset button a total of 5 times. I decide to deal with the axe fodder and align my units around the enemy castle in a quarter circle, closing in each turn until Ayra is aggro'd and makes a move. Few of my units can match her so as soon as she moves it's an immediate retreat. I have Arden positioned in the center woods to tank as much punishment as possible from the unleashed Astra Nightmare. Sigurd is placed at the south, ready to move to cap as soon as Ayra makes way. The Christmas cavs and Leif's pink-haired mom kill the enemy commander and then retreat.
1.png
2.png
3.png

With Arden fleeing for his life through the forest and Ayra in murderous pursuit, Shin Sigurd races to capture the enemy castle. It will require two turns to complete the task, leaving Arden to fend for himself for one more agonizing turn...

Sadly, Arden was unable to withstand the might of Ayra's final onslaught and was butchered in the eastern forests of Verdane. But, his noble sacrifice was not in vain! With his loss comes the potential addition of a much needed not-slow-as-fuck member to our team, Ayra herself!
4.png
5.png

What if she doesn't want to fight for us you say? Welp, it would seem that Sigurd's forces have fortunately come into custody of Ayra's little nephew... so I'm sure she'll make the correct choice in the end. With Ayra on our side, the rest of this chapter is gonna be a breeze!

And we certainly won't have to worry about a whole other faction spawning out of nowhere and literally buttfucking us from behind...
6.png
1478180629195.gif
 
Doesn't this pop in some form throughout the series?
Divine dragons are basically everywhere, and you get to play with them sometimes, but the protagonist isn't ever one directly. Well, Robin is a fell dragon but that's a bad thing in that universe. FE Engage very literally makes you, yes you personally, through cutscenes shot in the first-person perspective, the father, the son, the holy ghost, Satan, Marth's best friend, and The Fire Emblem (tm) all at the same time. That is a level of power fantasy handjob that crosses over into uncomfortable.

The very first thing you see in FE Engage is a first person cutscene of two very underage children emphatically calling you "oh divine one". This never goes away, and every interaction with the main character will be like this. Very quickly you become the last divine dragon after mommy divine dragon takes entirely too long to die. This promotes you to Jesus-chan. You are the only one capable of summoning heroes from other worlds through, I kid you not, engagement rings. Engaging fuses you with the JoJo Stand avatar of an old character. You can go gambling to find minor characters or follow the story to get major ones. Everyone recognizes you as God because you look like toothpaste, so everyone immediately worships you and treats you as such. You become super best buddies with all the protagonists from old games and really become Marth's closest friend and confidant (they never have a single meaningful conversation about any topic). Eventually the plot twist is that you are actually the Satan's son but you decided to be good and got adopted by the divine dragon mommy so now your god and Satan because she gave you her life force. Then you die. You get resurrected as a zombie and the only good chapter in the game happens. You die again for real this time, so the heroes of the other games promote you into a divine spirit like them and you become The Fire Emblem (tm). As the Fire Emblem (tm) you are now a ghost of a hero. You get an engagement ring with yourself so you can also engage with yourself, and you can engage with someone else preferably your wife or dragon loli sister. That is exactly how it mechanically works, sorry. The next cutscene gives you your body back with no explanation despite the previous cutscene emphatically saying you can't return to it. The Avengers Assemble and you kick the shit out of Satan because being friends with Marth gave you infinite evasion and nothing has been capable of damaging you since chapter 3. The End.

Ayra repeatedly kicks my ass.
Certified Kaga Classic, She always manages to aggro Dew for me.
 
Back
Top Bottom