Debate Jews and Mormons. - Please do not follow Racism's advice and thirst over forum users and their relations to anuses.

[WelperHelper99]

Dude, don't high-road me. I'm glad that you are serious about your faith, but there's no way you can vouch for every other Mormon that they don't drink coffee behind your back or whatever. I can't vouch for my co-religionists like that either, and I wouldn't even try. People worship not because they're perfect, but because they are not. (Why would I go to confession if I think I've done nothing wrong?) So what you're saying comes off a bit arrogant to me.

Anyway, I can point to plenty of Mormons acting badly. Chad and Lori Daybell, there's two. Warren Jeffs, there's another! I'm not going to textwall you with examples of Mormons being sinful, but suffice to say that you're only human like the rest of us.

I only bring up ultra-orthodox Mormons (e.g. FLDS) because I think they mirror Orthodox Jewish sects in some key ways: they are both super conforminst, isolate the flock (Mormons do it geographically, Jews do it both geographically and culturally), have extremely granular rules for everything, the rebbe/bishop is always right, look the other way when CSA happens, you get the idea.) Basically I'm trying to say that some of the penguins' behavior is not unique or inherent to Jews, but to super-fundamentalist religions. The "loss prevention" strategy of making your next generation of faithful unable to live outside the ghetto because the people in charge systematically denied teaching them how to read English or set up a checking account etc. is a common feature of fundamentalist religions everywhere.

You're autistic. And you bring up the FLDS. They are separate from us. Your ultra orthodox us still considered a jew. A FLDS isn't Mormon.

As for the average Mormon- yes they follow the rules. Flaunting them like a Jew does is how you get excommunicated.

 

[Stan]

You're autistic. And you bring up the FLDS. They are separate from us. Your ultra orthodox us still considered a jew. A FLDS isn't Mormon.

Yeah - according to you, not to them, and certainly not to the outside world.

As for the average Mormon- yes they follow the rules.

Did Chad and Lori Daybell follow the rules, eh? Are you really going to hang your hat on this idea that nobody in your religion ever breaks the rules, that you're superior to every other kind of religious person out there? :/ why worship at all if you're so gd perfect eh

Flaunting them like a Jew does is how you get excommunicated.

Yes, ultra-orthodox faiths use excommunication to threaten people back into line. another loss-prevention strategy. Not unique to Jews, as you demonstrate.
Liberal faiths lose followers because they won't implement this barbaric stuff, and they also don't try to hog their parishioner's lives every fucking second of the day. You are like them, hon.

 

[WelperHelper99]

Yeah - according to you, not to them, and certainly not to the outside world.

Yeah- and they're retards

Did Chad and Lori Daybell follow the rules, eh? Are you really going to hang your hat on this idea that nobody in your religion ever breaks the rules, that you're superior to every other kind of religious person out there? :/ why worship at all if you're so gd perfect eh

The Church of The Firstborn is a splinter so fucking small I had to look it up. They walked away from the Church long ago.

Yes, ultra-orthodox faiths use excommunication to threaten people back into line. another loss-prevention strategy. Not unique to Jews, as you demonstrate.
Liberal faiths lose followers because they won't implement this barbaric stuff, and they also don't try to hog their parishioner's lives every fucking second of the day. You are like them, hon.

It keeps order. It's like a job, fuck around get fired. We take our faith seriously. They are allowed to leave if they wish.

 

[Stan]

Yeah- and they're retards

According to you, they’re retards, according to them, they’re True and Honest Mormons and you’re a wannabe. If you asked me, I wouldn’t even say you count as a Christian, but you probably think you are.

The penguins do this same slap fight and dance; that’s what those weird Jew on Jew brawls at the bimah are all about. The Hasids say Rebbe Schneerson is dead, his devotees seethe and insist he never died. Ultra Orthodox Jews also unapologetically consider Reform Jews to be not Jews, that Jews whose birth moms aren’t Jewish aren’t Jews, and that the final authority of all things Jewish is theirs and only theirs to decide. And then the ultra-orthodox just schism and fight amongst themselves anyway.

The Church of The Firstborn is a splinter so fucking small I had to look it up. They walked away from the Church long ago.

It doesn’t really impart much confidence when you tell me that every Mormon caught behaving badly is No True Mormon, left the church a long time ago, etcetc.

These people grew up Mormon, practiced as Mormons, and murdered their own spouses and kids in the mid 2000s so they could run away and be God’s Chosen to lead the 144k through the apocalypse. (Your church prohibits filicide, yes?)

This is why you shouldn’t pick the “Mormons Never Sin” hill to die on; I need only to find one counter example of Mormons being criminals to take it apart. It also just leaves you looking very arrogant, like you think your shit don’t stink.

And I’m not necessarily talking about your precinct and your bishop and your temple, which I’m sure are all moderate and normal, but you know Mormons break out into weird cults and sects fairly often.

It keeps order. It's like a job, fuck around get fired. We take our faith seriously. They are allowed to leave if they wish.

Ultra-orthodox Jews can also leave the religion whenever they wish (and you’d think it’d be easy living in the city), but their schools don’t teach them English and math.

I’m pretty sure super orthodox Mormons use similar levers of control to keep their people in their sects, by making leaving practically very difficult or impossible, but I can take that to the Mormon thread.

 

[WelperHelper99]

According to you, they’re retards, according to them, they’re True and Honest Mormons and you’re a wannabe. If you asked me, I wouldn’t even say you count as a Christian, but you probably think you are.

The penguins do this same slap fight and dance; that’s what those weird Jew on Jew brawls at the bimah are all about. The Hasids say Rebbe Schneerson is dead, his devotees seethe and insist he never died. Ultra Orthodox Jews also unapologetically consider Reform Jews to be not Jews, that Jews whose birth moms aren’t Jewish aren’t Jews, and that the final authority of all things Jewish is theirs and only theirs to decide. And then the ultra-orthodox just schism and fight amongst themselves anyway.

I call them retards because they are retards.

It doesn’t really impart much confidence when you tell me that every Mormon caught behaving badly is No True Mormon, left the church a long time ago, etcetc.

These people grew up Mormon, practiced as Mormons, and murdered their own spouses and kids in the mid 2000s so they could run away and be God’s Chosen to lead the 144k through the apocalypse. (Your church prohibits filicide, yes?)

This is why you shouldn’t pick the “Mormons Never Sin” hill to die on; I need only to find one counter example of Mormons being criminals to take it apart. It also just leaves you looking very arrogant, like you think your shit don’t stink.

And I’m not necessarily talking about your precinct and your bishop and your temple, which I’m sure are all moderate and normal, but you know Mormons break out into weird cults and sects fairly often.

They left the Church. Not our problem at that point. You are incredibly snide in trying to twist what's there.

Ultra-orthodox Jews can also leave the religion whenever they wish (and you’d think it’d be easy living in the city), but their schools don’t teach them English and math.

I’m pretty sure super orthodox Mormons use similar levers of control to keep their people in their sects, by making leaving practically very difficult or impossible, but I can take that to the Mormon thread.

You are fucking dumb. We literally made our own colleges


I think we know how to read and do math

 

[Stan]

You are fucking dumb. We literally made our own colleges

Look, I don't want to pour poison in your ear, it sounds like you are happy with your faith, but a BU degree reads a lot differently to a non-Mormon than it does to a Mormon. To a Mormon it might be a pedigree of conduct and careful study, to a non-Mormon, they worry what you don't know, because your religious education concealed it from you.

They left the Church. Not our problem at that point. You are incredibly snide in trying to twist what's there.

Reminding you that you're trotting out a No True Scotsman fallacy isn't me being snide. I genuinely like you and respect you, and I know you're a thoughtful and intelligent person. I just think you're going to bat for your religion a bit hard here. You probably won't catch me saying that no true Episcopal has ever sinned, because I know that's not right and I can acknowledge clerical misconduct without an ex-post-facto excuse that they weren't really Episcopalians.

I call them retards because they are retards.

If you're going to resort to tautology then there's nothing more for us to say here. Happy to talk to you about it elsewhere I just don't want to shit up this thread any more.

 

[WelperHelper99]

Look, I don't want to pour poison in your ear, it sounds like you are happy with your faith, but a BU degree reads a lot differently to a non-Mormon than it does to a Mormon. To a Mormon it might be a pedigree of conduct and careful study, to a non-Mormon, they worry what you don't know, because your religious education concealed it from you.

Lawl.

Reminding you that you're trotting out a No True Scotsman fallacy isn't me being snide. I genuinely like you and respect you, and I know you're a thoughtful and intelligent person. I just think you're going to bat for your religion a bit hard here. You probably won't catch me saying that no true Episcopal has ever sinned, because I know that's not right and I can acknowledge clerical misconduct without an ex-post-facto excuse that they weren't really Episcopalians.

All I have done is point out that your examples were not LDS. Hate to break it to you, only one church gets to call itself Mormon- not that the rest of them mind. And who claimed no Mormon hasn't sinned? I simply states that by and large we are more pious than Jews because we PRACTICE WHAT WE PREACH.

And the Ultra-Orthodox have a college: Yeshiva University, in New York, I talked about it before. There are haves and have-nots in Orthodoxy, like everywhere else. Some Jewish schools are considered to be extremely good private schools; but many ultra-Orthodox yeshivot are terrible.

We don't have private mormon schools because that shit is gay. Anyone can go to BYU if they wish. It's what they were built for.

If you're going to resort to tautology then there's nothing more for us to say here. Happy to talk to you about it elsewhere I just don't want to shit up this thread any more.

You sound mad you got called out on your shit.

 

[Stan]

Lawl.

All I have done is point out that your examples were not LDS. Hate to break it to you, only one church gets to call itself Mormon- not that the rest of them mind. And who claimed no Mormon hasn't sinned? I simply states that by and large we are more pious than Jews because we PRACTICE WHAT WE PREACH.

We don't have private mormon schools because that shit is gay. Anyone can go to BYU if they wish. It's what they were built for.

You sound mad you got called out on your shit.

Gosh I am genuinely just trying to be civil with you. Respect for you, still like your posts.

To me, and to the world, FLDS and Church of the Firstborn and whatever else it is you Mormons are hiding, grew out of Mormonism and shares the beliefs of Mormonism (your made-up scripture, such as it is): All of these communities and writing clubs and ERPs etc. are Mormon, in the same way the penguins and the tunnels and the diamond district and the cult suburban American B'nei Brak towns in Orange County are considered to be Jewish. I suppose you can sympathize with the perspective of a moderate Conservative or Orthodox Jew. I guess anyone would be upset if I compared them to their most oddly dressed and eccentric behaving co-religionists.

> We don't have private mormon schools
lmao ofc you don't you move out to the hinterlands and homeschool the kids in remote compounds with 40+ inhabitants.

 

[WelperHelper99]

Gosh I am genuinely just trying to be civil with you. Respect for you, still like your posts.

Your sniping suggests otherwise.

To me, and to the world, FLDS and Church of the Firstborn and whatever else it is you Mormons are hiding, grew out of Mormonism and shares the beliefs of Mormonism (your made-up scripture, such as it is): All of these communities and writing clubs and ERPs etc. are Mormon, in the same way the penguins and the tunnels and the diamond district and the cult suburban American B'nei Brak towns in Orange County are considered to be Jewish. I suppose you can sympathize with the perspective of a moderate Conservative or Orthodox Jew. I guess anyone would be upset if I compared them to their most oddly dressed and eccentric behaving co-religionists.

I really don't sympathize. We literally have different names yet you manage to get confused. All Jews call themselves Jews. When one is called out ALL wrap around to protect the retard. We dont. We denounce our splinters. We are not the same.

> We don't have private mormon schools
lmao ofc you don't you move out to the hinterlands and homeschool the kids in remote compounds with 40+ inhabitants.

Again, WHO are you talking about? Critical thinking skills are essential. Even then, what's the issue with home schooling?

 

[Stan]

Your sniping suggests otherwise.

Bless your heart, I really will watch my language.

I do think this conflict and slapfight illustrates that there is a boundary to be drawn in any faith between its ordinary practice and extremist cells and the thread should probably explain what makes Ultra-Orthodox Jews different from normal Jews, in the same way that we should differentiate between crazy Mormon murder-cultists and our besties here like you, WelperHelper99

Even then, what's the issue with home schooling?

It's a common tool of abuse and indoctrination, particularly as it minimizes the child's contact with mandated reporters at school.

 

[WelperHelper99]

Bless your heart, I really will watch my language.

I do think this conflict and slapfight illustrates that there is a boundary to be drawn in any faith between its ordinary practice and extremist cells and the thread should probably explain what makes Ultra-Orthodox Jews different from normal Jews, in the same way that we should differentiate between crazy Mormon murder-cultists and our besties here like you, WelperHelper99

I can really feel the *love*. But I do love your chareterization of what a "Mormon" is.

Do you even know what Mormon means? It's a insult, thrown at us by those that hunted us down, stole our propert, and certain Governors that handed out extermination orders such as in the case of Missouri Executive Order 44:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missouri_Executive_Order_44#:~:text=Missouri%20Executive%20Order%2044%20

To be a Mormon is to accept that history, accept the brand they gave us- and forgive. The offshoots do not. Hense they are cast out. They denied reality long ago.

i do not see the same of your ultra Orthodox. When the tunnel shit happened, literally everyone defended them. Crazy weirdos my ass. You would catch me dead knowingly defending a FLDS or other splinters.

It's a common tool of abuse and indoctrination, particularly as it minimizes the child's contact with mandated reporters at school.

State propaganda. Holy shit you are pozzed.

 

[WelperHelper99]

Do you realize what a total faggot you are?
This is a gossip forum about retards. And you are an twink anime avatar. If anyone reads your derailing ass blog posts and actually starts questioning their worldview, they are extremely retarded and probably a good fit for your "church".
If the point is to recruit as many retards as possible, take your next mission to the Reese's factory or bother the waterhead bagging the groceries down at the King Soopers.

Lady, if you were half as smart as you think you are, you would have learned to stop eating at 1400 calories/day a long time ago.
You are a bore and a boar.

You joined today. Who the fuck are you to tell me about forum etiquette?

 

[WelperHelper99]

>muh joined date

Actually that's important when you join day one and try to start shit, yeah.

The height of newfag, scrambling for an own behavior.
Certain types of behavior are universally obnoxious, that's why. There's literally nothing special about KFs etiquette.
Stop boofing your ADHD meds before you login and you'd probably be a decent poster. But these long tired ass UNSOLICITED posts about the silly shit that was indoctrinated into your head are unbelievably cringe.
Like the most zealous proselytizers, you think you spend all day spreading Light and Truth but you're an obnoxious asshole that does more to push people who might be receptive further away from the message.
You're barely old enough to vote, you're not qualified to speak down to anyone about anything other than girly japanese cartoons.

Seriously, who?

 

[Stan]

I can really feel the *love*. But I do love your chareterization of what a "Mormon" is.

I mean. I actually do think you're nice, wholesome, and very expressive and precise with your words. All the best and so on.

Do you even know what Mormon means? It's a insult, thrown at us by those that hunted us down, stole our propert, and certain Governors that handed out extermination orders such as in the case of Missouri Executive Order 44:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missouri_Executive_Order_44#:~:text=Missouri%20Executive%20Order%2044%20

To be a Mormon is to accept that history, accept the brand they gave us- and forgive. The offshoots do not. Hense they are cast out. They denied reality long ago.

yeah I know Mormons were persecuted out of Ohio and then out of Illinois (where Joseph Smith died) and probably a few more times.

I suppose I have underestimated the Mormon reliance on excommunication to distance themselves from their extremist co-religionists, like you have. Jews don't commonly excommunicate each other from being Jewish. It's a serious form of censure for their clergy - the equivalent of being defrocked; but day to day Jews can't just accuse each other of not really being part of the tribe. I guess that is what a blood bond does for you...

i do not see the same of your ultra Orthodox. When the tunnel shit happened, literally everyone defended them. Crazy weirdos my ass. You would catch me dead knowingly defending a FLDS or other splinters.

Hey, they're not "my" Orthodox Jews, let alone ultra-Orthodox Jews. They made it quite clear many times

State propaganda. Holy shit you are pozzed.

It's really just a sad fact of child abusers of all sorts. Homeschooling can be superior to public school, depending on the quality of public education and how serious you are about teaching your kid literally every subject to GED level and then parochial content. But the kind of parents who don't want mandated reporters to see bruises, who don't want their kids letting anything slip to social workers, and the kind of people who are inclined to spirit their daughters away to Mexico for a week to spiritually marry a frail old man ("The Prophet")? Or the crazy ones who go out of their way to illegally purchase unpasteurized milk to give their kids because this is 'healthier'?
Yeah those people will absolutely take advantaged of unregulated homeschooling as a way to isolate their offspring from rationality.

Not everyone, obviously. Just some.

You joined today. Who the fuck are you to tell me about forum etiquette?

YEAH! What he said.

Lady, if you were half as smart as you think you are, you would have learned to stop eating at 1400 calories/day a long time ago.
You are a bore and a boar.

Did you really just register an account to tell me I'm fat?

 

[SpergioLeonne]

It's really just a sad fact of child abusers of all sorts. Homeschooling can be superior to public school, depending on the quality of public education and how serious you are about teaching your kid literally every subject to GED level and then parochial content.

Do you have kids?

This is.. hard to wrap my head around.

Ok, see, my not-quite three year old can recognize several written words without pictures to cheat, and they know that ten plus ten is twenty. If they were black, they could get into college at this point.

The way you talk about the GED, like that would be some kind of Uber accomplishment for a home schooled kid.. holy fuck, it just comes off as so venomously patronizing.

My kids will be held back from their potential their entire time in public school. They will be damaged from it, without a doubt. That’s 100%. But my wife and I can’t afford to live on a single income, so our kids are most likely going to be subjected to that.

You’re saying some segment of religious people are going to make their kids weird by homeschooling them, what portion do you think that is, by the way? Half? 90%?

Public schools are completely dysfunctional.

 

[Stan]

Yes I know. That wasn't what I asked. There is what the book says, and there's it in practice. I am asking: do you do it out of habit or of faith? There is a massive difference. I bring it up because of how much your "fences" you seek to build when the writings are clear and plain. That is all.

They're really not so cut and dry, especially as these rules should apply to the life people live now.
You're right though, you are not the same, I was wrong. Similar, perhaps, but not the same.
This kind of scriptural liberalism, this belief you have that you're fit to interpret the word of God is also rather arrogant of you. Orthodox Jews stand under too huge a corpus of commentaries and exegetic adaptations to claim that they understand the will of God. Even Thomas Aquinas says that it is hubris to imagine one knows or understands the will of God. I think it is really arrogant of you to say that the Old Testament laws for Jews are easily understood and put into practice.

This is is why Mormonism (and I'm gonna call it that, the word "Christian" is also derogatory in its etymology but I'm not complaining) has so many problems with people spouting off with their own theophanies and starting splinter cults you have to disavow and angrily get after me for if I call them Mormon. Basically you guys flew too close to the sun. If any and all of you can prophesy and you all disagree with each other, what then? This is why the Jews maintain order, hierarchy, tradition. That stuff that melts like spring snow showers in your startup religion, but it gives the practitioners some legitimacy.

What can I say? You've got a certain force that draws people and celestial objects towards you

Heh, that's the nicest thing anybody's said to me in a long time. (Or at least I will choose to interpret it that way.)

Get real and stop trying to jew God with your little gotchas.

You're alright, enjoy the day.

 

[AgendaPoster]

In her thread, Stan aka Margaret Pless

Ayyyyo Mr. Racism we caused another split from the Hasidic thread lmao

Gosh I am genuinely just trying to be civil with you. Respect for you, still like your posts.

CRUSH HIM MARGE
He doesn't have the debating skills to stand up to you.
No mercy, full submission required, it's the only way for such a good, obedient boy like Welpie.

>muh joined date

An experienced newfag sock is better than boring oldfags.

 

[Stan]

CRUSH HIM MARGE
He doesn't have the debating skills to stand up to you.
No mercy, full submission required, it's the only way for such a good, obedient boy like Welpie.

mm whatever you say master.

Welper, you... missionary! Your mother smells of baby powder! And your father is a mattress salesman! And none of your drinks are heated!
This. Means. WAR.
HOLY WAR!

 

[RACISM]

Ayyyyo Mr. Racism we caused another split from the Hasidic thread lmao

Another thread goes down a different leg of the trousers of time.

 

[Gog & Magog]

@RACISM is actually a jew and is just trying to weed out the weaker jews on the Farms in hope of strengthening his race.