Final Fantasy XIV - Kiwi Free Company

[Dave.]

He's not even our buddy though. He just works with us and his rival Cid because it's more convenient to do so and he wants to surpass Cid directly... Which he kind of does in some ways, but, for the most part, a lot of his technological successes come from the combined efforts of both inventors.

Spoiler

I actually respect Quintus to some degree for sticking to his guns, no matter how foolish they might've been, and I believe that's part of the point of his character that you're going to take away your own views on his actions, much like with Zenos. Looking at him one way, you could call him a foolish coward for being so scared of embracing change and surrendering that he decided suicide was the only way out. Looking at it another way, even though the Garlean throne was tarnished and Garlemald as a nation was effectively destroyed, Quintus remained a loyal patriot until the very end. "Death before dishonor" and all that jazz. Because as much as you might criticize those "societal values" and "might makes right" mentality, and perhaps rightly so, for some of those characters, they were the most important things to them. Some were able to survive even with their entire societal foundation completely collapsed in every sense and found ways to move on, and others, particularly the "old guard" such as Quintus, refused to betray their ideals, even if it meant facing a bitter end.

Spoiler

Yeah, but is it worth maintaining patriotism if it means the rubble around you piles up and the corpses of your own people begin to pile up especially if it's due to starvation and resource depravation? To me, I think it's dumb and that's the reason why I have personal tribulations with Quintus. It doesn't also help that that ambush he staged would've been suicide and lead to more deaths of his people that he wanted to save and protect not realizing that protecting those very lives he holds dear are starving and freezing to death. To me, and this is just my perspective, it's a matter of setting aside ideals or sticking with those ideals even if it means death and Quintus chose the latter. Can I admire him for sticking to his guns? Yeah, to an extant. Can I think that it's a bit retarded to do so given the situation at hand? Yeah and that's where I mainly come from. He's just a frustrating character for me and that's probably the point. Jullus was also starting to show tribulations with Quintus' perspective as well after he was done interacting with Alphinaud and Alisae so even some of his men were starting to see that, yeah, this ferocious upholding of classic ideals is suicide.

But I'm not going to post "QUEST COMPLETE" and dance on his grave while taking GPOSE selfies in front of a blood stained banner like some redditors do (idk if I'm just a soyboy but those memes creep me out).

 

[Local Degenerate]

Spoiler

Yeah, but is it worth maintaining patriotism if it means the rubble around you piles up and the corpses of your own people begin to pile up especially if it's due to starvation and resource depravation? To me, I think it's dumb and that's the reason why I have personal tribulations with Quintus. It doesn't also help that that ambush he staged would've been suicide and lead to more deaths of his people that he wanted to save and protect not realizing that protecting those very lives he holds dear are starving and freezing to death. To me, and this is just my perspective, it's a matter of setting aside ideals or sticking with those ideals even if it means death and Quintus chose the latter. Can I admire him for sticking to his guns? Yeah, to an extant. Can I think that it's a bit retarded to do so given the situation at hand? Yeah and that's where I mainly come from. He's just a frustrating character for me and that's probably the point. Jullus was also starting to show tribulations with Quintus' perspective as well after he was done interacting with Alphinaud and Alisae so even some of his men were starting to see that, yeah, this ferocious upholding of classic ideals is suicide.

But I'm not going to post "QUEST COMPLETE" and dance on his grave while taking GPOSE selfies in front of a blood stained banner like some redditors do (idk if I'm just a soyboy but those memes creep me out).

NGL, I kinda did too. Not actually post Gpose selfies, because fuck that, but I certainly danced my merry dance.

Spoiler

People like that piss me off to an unreasonable degree, as most things do, because you're a leader. When you become a leader, you need to look beyond yourself, and consider your men. If you want to eat a gun, feel free, but don't shove your barrel down their throats too. What he did, to me, is no different than murdering his own men because he couldn't see past his nose. And continuously poking the bear that is the WoL, while also housing that bear directly beside his already dying subordinates... For a culture of ruthless efficiency, the man was just a failure on all accounts.

That being said, I do wish we could've heard more of him in his prime. Maybe some Echo flashes of why his men were so loyal to him.

 

[Vapewizard]

I like how the upcoming "Clockwork Solus" minion is probably gonna spark discourse again between the Emet stans and the malding internet commies going "Nooooo you liking the villain means you support fascism noooooo!!!"

 

[FoolhardStar]

While it'd be funny to say they just want to fuck the pixels, I think they honestly do enjoy it, they're just too stupid to grasp it. Case in point, every redditor's hate-boner to Zenos. That's not to say every one of them hates him, but everyone that does hates him for the same reason: They're too retarded to grasp that he's clinically depressed to an absolutely insane degree. Hilariously, redditors that love him love him for the same reason (well, that plus 'I want him to fuck me.')

It's rare that you see a character be misinterpreted in multiple ways. Either Zenos is the most boring character ever with no depth, or he's a prettyboy that you can redeem and fix with a hug like it's an unrealistic dating sim.

Spoiler: Opinions feat. actual spoilers

I can almost understand the first take, since his character type is divisive. I could easily see someone getting bored of him after the third "must lose even if you clean the floor with him" fight to the point that they just drown out the dialogue where he directly tells you things like: He's been bored for all his life, you're the closest thing to a friend he's ever had, and in spite of murder being the thing he's known for inside and outside the Empire, he doesn't particularly enjoy it.
Zenos is emptier than empty. His mom's been dead since he was born, Varis isn't exactly taking home Father of the Year, and I can only imagine how Solus was with him. He's as warm and sentimental as a killer whale in Antarctica hungry for some seals, and it REALLY shows in the latter half of Stormblood and whenever you see him in Endwalker. His upbringing has left him fucked, to an extent I don't think a lot of people catch.

The second take baffles me. I completely understand loving the guy (I sure do), but seriously thinking you can fix that dumptruck of a man via a hug and a kiss on the Third Eye is demented. He killed the mentor that taught him his signature attack at the age of 14 (this is hard to find anywhere outside of Encyclopedia Eorzea and his page on the FF wiki) and was more disappointed that he didn't feel anything afterward. He murdered his father with a smile on his face, then just casually cut him open with Fandaniel later. He put his homeland into a cataclysmic meatgrinder, subjecting hundreds of thousands, possibly millions of his own countrymen to unfiltered suffering, just so his friend could have some "entertainment". And when he's confronted about what he did in Endwalker, he doesn't even give a shit and asks why his accuser cares so much. That's beyond fixable, if you ask me, and I think he even acknowledges something's fucky with him at some point near the end of Endwalker. I have no idea how someone could avoid those massive neon red flags of "YOU CAN'T FIX HIM" beyond furious dialogue-skipping or just ignoring the entirety of In From the Cold.

I'm not sure I can think of another character more misunderstood in this game. Emet-Selch and just about every Garlean gets some discourse, but nothing like this.

 

[John Titor]

I'll admit I didn't like Zenos at first because he comes across as a character deliberately designed to be hateable after a line of reasonable villains and SE found that people might find the Garleans too likeable (apparently not the case lmao). And in fairness, you have to read the short story to realize that Zenos may have depression.

Spoiler: What are other signs of plotlets?

• People still thinking Primals are gods when the story keeps hammering home that they are like tulpas
• Reducing Heavensward to "church bad"

 

[Local Degenerate]

And in fairness, you have to read the short story to realize that Zenos may have depression.

Or...listen to him speak. Like...at all.

Anyone who understands depression at all would hear his monolog at the end of Stormbringers, and instantly understand. Which, I remind you, came out before the short story.

Also, don't get me started on Heavensward. By far the worst expansion (though still a fucking amazing game), and it only gets praised as much as it does because 'Hauchefaunt tho'

 

[Local Coyote]

So I got convinced to give the game a shot and I'm all in. Just reached HW, so far pretty fun but Jesus Christ did they mandate the worst fucking multiplayer function in the game; the Crystal Tower.

I went in with the person who introduced me to the game, a very chill tank. Even he was apologizing for how inconsiderate and pushy these parties were and was desperately trying to convince me it's not a raid thing, it's a Crystal Tower thing. Even then I'm kind of soured on raids since that was my first introduction.

 

[Gravemind]

Spoiler

Yeah, but is it worth maintaining patriotism if it means the rubble around you piles up and the corpses of your own people begin to pile up especially if it's due to starvation and resource depravation? To me, I think it's dumb and that's the reason why I have personal tribulations with Quintus. It doesn't also help that that ambush he staged would've been suicide and lead to more deaths of his people that he wanted to save and protect not realizing that protecting those very lives he holds dear are starving and freezing to death. To me, and this is just my perspective, it's a matter of setting aside ideals or sticking with those ideals even if it means death and Quintus chose the latter. Can I admire him for sticking to his guns? Yeah, to an extant. Can I think that it's a bit retarded to do so given the situation at hand? Yeah and that's where I mainly come from. He's just a frustrating character for me and that's probably the point. Jullus was also starting to show tribulations with Quintus' perspective as well after he was done interacting with Alphinaud and Alisae so even some of his men were starting to see that, yeah, this ferocious upholding of classic ideals is suicide.

But I'm not going to post "QUEST COMPLETE" and dance on his grave while taking GPOSE selfies in front of a blood stained banner like some redditors do (idk if I'm just a soyboy but those memes creep me out).

Spoiler

And you are rightly entitled to that opinion. Like I said, I think it's more up to the individual to decide for themselves the validity and absurdity of Quintus van Cinna's course of action. To be fair, he does show some sign that he ultimately put his people's lives above his own personal loyalty by ultimately leaving it up to them to decide whether to surrender to the Eorzean Alliance, choosing to end his own life in disgrace instead. The argument can be made that he only made such a decision when left with no other viable option, but, conversely, it can be pointed out that he was still clinging to the idea that he would receive reinforcements from the other surviving Legions and, thus, still had a fighting chance, even though the circumstances proved this wasn't the case.

Don't take this a particular endorsement of his actions. I'm just really playing devil's advocate here. I think it's important to understand both sides of the argument when it comes to Quintus and decide on your view from there. "Understandable, but retarded" is just as valid as any other viewpoint.

I'll admit I didn't like Zenos at first because he comes across as a character deliberately designed to be hateable after a line of reasonable villains and SE found that people might find the Garleans too likeable (apparently not the case lmao). And in fairness, you have to read the short story to realize that Zenos may have depression.

Spoiler: What are other signs of plotlets?

• People still thinking Primals are gods when the story keeps hammering home that they are like tulpas
• Reducing Heavensward to "church bad"

I don't think I ever touched that short story yet and I still picked up on it fairly early on with Zenos' general presentation. Really just a matter of thinking critically about his characterization using what's given to you.

 

[Local Degenerate]

So I got convinced to give the game a shot and I'm all in. Just reached HW, so far pretty fun but Jesus Christ did they mandate the worst fucking multiplayer function in the game; the Crystal Tower.

I went in with the person who introduced me to the game, a very chill tank. Even he was apologizing for how inconsiderate and pushy these parties were and was desperately trying to convince me it's not a raid thing, it's a Crystal Tower thing. Even then I'm kind of soured on raids since that was my first introduction.

Yeah, I can see that. The problem is twofold though.
1) It's supremely early content, which means everyone has run it to death.
and more relevant:
2) There's an event going on which rewards a currency for running old content. Which means people are going to sweat, and be pissed off it's not going even faster.

Later raids don't have this problem, just due to a shorter life span meaning people are less sick and fucking tired of it. That being said, I get plenty of good CT runs too. It's just the moogle farmers out these days.

 

[Gravemind]

Surprised our other local storysperg @Zeke Von Genbu hasn't kicked down the doors of this thread yet to ream all of our asses with one of his usual loresperging essays and explaining his point of view. I'd be curious to see how he weighs in on this discussion.

 

[Zeke Von Genbu]

Surprised our other local storysperg @Zeke Von Genbu hasn't kicked down the doors of this thread yet to ream all of our asses with one of his usual loresperging essays and explaining his point of view. I'd be curious to see how he weighs in on this discussion.

I'll be real, I haven't touched or paid much attention to any of what's happened in the past week or so within FFXIV besides watching the 6.2 trailer. I bought a Shirogane house through the lottery because I'm the best FFXIV player of all time, saw what the fuck island sanctuary was, and then I have been spending all my gaming hours playing Xenoblade 3 (another series I can write essays of spergy nonsense about ofc).

But for you? I'll get to it probably this weekend to see what the fuck is happening, because apparently it is exciting. I don't even think I finished 6.1 anyway.

Edit: Oh we're just talking about Zenos, I thought 6.2 came out and something exciting happened. I'll type an essay about Zenos tomorrow.

 

[Gravemind]

I'll be real, I haven't touched or paid much attention to any of what's happened in the past week or so within FFXIV besides watching the 6.2 trailer. I bought a Shirogane house through the lottery because I'm the best FFXIV player of all time, saw what the fuck island sanctuary was, and then I have been spending all my gaming hours playing Xenoblade 3 (another series I can write essays of spergy nonsense about ofc).

But for you? I'll get to it probably this weekend to see what the fuck is happening, because apparently it is exciting. I don't even think I finished 6.1 anyway.

Edit: Oh we're just talking about Zenos, I thought 6.2 came out and something exciting happened. I'll type an essay about Zenos tomorrow.

I mostly meant the current discussion surrounding both Zenos and Quintus.

 

[Vapewizard]

Also, don't get me started on Heavensward. By far the worst expansion (though still a fucking amazing game), and it only gets praised as much as it does because 'Hauchefaunt tho'

I can't speak for other people's reasons for liking it but I think the thing that makes Heavensward interesting is the parallels and character dynamics between Ysayle and Estinien and Hraesvelgr and Aymeric. The circumstances of the story force these people with entirely different perspectives and values to reconcile their differences to the point of having to make sacrifices like killing their relatives all based on the hope that future generations won't fuck it up again.

 

[Zeke Von Genbu]

I mostly meant the current discussion surrounding both Zenos and Quintus.

Fuck it, can't sleep with my autism spergy brain going on this topic as I started reading back. So fuck it, you get a double feature.

Spoiler: Quintus

Quintus is fine, I don't like him as a person per say, but I like him as a character for someone so relatively minor. I adore his purpose in the story despite how brief it is. He was pretty much what I wanted from Garlemald's MSQ section when I remember sperging about how much Garlemald felt like it got botched up after SB.

Quintus is an old general in an extremely rapidly changing world, he has been crippled to the point of uselessness in a martial heavy society, he has had everything he believed in become a ruse, a lie, and now he's stuck. He isn't like Gaius who can just fuck off away from Garlemald if he wants to, and more or less did, he is literally stuck. He's more or less a cripple who's only choice and freedom from his current position is putting a bullet in his mouth. I don't blame him for that, and I don't call him a coward and end it at that. I feel bad for him on some level because I'd at minimum heavily consider doing the same if I were in his position. Plus it helps absolve his soldiers of the coming pact with the WoL's group given he had just organized a raid on their base camp before he shot himself and disbanded his troop, now he can at least let them choose their own path in life (gee I wonder where I heard this before...?).

He makes a reasonably philosophical argument that has been used in real life when looking back at history to the twins that I see far too many people talk shit about. Quintus effectively says that peace is merely the absence of war and war is the default state of humanity (and all FFXIV races effectively are "humanity", they aren't really different enough to not be roughly considered "human" broadly speaking). For current year 1st worlders, this is an insane murder maniac position, as for the most part we've had quite a steady ride since the end of the cold war (though who knows what the fuck will happen in say 5-10 years), but if we look at history Quintus is quite right. War fucking sucks and all, but their is something to be said that an extensive time of peace (let alone an eternal cooperative world wide unity like what the Scions want) is extremely debatable if that can literally ever happen. So if that is true, why not strike first? He who strikes first has the best chance at victory, and if your entire life is living in a cold hellscape like Garlemald when put on top of Garlemald's historical context. It just makes sense to think this way if you want to survive. Mind you, this way of thinking leads to other problems as shown in Ultima Thule with the Omnicrons, but it isn't a very unreasonable point of view within the short term span of one's own lifetime.

So fuck everyone. They'll just fuck you over anyway. I may dislike those values because I am a sappy fag who doesn't like what he embodies and I'd rather try to push for what the Scions would want, but I can't just go "lol you're wrong you nazi.". Because his points aren't really invalid to me given the context. Anyone who doesn't understand what Qunitus is talking about legit doesn't know Garlemald or understand what the fuck this story is. This is why I sperg so hard about people not knowing what being the WoL should be.

Spoiler: Zenos

tl;dr summary of what I think of Zenos:

SB Zenos is boring imo even if I get him. I just don't like his archetype, he doesn't make a good impression at the start, and his reason feels strange within SB's story when SB is already a jumbled mess. Feels like we're doing far too many things at once, and Zenos feels like a really weird way to end all of this. SB Zenos feels like he's in the wrong expansion or something, for how they try to build him up for EW. Because with EW he makes sense but he has occupied so much screen time of feeling like a really weird waste of time that part of me was over him even if I stopped hating him by EW.

ShB Zenos sucks because I think he was fine dead and he just doesn't do anything besides look insane at this stage. He is pretty much in an interlude until EW happens.

EW Zenos is interesting and fits in this expansion, his scene with Julius was practically talking to me with my issues with him up to this point which I find interesting to say the least and slightly spooky. I don't know if he was worth bringing back and taking up so much air time in the past though.

I also told Zenos to piss off before our final fight and that I was sending him back to the seven hells so he stops fucking with me. Though that was partially IC roleplay, but I still disagree with him within the context of how I understand the WoL.

I understand Zenos is a depressed to the point of being I don't know if I'd call him non-functioning, but he isn't exactly healthy. Maybe I'd say Zenos is a threat to life itself with his mindset, despite him ironically respecting it quite a bit he just has a really insane-o way of respecting it. Zenos and life are just a weird mix.

What I hated about Zenos in SB is his fanfic-tier power scaling compared to everyone else and how that works in-game. I think if he was more our equal back in Rhaglr's reach, and our selfless virtues kept him from getting the true duel he felt he was about to get as we try to assist in the raid he lead instead of continuing the fight while he watched on. After that he would then he act as a final boss who sits on his throne and waits until the focus is 100% onto him, like what he wanted in EW, I'd like him better in SB. Ignoring the gameplay problems of how Zenos' encounters work, I just don't like it the way he was hyped up when he first stepped into the plot directly, he feels like an asspull to build tension but he is so blase about everything that I don't fear him at all. It made these moments feel more comical or annoying then intense. Which kind of sucks for the main villain to say the least, Thordan might be whatever but at least I don't find his presence almost a punchline (besides JRPG pope = bad trope, which I felt Thordan did a reasonable job trying to be different).

I also personally disagree with the "He is the mirror of the WoL." thing they try to do unless it is a meta interpretation for the WoL's player specifically which I know I've said here a handful of times. Zenos' problem here is he has all the power of the WoL, but his drive feels backwards as I view the WoL as a altruistic classical hero who embodies the 4 cardinal virtues and Zenos doesn't feel like the opposite of that nor is he the same. All Zenos is the opposite of is that he's selfish and self serving to an extreme, he has showings of having a twisted sense of fairness (see: Fordola) if you can appeal to him through your drive and strength. He tries to make parallels with his "I like fighting, and so do you. I can see it in you." but I think they suck and only work if you see the WoL as a video game avatar for the player and not a character with some kind of actual feelings, which we must have those because many character comment about our emotional burdens (See: Fordola again, Hermes, or EW's twitter bird.). So I believe the WoL has actual emotion and thoughts that drive them forward and compel them to keep going, just they're vague on purpose and are at best meant to mirror how the player is meant to feel. To me denying Zenos is the most canonical option.

SB Zenos is also botched by how messy SB is in general, too much shit going on and he just feels out of place. Maybe that's the point, but I don't think it works. Plus I just hate this character archetype, they're so fucking boring to me and it wasn't until EW that it was fixed.

EW Zenos I've said in the past ironically shows how much he values the game's message on life the most, and has the most respect for life compared to his antagonist peers. Zenos openly acknowledges that he doesn't care if people like their platitudes, their creeds, their laws, their morals, this man doesn't give a fuck at all. He just has his own way of doing things and he acts on it. It is so brazenly simple yet fairly potent once you have the entirety of the context and of his perspective. His speech with Jullis makes so much sense while frankly changing how his character should be seen looking back, but if that was worth bringing him back? I don't know about that.

I personally unironically wanted him to become like Hiei from Yu Yu Hakusho or Vegeta, where he sees some sense of value in the WoL as a person beyond just their strength and changes in small ways going forward. That over time in a weird way does become at least a positive person to exist and not a negative to the world with his hedonistic depression that literally fucked up the world. I saw the idea that if Zenos is just not going to die and even he realizes he won't die, then he needs to make his own way that he can live with and actually receive and not just force our hand to satisfy his needs for an eternity.

Maybe he can find some kind of synthesis between what we embody and what he believes in, that could be interesting, but frankly FFXIV doesn't kill off characters enough and does fake out deaths too often. So fuck it, he can stay dead this time so we don't just undo a death again.

Did I do good Mr. Gravemind?

Also, don't get me started on Heavensward. By far the worst expansion (though still a fucking amazing game), and it only gets praised as much as it does because 'Hauchefaunt tho'

My ass, Stormblood botches up almost everything it does with fake out bullshit save for one time it actually settles on something which really ruins this supposed gritty war narrative they're trying to go for. Ala Mhigo is badly explained and is a horrible missed opportunity (Monk got fucking robbed), Fordola is a fucking disappointment for such a strong start and is pretty much a villain for Lyse to beat up during most her time in SB, Hingashi is barely touched on and I'm sure most people forget Kugane is on the continent of Hingashi because no one gives a shit about Hingashi or probably even remembers it besides lorefags like me, and Doma is just fucking there really in its own expansion.

I understand the Azem Steppe more than I do Doma unless I dig through side quests and lore book shit, and that place is arguably the most filler zone for the overarching plot. The underwater society is barely used despite being probably the most interesting aesthetic in Othard. Gosetsu also got fucking robbed, I was so disappointed with how that character ended up when I played it in 2017 and it gets worse the more I think about it.

Stormblood is the worst expansion story even if I ignore Haurchefant's entire existence, I understand Ishgard and value what it brings. Ala Mhigo and Doma don't even feel finished unless you go really out of your way, which is so confusing because Ishgard was handled fine. We have more jobs from that region, had more lore lingering around about that nation, and it still doesn't feel done. I don't know how you do that, but they did it.

 

[John Titor]

Or...listen to him speak. Like...at all.

Anyone who understands depression at all would hear his monolog at the end of Stormbringers, and instantly understand. Which, I remind you, came out before the short story.

Also, don't get me started on Heavensward. By far the worst expansion (though still a fucking amazing game), and it only gets praised as much as it does because 'Hauchefaunt tho'

I did say it was an early impression I had and I'll admit my opinion of him changed during the SB finale because it showed that there might have been more to him than what they presented. It's also been a while that I touched SB so I don't remember the exact details. I'll also say in my defense that I didn't play the MSQ back to back because I did a lot of side content.

 

[Rich Evans Ayypologist]

Heavensward is good because it has basic understanding of pacing, story acts, and how to not have sections that completely kill all tension and forward momentum. Each act advances multiple plotlines within the self-contained narrative as well as within the overarching one, and juggles them well enough.

That level of multi-track development doesn't really return for some time (arguably ever), as the writing becomes much more fixated on the immediate story of the expansion than slotting its place within the wider picture; it begins using the postgame narrative to primarily achieve that.

although EW might change that.

nope, they introduce a second character that works on the exact themes that they had built up for Zenos in the last give-or-take five-percent of the overall story, apropos of nothing. "But didn't he get a lot of development in the ShB postgame?" yes and it goes to exactly nothing, one of the biggest and most unnecessary misses of the expansion byfar

 

[Fcret]

So I got convinced to give the game a shot and I'm all in. Just reached HW, so far pretty fun but Jesus Christ did they mandate the worst fucking multiplayer function in the game; the Crystal Tower.

I went in with the person who introduced me to the game, a very chill tank. Even he was apologizing for how inconsiderate and pushy these parties were and was desperately trying to convince me it's not a raid thing, it's a Crystal Tower thing. Even then I'm kind of soured on raids since that was my first introduction.

The CT raids were the first 24-mans the game got and they've basically been hit by every possible stealth nerf in the game with system changes:
1) Originally 24-mans were designed to have 2 tanks in each alliance. The change to 1 tank, 2 healers, and 5 dps made everything burn super quickly.
2) Substats make everyone way more powerful. Originally tanks had parry on their gear and DPS got accuracy. Parry got changed into tenacity and accuracy got turned into direct-hit rate (both at 1:1), and both of those substats translate into raw DPS increases for characters that have them. It's not a small increase either.
3) The ilvl cap is 135 for pretty much all level 50 content without explicit ilvl syncs. This means most of your group is doing Labyrinth of the Ancients 80 ilvls above what it was tuned for and Syrcus Tower 60 ilvls above what it was tuned for.
4) Everyone is just baseline stronger due to potency creep. This is especially true for jobs introduced after Heavensward (Samurai, Red Mage, Dancer, Gunbreaker, Sage, and Reaper) because they don't really bother tuning those at all for low level duties.
5) The old protect, stoneskin, and tank stance defensive buffs have been made baseline in all the jobs since those abilities got removed. Everyone is significantly tankier now meaning healers can - you guessed it - spend more time doing DPS.
6) Accessories have main stats now. They used to just have secondary stats so, even if you go in at ilvl 50, you're rocking significantly more main stat than you would have had at the time. Including VIT so now you have more HP too (see 5).
etc.

Pretty much every 24-man series besides CT and the first HW one will have you doing mechanics and not entirely facerolling bosses. But none of those are mandatory for the MSQ like CT is so you probably won't see them until you finish MSQ and come back to do old content.

 

[Gravemind]

So I got convinced to give the game a shot and I'm all in. Just reached HW, so far pretty fun but Jesus Christ did they mandate the worst fucking multiplayer function in the game; the Crystal Tower.

I went in with the person who introduced me to the game, a very chill tank. Even he was apologizing for how inconsiderate and pushy these parties were and was desperately trying to convince me it's not a raid thing, it's a Crystal Tower thing. Even then I'm kind of soured on raids since that was my first introduction.

I've come back to this post at least 3 times since last night and I still don't understand what your grievance is. Is it the fact that everyone rushes ahead? Burns bosses down so fast that they can disregard mechanics? Because the Crystal Tower raids don't really have anything to "experience" within the beat-by-beat moments of their gameplay and getting through gameplay segments as fast as possible is honestly the best way to proceed. There is absolutely nothing you'll miss from the gameplay portion of THOSE raids specifically.

Honestly, as someone who suffered through the original incarnations at ilevel for each of those initial three raids when they respectively got added to the game, I can tell you it's way better this way. Labyrinth was such a fucking chore back in the day that a full run could take you nearly up to two hours, and that's provided you didn't spend the first hour wiping to the very first boss repeatedly because no one knew how to do the mechanic of pulling the skeletons to the far edges of platforms, no one knew why the dragon was shitting out enough AoEs back to back to keep wiping the raid, and everyone wanted to be carried regardless because "they're not some sweaty tryhard who should have to learn game mechanics, they have a LIFE," and "they pay, they play the way they want to, you don't pay their subs".

I much prefer things being braindead easy in cases like that so that I don't have to suffer through other players' idiocy and sense of entitlement anymore.

 

[Local Coyote]

I've come back to this post at least 3 times since last night and I still don't understand what your grievance is. Is it the fact that everyone rushes ahead? Burns bosses down so fast that they can disregard mechanics? Because the Crystal Tower raids don't really have anything to "experience" within the beat-by-beat moments of their gameplay and getting through gameplay segments as fast as possible is honestly the best way to proceed. There is absolutely nothing you'll miss from the gameplay portion of THOSE raids specifically.

Honestly, as someone who suffered through the original incarnations at ilevel for each of those initial three raids when they respectively got added to the game, I can tell you it's way better this way. Labyrinth was such a fucking chore back in the day that a full run could take you nearly up to two hours, and that's provided you didn't spend the first hour wiping to the very first boss repeatedly because no one knew how to do the mechanic of pulling the skeletons to the far edges of platforms, no one knew why the dragon was shitting out enough AoEs back to back to keep wiping the raid, and everyone wanted to be carried regardless because "they're not some sweaty tryhard who should have to learn game mechanics, they have a LIFE," and "they pay, they play the way they want to, you don't pay their subs".

I much prefer things being braindead easy in cases like that so that I don't have to suffer through other players' idiocy and sense of entitlement anymore.

So I am playing Bard. First run through the place, doing pretty good to follow instructions from Paladin friend, doing my part to throw out songs and stick to the people who could use the benefits. On a room boss I just didn't move quick enough and bit it. Just by poor timing I got thrown into cut scene hell seconds after from the room boss dying and instead of rezzing me, everyone just left me behind and moved onto the next section. I would've been totally lost if it weren't for my Paladin friend staying behind.

I don't expect to be rezzed mid skirmish. Clearly there's other priorities and I can wait. Hell I would've even taken a rez and the healer chewing me out for being a dumbfuck, because in fairness it was dumbfuckery that got me killed. It's kind of shitty to just ditch when I can't really do anything and before the run I gave warning it was my first time.

I would've totally skipped Crystal Tower but it's required for MSQ to get to HW.

 

[John Titor]

So I am playing Bard. First run through the place, doing pretty good to follow instructions from Paladin friend, doing my part to throw out songs and stick to the people who could use the benefits. On a room boss I just didn't move quick enough and bit it. Just by poor timing I got thrown into cut scene hell seconds after from the room boss dying and instead of rezzing me, everyone just left me behind and moved onto the next section. I would've been totally lost if it weren't for my Paladin friend staying behind.

I don't expect to be rezzed mid skirmish. Clearly there's other priorities and I can wait. Hell I would've even taken a rez and the healer chewing me out for being a dumbfuck, because in fairness it was dumbfuckery that got me killed. It's kind of shitty to just ditch when I can't really do anything and before the run I gave warning it was my first time.

I would've totally skipped Crystal Tower but it's required for MSQ to get to HW.

In many cases, it's better to warp back to the start and use the teleporter to avoid res sickness. It's possible your team assumed you'd do that.