Euro migrant crisis

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Dudeofteenage said:
It just would be weird to accept Shi'a refugees from Iraq, let alone Iran or Azerbaijan, on the basis that they've probably been persecuted for their religion.

I mean personally I am in favour of letting in pretty much anybody, but if you're going to discriminate on the basis of religion, it'd be good to be aware of the facts.
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DuskEngine said:
The reason why ISIS was able to find such fertile ground among Iraqi Sunnis is that many of them felt disenfranchised by the majority Shiite government.
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Alright, I admit that the Shia situation is very complex, but it can't be denied how horrifically persecuted Christians and Yazidis are. I just believe that they deserve to be the top priority because their situation is so much more dire than Muslims'. Under ISIS, Christians must either convert to Islam, get heavily taxed, or die (although it seems like ISIS is more fond of just murdering them), while Yazidis have it even worse; the men are slaughtered outright while the woman and children are sold as sex slaves.

Even in non-ISIS territories, non-Muslims (and even Muslims who aren't the "right" ethnicity, like the Kurds) face terrible discrimination and persecution in most Muslim majority countries. Again, I'm more sympathetic to the plight of a persecuted minority rather than a majority, even if the majority has it bad, too.
 
Cosmos said:
Doesn't surprise me at all. Sweden tends to be a little too open-minded about stuff like this. They're very well-intentioned, but that sometimes overshadows being practical.
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Yeah, Sweden pretty much has well meaning self destruction down to an art at this point
 
Not one bit. By the time any major changes on immigration are a political possibility the whole Syrian crisis thing will be long over and forgotten (in the US) anyway.
 
MrTroll said:
Not one bit. By the time any major changes on immigration are a political possibility the whole Syrian crisis thing will be long over and forgotten (in the US) anyway.
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Immigration is like the drug war, politicans want to huff and puff about it, but as soon as they're in office they find the status quo is far easier to drag their feet on than trying to change things to either the liberal or conservative solutions without risking alienating the moderate bases.
 
Simple answer? Do what some other countries used to do.

Unless you have a desirable skill of some kind (high education, military experience (leading/commanding), and so forth) don't let the immigrants in.

This will sound A-loggish or even dickish. My idea:

Advertise: "You can come to our country if you pass a series of tests, they will be presented to you in your native language. If you fail them, you will be deported or executed should you resist deportation."

Needless to say, give a study-guide beforehand. Let them stay in a center to study it for up to a day or three. Systematically call the immigrants into testing facilities.

Have the test consist of simple questions such as adhering to the culture of the country in question, penalties for breaking major laws (rape, murder, theft, littering - the latter being the major issue with the immigrants), and so forth.

In short, give them a chance. Even if they pass it, only give them up to two months of government assistance - adequate time to find a job. Cut it off if they do not find one.

On immigrants, also have a MUCH MUCH less tolerance policy. You break a major law (anything more than 30 years in prison), you're dead. You break minor law, you get the max penalty for it - no questions. You don't get a slap on the wrist. You are a full-grown adult, have come into a country that is not your's, and have committed a crime. You are expected to act like a human being. If you do not, you will be punished.

In the case of illegal immigration? If one is found to have a fake passport, is on government assistance, or something of the like without having been accepted in the county? Death sentence immediately. No 'deportation' as that costs money for the country in general. You broke a sovereign country's border in an attempt to get access to its resources. You are not a 'desperate' person. You are classified as an invader. No life in prison - as you will be costing money, food, and space.
 
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Doctor Professor Timon said:
Simple answer? Do what some other countries used to do.

Unless you have a desirable skill of some kind (high education, military experience (leading/commanding), and so forth) don't let the immigrants in.

This will sound A-loggish or even dickish. My idea:

Advertise: "You can come to our country if you pass a series of tests, they will be presented to you in your native language. If you fail them, you will be deported or executed should you resist deportation."

Needless to say, give a study-guide beforehand. Let them stay in a center to study it for up to a day or three. Systematically call the immigrants into testing facilities.

Have the test consist of simple questions such as adhering to the culture of the country in question, penalties for breaking major laws (rape, murder, theft, littering - the latter being the major issue with the immigrants), and so forth.

In short, give them a chance. Even if they pass it, only give them up to two months of government assistance - adequate time to find a job. Cut it off if they do not find one.

On immigrants, also have a MUCH MUCH less tolerance policy. You break a major law (anything more than 30 years in prison), you're dead. You break minor law, you get the max penalty for it - no questions. You don't get a slap on the wrist. You are a full-grown adult, have come into a country that is not your's, and have committed a crime. You are expected to act like a human being. If you do not, you will be punished.

In the case of illegal immigration? If one is found to have a fake passport, is on government assistance, or something of the like without having been accepted in the county? Death sentence immediately. No 'deportation' as that costs money for the country in general. You broke a sovereign country's border in an attempt to get access to its resources. You are not a 'desperate' person. You are classified as an invader. No life in prison - as you will be costing money, food, and space.
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Cutting of benefits would be considered a violation of human rights. These days, it's not even just money for food and shelter. I wonder if the governments are supplying resources for internet access as part of their human rights. It wouldn't surprise me at all.

Execution is pretty much out of question, even by non-2015 standards.
 
Doctor Professor Timon said:
Even more a-loggish sounding.

Humans don't have rights. Go to a dictatorship and proclaim those. Won't work out too well. Go to Saudi Arabia dressed in a bikini (as a man or woman) or proclaim your homosexuality there.

We only have the "rights" we defend / enforce. Sorry to say it, but rights end where desperation, laws, or enforcement thereof being.

I'm speaking from a logical slash reasonable point of view. For instance, the United States Constitution applies only to the citizens of the United States and guarantees the rights of United States citizens. Not citizens of the world (as our Constitution has no power over gun ownership in other countries, their free speech, etc.). If you are an immigrant (especially illegal) you are not entitled -to- those rights - as you are not a citizen, nor are you part of the civilization you're invading (especially if you refuse to conform to the culture in question).
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It is an unfair world and the laws of the wild still remain.
 
To echo the sentiment others have expressed in this thread, a nation has no obligation but to its own citizens. Nations should only accept migrants if doing so will bring tangible benefits and little or no problems to the established population.
However, it's cool and progressive to accept hundreds of thousands of migrants you could never reasonably dream of supporting then aggressively shut down anyone who questions the decision.
 
They aren't getting into Hungary if we got anything to say about it. Rather we leave the Eu than to take them in.

I have seen them with my own eyes, they are 90% violent, savage, muscled thugs.

There are a few families, a few young nerdy men who I can believe just want to get a better job. But those are really, really a minority.
 
Male Idiot said:
They aren't getting into Hungary if we got anything to say about it. Rather we leave the Eu than to take them in.

I have seen them with my own eyes, they are 90% violent, savage, muscled thugs.

There are a few families, a few young nerdy men who I can believe just want to get a better job. But those are really, really a minority.
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So you live in an area where a lot of migrants/refugees are coming through? Can you share some of your experiences? I've only really heard reporters and politicians talk about it, I'm interested in hearing the perspective of a regular citizen.
 
Apparently there's a rape epidemic in Germany, specifically in refugee centers. Most centers are overwhelming populated by males and unaccompanied women are seen as fair game. Women have an enormous chance of being on the receiving end of sexual assault because of the lack of safety measures in place. Reports of rape have been covered up in an attempt to not rock the boat, eerily similar to how the Rotherham sexual exploitation scandal was handled.

Sorry, but fuck political correctness and playing nice when women and children are being violated so horribly. We need to care about them instead of how this will make the refugees/migrants look bad. And when the police and media are covering up for a bunch of savages and rapists, it does make everyone look bad.
 
Cosmos said:
Apparently there's a rape epidemic in Germany, specifically in refugee centers. Most centers are overwhelming populated by males and unaccompanied women are seen as fair game. Women have an enormous chance of being on the receiving end of sexual assault because of the lack of safety measures in place. Reports of rape have been covered up in an attempt to not rock the boat, eerily similar to how the Rotherham sexual exploitation scandal was handled.
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Needless to say, anyone who does this should be (at best) immediately sent right the fuck back to wherever they came from.

And any officials who turned a blind eye to that should be removed from any position of authority.
 
AnOminous said:
Needless to say, anyone who does this should be (at best) immediately sent right the fuck back to wherever they came from.

And any officials who turned a blind eye to that should be removed from any position of authority.
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YES. I cannot fathom why rapists and drug/weapon traffickers are allowed free reign of the refugee centers, where they assault, violate, and harass the people who came there to start a better life and abide by the rules. Deport their asses back to where they came from. They're not citizens, they don't deserve the same due process rightful citizens are entitled to. They barged into another country and can't give less of a fuck about its culture and laws, so why are they allowed to stay?

How can any civilized society allow this shit to happen and willingly look the other way?
  • Over the weekend of June 12-14, a 15-year-old girl housed at a refugee shelter in Habenhausen, a district in the northern city of Bremen, was repeatedly raped by two other asylum seekers. The facility has been has been described as a "house of horrors" due to the spiraling violence perpetrated by rival gangs of youth from Africa and Kosovo. A total of 247 asylum seekers are staying at the shelter, which has a capacity for 180 and a cafeteria with seating for 53.
  • On August 6, police revealed that a 13-year-old Muslim girl was raped by another asylum seeker at a refugee facility in Detmold, a city in west-central Germany. The girl and her mother reportedly fled their homeland to escape a culture of sexual violence; as it turns out, the man who raped the girl is from their country. (This one hits me especially hard. These women went through a dangerous journey to reach a country where women are treated as equals and sexual violence is condemned, only to be dragged back to the hell they escaped from via one of the backwards savages who's thoroughly internalized the culture.)
  • On August 10, five men of "Turkish origin" attempted to rape a girl in Mönchengladbach. Also on August 10, a male "southerner" raped a 15-year-old girl in Rinteln. On August 8, a male "southerner" attempted to rape a 20-year-old woman in Siegen.
  • On September 11, a 16-year-old girl was raped by an unidentified "dark-skinned man speaking broken German" close to a refugee shelter in the Bavarian town of Mering. The attack occurred while the girl was walking home from the train station.
  • A male refugee raped a 3-year-old child, and the Migration Board tried to conceal the incident.
  • A woman was literally raped to death by a Somalian immigrant, who then continued raping her corpse. The Somalian was apprehended by police while still in the act of raping the murdered woman. Thankfully, it seems as though this case was prosecuted.
  • On April 16, a 21-year-old asylum seeker from Iraq was sentenced to three years and ten months in prison for raping a 17-year-old girl at festival in the Bavarian town of Straubing in August 2014. On April 7, a 29-year-old asylum seeker was arrested for the attempted rape of a 14-year-old girl in the town of Alzenau.
  • Three Syrian men gang-raped a 14-year-old girl in Jordan's Zaatari refugee camp (not Europe, but still).
  • Not a specific incident, but girls and women who are native citizens of their own countries are being advised to "dress modestly" and "avoid skimpy clothing" around refugee centers, in order to avoid "misunderstandings." Of course, the only "misunderstanding" here is the idea that a rapist should be excused on account of his culture and religion.
I have never seen governments so hell-bent on destroying their nations and themselves. It's absolutely mind boggling. The United States has shit it needs to work out, but at least the chance of a rape epidemic being covered up out of fear of being called racist is very low.
 
Cosmos said:
YES. I cannot fathom why rapists and drug/weapon traffickers are allowed free reign of the refugee centers, where they assault, violate, and harass the people who came there to start a better life and abide by the rules. Deport their asses back to where they came from. They're not citizens, they don't deserve the same due process rightful citizens are entitled to. They barged into another country and can't give less of a fuck about its culture and laws, so why are they allowed to stay?

How can any civilized society allow this shit to happen and willingly look the other way?
  • Over the weekend of June 12-14, a 15-year-old girl housed at a refugee shelter in Habenhausen, a district in the northern city of Bremen, was repeatedly raped by two other asylum seekers. The facility has been has been described as a "house of horrors" due to the spiraling violence perpetrated by rival gangs of youth from Africa and Kosovo. A total of 247 asylum seekers are staying at the shelter, which has a capacity for 180 and a cafeteria with seating for 53.
  • On August 6, police revealed that a 13-year-old Muslim girl was raped by another asylum seeker at a refugee facility in Detmold, a city in west-central Germany. The girl and her mother reportedly fled their homeland to escape a culture of sexual violence; as it turns out, the man who raped the girl is from their country. (This one hits me especially hard. These women went through a dangerous journey to reach a country where women are treated as equals and sexual violence is condemned, only to be dragged back to the hell they escaped from via one of the backwards savages who's thoroughly internalized the culture.)
  • On August 10, five men of "Turkish origin" attempted to rape a girl in Mönchengladbach. Also on August 10, a male "southerner" raped a 15-year-old girl in Rinteln. On August 8, a male "southerner" attempted to rape a 20-year-old woman in Siegen.
  • On September 11, a 16-year-old girl was raped by an unidentified "dark-skinned man speaking broken German" close to a refugee shelter in the Bavarian town of Mering. The attack occurred while the girl was walking home from the train station.
  • A male refugee raped a 3-year-old child, and the Migration Board tried to conceal the incident.
  • A woman was literally raped to death by a Somalian immigrant, who then continued raping her corpse. The Somalian was apprehended by police while still in the act of raping the murdered woman. Thankfully, it seems as though this case was prosecuted.
  • On April 16, a 21-year-old asylum seeker from Iraq was sentenced to three years and ten months in prison for raping a 17-year-old girl at festival in the Bavarian town of Straubing in August 2014. On April 7, a 29-year-old asylum seeker was arrested for the attempted rape of a 14-year-old girl in the town of Alzenau.
  • Three Syrian men gang-raped a 14-year-old girl in Jordan's Zaatari refugee camp (not Europe, but still).
  • Not a specific incident, but girls and women who are native citizens of their own countries are being advised to "dress modestly" and "avoid skimpy clothing" around refugee centers, in order to avoid "misunderstandings." Of course, the only "misunderstanding" here is the idea that a rapist should be excused on account of his culture and religion.
I have never seen governments so hell-bent on destroying their nations and themselves. It's absolutely mind boggling. The United States has shit it needs to work out, but at least the chance of a rape epidemic being covered up out of fear of being called racist is very low.
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Shit like this is why I keep saying to let in women and children but not the men. I know some women are jihadists/terrorists sometimes but they don't usually go around raping people. There's not even a crime directly comparable to gang rape women can do, imo.
Plus it'd please both the racists and politically correct. It's a win-win.
 
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