Final Fantasy XIV - Kiwi Free Company

[BarberFerdinand]

I’m pretty sure this is the video channel ran by the Zodiark trancer discord server. The expose on 4chan exposed members of the server trying to brigade the channel to intentionally pump up the number of likes and views and supposedly deleting comments critical of the video.

I genuinely don't know anything about the zodiark transer group, so I don't know if these are the same people or not. I have occasionally skimmed through the comments of the video, and it seems like the channel is perfectly willing to engage with people who disagree as opposed to blanket deleting comments.

That being said, none of that has much to do with the actual merits of their argument. Out of curiosity, was there any point specifically that you disagreed with?

 

[Gravemind]

I’m pretty sure this is the video channel ran by the Zodiark trancer discord server. The expose on 4chan exposed members of the server trying to brigade the channel to intentionally pump up the number of likes and views and supposedly deleting comments critical of the video.

So what you're saying is, we got trancers in our midst.

 

[Tari]

Out of curiosity, was there any point specifically that you disagreed with?

Probably just the fact that they're saying that Venat was flawed.

Which is ironic, given that this would be someone with "Venat Enslavement Syndrome"/being tempered by Hydaelyn arguing with someone with "Venat Derangement Syndrome"/being tempered by Zodiark, just like in the final days.

 

[Gravemind]

Didn't they straight up say before the trip to Ultima Thule that "tempering" was just a nasty little side effect the Ascians themselves slipped into the Primal summoning process specifically for the Sundered and Beast Tribes in order to help spread more disaster? Zodiark and Hydaelyn themselves shouldn't be capable of tempering.

 

[Soycast Guy]

Honestly, I’m more bored of the Dawntrail bad videos than I am of Dawntrail actually being bad at this point. I’m just farming Sphene ex so I don’t have to pf it again.

The arcadion is the only good thing that’s come out of yawntrail.

 

[BarberFerdinand]

Didn't they straight up say before the trip to Ultima Thule that "tempering" was just a nasty little side effect the Ascians themselves slipped into the Primal summoning process specifically for the Sundered and Beast Tribes in order to help spread more disaster? Zodiark and Hydaelyn themselves shouldn't be capable of tempering.

They mention that elemental summonings of a magnitude of Z and H will temper to an extent, but yes, the temperings most commonly observed were intentional sabatoge.

 

[SnowBall]

Probably just the fact that they're saying that Venat was flawed.

Which is ironic, given that this would be someone with "Venat Enslavement Syndrome"/being tempered by Hydaelyn arguing with someone with "Venat Derangement Syndrome"/being tempered by Zodiark, just like in the final days.

I’m not a Venat simp at all, I take the middle road with her that she did both good and bad, no different from Emet. (I was also being a bit snarky when I said she did nothing wrong in that earlier post.) was just pointing out it was supposedly made by the same people behind the trancer discord server. I tried going through their other videos on the channel to give them a chance but the writing and voices for all of them are so unbearable. Not because of any bias or type of opinion, just them being purely annoying.

 

[BarberFerdinand]

I’m not a Venat simp at all, I take the middle road with her that she did both good and bad, no different from Emet. (I was also being a bit snarky when I said she did nothing wrong in that earlier post.) was just pointing out it was supposedly made by the same people behind the trancer discord server. I tried going through their other videos on the channel to give them a chance but the writing and voices for all of them are so unbearable. Not because of any bias or type of opinion, just them being purely annoying.

The video I linked was pretty standard video essay fare. Its a bit long, but the topic has a lot of nuance. Most of the other videos are just sections of the main video, broken up into 15 to 20 min segments for convenience, with the same speaker.

If you can't be bothered to watch it, that's fair I guess, but it makes it a bit difficult to discuss.

 

[SnowBall]

At this point I just don’t care about video essays anymore regardless of opinions. I can’t wait for either this expansion to end or actually get good because even when good points are being discussed it’s just the same stuff being repeated. I think the worst part of DT is that the community as a whole has ran out of things to discuss so fast so we’re just going in circles.

 

[Gravemind]

At this point I just don’t care about video essays anymore regardless of opinions. I can’t wait for either this expansion to end or actually get good because even when good points are being discussed it’s just the same stuff being repeated. I think the worst part of DT is that the community as a whole has ran out of things to discuss so fast so we’re just going in circles.

That really is every patch cycle and expansion, not just Dawntrail.

 

[SnowBall]

True, it just feels like it’s far worse lately. Even memes and shitposts aren’t as funny anymore.

 

[Ravana]

I’m ready to clap like a seal and do the soyjack point when RoboBeatrix is on screen, anyway

 

[Rich Evans Ayypologist]

Ysayle’s death being anticlimactic

You're flying on a dinky ship getting shot at by a giantass cruiser and Ysale comes along with a dragon to buy you enough time to land by sacrificing herself. I wouldn't call it anything but a by-the-books JRPG moment, but it succeeds at that. HW is a by-the-books JRPG which is remarkable given how ARR is a jarring, confusing mess that makes one too many assumptions that the player will have been familiar with the lose canon of the aborted original (and it has shit voice acting).

HW has a bunch of jarring moments. Both primal fights feel thrown in, the introduction of the Warriors of Shadow is weird, the whole of the cloud level feels thematically too light-hearted, so-on. But it also spends its time continuing the story of the first game - here's Raubahn minus an arm, let's rescue him. Here's Yugiri, who's helping us out. Here's Thancred and Y'shtola, and here's a moment about Minfilia being dead as a doorknob. Even the Moogles section, which is horrendously goddamn tedious and boring and genuinely kills the pacing of HW's first third by breaking its spine in half... manages to feel like it 'fits' into the world, because there's diplomacy involving the moogles and a callback to that one random trial you did in the 100-quests. Evil Pope is not a particularly interesting character, but it sticks to HW's modus-operandi: be passable enough.

SB's weakness relative to HW is that Lyse is the most-confusing locus to focus through. The early segment feels like it's trying to give her a character, but she really doesn't... have one? And it feels verymuch like aimlessly wandering around. Doma, by contrast, has clear and obvious goals, clear character moments, and lets our focus be Yugiri and Gosetsu with a comically-campy villain. But when we go back to Ala Mhigo, it still feels like a whole lot of pointless bumbling around and Lyse still fails to have her 'moment' despite the fixation. Ysayle, Estinien, and Alphinaud as HW's core cast aren't terribly complicated characters, and yet it feels like they all get their time to shine somewhere in the mix.

 

[Sheep King]

HW has a bunch of jarring moments. Both primal fights feel thrown in, the introduction of the Warriors of Shadow is weird, the whole of the cloud level feels thematically too light-hearted, so-on.

I'm gonna kind of defend Ravana, they at least tried to tie him in with not just the characters with Ysayle facing him head-on, and the fact that you're helping the dragons of Anyx Trine, but also the whole theme of "generational conflict" he represents. None of the other primals really tie in that way. (I guess maybe Lakshmi representing happiness in servitude?) I guess I just really like the Forelands in general. It might've worked better if the Vath had been set up as a threat earlier to tie them into the larger war.

I wish that the Sea of Clouds was at least taken out of the first half, because it would've been a cool subversion if everything up to then had been the depressing frozen shithole of Coerthas, only to for the peaceful pre-war ruins and strange beauty of Dravania to make us reconsider the whole conflict.
Honestly I'd be happy if they stopped doing the whole "A zone and B zone" at the start of every expac, all it does is kill the pacing for the first 3 hours of the MSQ since nothing can happen in a fixed order. If they're going to let players off the leash and choose where to explore, I think it'd be better in the halfway point of each MSQ where pacing tends to get bogged down anyway.

I think the issue with Ysayle's death is less the execution and more that all the other characters have pretty much forgotten about her by then. The scene where Hraesvelgr tells her she's a random BPD poser is kino, but then the main characters move onto more important things before she pops back up and sacrifices herself in a fight she has no personal connection to and everyone's like "aw shucks." It feels more like a way to wrap up a loose end than a meaningful conclusion to her arc.

 

[Rich Evans Ayypologist]

None of the other primals really tie in that way.

I think the main reason people dislike it is less that it doesn't make thematic sense and more because it just feels like a weird aside, and comes cramped kindof close to the warriors of darkness thing. Lakshmi definitely feels more 'well, we're obligated to, I guess' though.

Honestly I'd be happy if they stopped doing the whole "A zone and B zone" at the start of every expac, all it does is kill the pacing for the first 3 hours of the MSQ since nothing can happen in a fixed order.

This has been to reduce server load afaik, something WoW picked up in Wrath but FF14 didn't learn until SHB. Having two zones makes the initial launch rush much more manageable.
Its pacing in SHB was fine, but EW's was a nonsense comparison (active threat that might destroy a whole region vs... 'wonder what those guys b up to?') and DT's just... I barely even remember the contrived reason it was split.

I think the issue with Ysayle's death is less the execution and more that all the other characters have pretty much forgotten about her by then.

Doesn't she hang around a bit for the revolt and then wander off to talk to the dragon while everyone else goes to punch the whale? Yeah, she tells the heretic dudes to stand down, and sacrificing herself is sortof an admittance that she has no real place in a peaceful Ishgard - which only arrives if Evil Pope doesn't win the day. Again I don't think it's really amazing stuff, but it's fine for a JRPG. The bigger issue to me is the mandatory whale-punching because we gotta have a primal fight, pacing-wise.

 

[Tari]

Zodiark and Hydaelyn themselves shouldn't be capable of tempering.

Idfk. I think despite them saying that, it's also explicitly mentioned that Elidibus was tempered by Zodiark?

 

[Gravemind]

Idfk. I think despite them saying that, it's also explicitly mentioned that Elidibus was tempered by Zodiark?

Gaia was supposed to be the first "sacrifice" to Zodiark, but because her shit happened, Themis ended up taking her place and became the "heart" of Zodiark. When Venat started gathering followers to oppose the constant sacrifices needed to power Zodiark, Themis split himself off from Zodiark and became a Primal version of himself as Elidibus. Tempering wasn't really involved in this instance.

 

[BarberFerdinand]

I remember Emet saying at some point in shadowbringers that he, Elidibus, and Lahabrea had been tempered by the act of summoning Zodiark. I'm also pretty sure that in Endwalker, they mention that although normal, untainted summoning wouldn't necessarily temper, trying to summon something as powerful as Zodiark would temper you a little due to the sheer magnitude of the energies involved.

 

[Well Intentioned]

SB's weakness relative to HW is that Lyse is the most-confusing locus to focus through. The early segment feels like it's trying to give her a character, but she really doesn't... have one? And it feels verymuch like aimlessly wandering around.

I agree that Lyse was a bizarre choice for a central character because the whole Yda --> Lyse thing seemed to be a complete asspull that only seems to be because they wanted pretty blonde white girl as the poster character.

But there is a pretty solid structure to the early parts -- you're breaking into Ala Mhigan territory for the first time in years, getting a lay of the land and reaching out to those who are actively resisting.

It works as an introduction to a country the player doesn't know a ton about by using Lyse as this dilettante shitbird who is resented and liked by the populace.

I still think Raubahn should've been in Lyse's role because everything is there for a 'redemption' arc for him, because Lyse just being anointed as the leader despite having no qualifications and being functionally useless is a bit unbelieveable.

The actual story beats and details as to why we're doing shit in there makes sense largely, but it is dragged down by a poor lead character choice.

 

[Rich Evans Ayypologist]

But there is a pretty solid structure to the early parts -- you're breaking into Ala Mhigan territory for the first time in years, getting a lay of the land and reaching out to those who are actively resisting.

That's a part of why it feels like running around to me - because Lyse should have a better understanding of how-it-was. That is the gist of why we rely on her as something of a guide, but she just kindof bumbles around and it never really feels like there's much of a plan. It just feels like she's just there because, and we're just there because.

This could have been alright (if a little awkward) had she developed a real character or had big moments amidst all this... but that doesn't really happen. Her development is so glacial and so simple that it saps any momentum away from that segment. Her character is "she's nice, she doesn't like tyrants, and she sometimes makes jokes" all the way up until the Endwalker Garlemald section (and the healer role-quests), where she actually gives off the impression and tone of having a personality.