Cruelty Squad

[TheDarknessGrows]

They're both first person shooter/rpg hybrids where the rpg mechanics and choices have real impact on the outcome of the game. Deus ex is more of a stealth game (at least it can be) while system shock leans more toward survival horror, genres are all arbitrary at the end of the day but it helps categorize things and ultimately for many reasons if you like deus ex you most likely enjoy system shock 2 and vice versa. I can also make the assumption that you'd enjoy the first 3 Thief games, Fallout 3/New Vegas, Arx Fatalis, Ultima, even Cruelty Squad and many others. The categorization may be arbitrary but its still very helpful.

Both Deus Ex and SS2 are heavily inspired by Ultima in fact and their UI's are nearly identical. They're more the same than they are different which is why everyone inherently understands what "immersive sim" means just by being given a list of which games fall into the category.

It's all gibberish, this "immersive sim" genre. A genre that is what ever you need it to be. The explanation is different each time I complain.

 

[Smaug's Smokey Hole 2]

It's all gibberish, this "immersive sim" genre. A genre that is what ever you need it to be. The explanation is different each time I complain.

I think "immersive sim" is more of a sandboxy objection based type of game. Something like Bioshock Infinite is not an IM, it's a shooter, and I never really felt that the old Bioshock was much of an IM.

 

[gay]

replaying this shit for the new autistic cheevos and i forgot how much i resonated with this particular NPC dialogue.

 

[Coolio55]

View attachment 5696826
replaying this shit for the new autistic cheevos and i forgot how much i resonated with this particular NPC dialogue.

That's pretty fucking cool. Like I needed an excuse to boot it back up.
I like how most of them are hidden but I hope it's not just for completing all the levels and then for completing all of them again but with the tux.

 

[Gender: Xenomorph]

Damn. In the apartment level, there's a woman that you just cannot talk to. She's locked in that weirdo's appartment (you know the one).

She usually panics from the gunshots, but you can pacify her with a smoke grenade. You cannot, however, talk to her in any way or form. Not from what I know of.

It bothers me.

 

[Coolio55]

Damn. In the apartment level, there's a woman that you just cannot talk to. She's locked in that weirdo's appartment (you know the one).

She usually panics from the gunshots, but you can pacify her with a smoke grenade. You cannot, however, talk to her in any way or form. Not from what I know of.

It bothers me.

I heard the floor above her's breakable.

 

[Scarthew]

That's pretty fucking cool. Like I needed an excuse to boot it back up.
I like how most of them are hidden but I hope it's not just for completing all the levels and then for completing all of them again but with the tux.

Yea thats all it is.

Damn. In the apartment level, there's a woman that you just cannot talk to. She's locked in that weirdo's appartment (you know the one).

I don't?

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

Damn. In the apartment level, there's a woman that you just cannot talk to. She's locked in that weirdo's appartment (you know the one).

She usually panics from the gunshots, but you can pacify her with a smoke grenade. You cannot, however, talk to her in any way or form. Not from what I know of.

It bothers me.

A Cruelty Squad player weirded out he can't interact with women

 

[Counterfeit Obol]

Damn. In the apartment level, there's a woman that you just cannot talk to. She's locked in that weirdo's appartment (you know the one).

She usually panics from the gunshots, but you can pacify her with a smoke grenade. You cannot, however, talk to her in any way or form. Not from what I know of.

It bothers me.

There's also those partygoers in Neuron Activator in some underground sections of the club. As far as I know, there is no way to reach them.

 

[Camo Fox]

It's all gibberish, this "immersive sim" genre. A genre that is what ever you need it to be. The explanation is different each time I complain.

Variety in gameplay + reddit likes the game, is the only consistent thing I've seen about the "immersive sim" genre. It's one of those phrases that just makes me irrationally angry when I hear some YouTube essayist utter the cursed term.

 

[Scarthew]

Variety in gameplay + reddit likes the game, is the only consistent thing I've seen about the "immersive sim" genre. It's one of those phrases that just makes me irrationally angry when I hear some YouTube essayist utter the cursed term.

You really don't see what deus ex, system shock 2 and arx fatalis share in common that justifies categorizing them together in a way makes it so that fans of these kinds of games can easily seek out more of them? Its rpg mechanics, dynamic interconnected systems and a very interactive world which also feeds into said systems. Immersive sims are specifically games which design a world and offer many choices for how to navigate its obstacles. It's rpg choices often feed into this not just in simple ways like what range and DPS you do but enabling entirely new paths. Compared to traditional games where there's a set order of events to progress, the immersive sim offers open ended problems with multiple solutions gated by various resources and investments. Again, it is certainly arbitrary where the line is drawn but if you're saying you don't understand what links these games at all I'm genuinely confused because it's pretty obvious they're more the same than different.

If anything I'm not sure what you mean by "variety in gameplay" because these types of games tend to have a core set of mechanics that are very versatile, when you say gameplay variety I immediately think about gimmicks and genre shifts like many ps2/n64 era games that would transition into on rails shooters, swimming sections, puzzles, minigames, stealth sections, platforming, etc.

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

You really don't see what deus ex, system shock 2 and arx fatalis share in common that justifies categorizing them together in a way makes it so that fans of these kinds of games can easily seek out more of them? Its rpg mechanics, dynamic interconnected systems and a very interactive world which also feeds into said systems. Immersive sims are specifically games which design a world and offer many choices for how to navigate its obstacles. It's rpg choices often feed into this not just in simple ways like what range and DPS you do but enabling entirely new paths. Compared to traditional games where there's a set order of events to progress, the immersive sim offers open ended problems with multiple solutions gated by various resources and investments. Again, it is certainly arbitrary where the line is drawn but if you're saying you don't understand what links these games at all I'm genuinely confused because it's pretty obvious they're more the same than different.

If anything I'm not sure what you mean by "variety in gameplay" because these types of games tend to have a core set of mechanics that are very versatile, when you say gameplay variety I immediately think about gimmicks and genre shifts like many ps2/n64 era games that would transition into on rails shooters, swimming sections, puzzles, minigames, stealth sections, platforming, etc.

Dude you just farted out a meaningless word salad. Most of the games last decade were open world action RPG where you can achieve your goals in action/stealth. With CS your whole spiel is even more self contradictory as it has no dialogue and alternative goals like Deus Ex, nor any real methods of solving issues besides how to get from point A to B.

It's not that you'd call AssCreed an Immersive Sim even if it was in first person, because the term really boils to "games Reddit love that isn't Souls-like". You people are like the people who try to label porn as Erotic Fiction because you are too much of a faggot to say that you enjoyed playing an FPS.

 

[Camo Fox]

You really don't see what deus ex, system shock 2 and arx fatalis share in common that justifies categorizing them together in a way makes it so that fans of these kinds of games can easily seek out more of them? Its rpg mechanics, dynamic interconnected systems and a very interactive world which also feeds into said systems. Immersive sims are specifically games which design a world and offer many choices for how to navigate its obstacles. It's rpg choices often feed into this not just in simple ways like what range and DPS you do but enabling entirely new paths. Compared to traditional games where there's a set order of events to progress, the immersive sim offers open ended problems with multiple solutions gated by various resources and investments. Again, it is certainly arbitrary where the line is drawn but if you're saying you don't understand what links these games at all I'm genuinely confused because it's pretty obvious they're more the same than different.

If anything I'm not sure what you mean by "variety in gameplay" because these types of games tend to have a core set of mechanics that are very versatile, when you say gameplay variety I immediately think about gimmicks and genre shifts like many ps2/n64 era games that would transition into on rails shooters, swimming sections, puzzles, minigames, stealth sections, platforming, etc.

You just said "variety in gameplay" 50 different ways. If you're not sure what variety means, it's everything you just listed. The reason Immersive Sim is a fake and gay genre is because a game being "very versatile" doesn't allude to anything cohesive. Dishonoured and System Shock have fuck all in common beyond that, redditors wanting their favourite games all under one label is retarded.

 

[Scarthew]

You just said "variety in gameplay" 50 different ways. If you're not sure what variety means, it's everything you just listed. The reason Immersive Sim is a fake and gay genre is because a game being "very versatile" doesn't allude to anything cohesive. Dishonoured and System Shock have fuck all in common beyond that, redditors wanting their favourite games all under one label is retarded.

I dont consider dishonored to be an immersive sim hence why I never mentioned it or bioshock. Bioshock is no different from doom its powers are just different weapon choices and most of them insta kill enemies anyway leading to massive overlap. Dishonored may unlock new paths with certain powers but all of its designed is undermined by blink, in fact every aspect of the game becomes worthless when you effectively have console commands on.

Also no I hadn't said anything 50 different ways, I said exactly what I believe variety to be.

Versatility=/=variety.

Dude you just farted out a meaningless word salad. Most of the games last decade were open world action RPG where you can achieve your goals in action/stealth

stealth and "action"(combat) would still just be combat. You're not interacting with the world in any different way because you unlocked a skill that makes your gun hold 5 extra bullets or enemies dont detect you faster. Again, since nobody seems to read it: its arbitrary but if you're going to tell me you dont understand why these games are classified together then I think you're being obtuse on purpose.

Genres as a whole are abitrary classification and only serve to give a short hand statement about a title. Any time any genre term is used that's all it's there for.

 

[Camo Fox]

I dont consider dishonored to be an immersive sim hence why I never mentioned it or bioshock. Bioshock is no different from doom its powers are just different weapon choices and most of them insta kill enemies anyway leading to massive overlap. Dishonored may unlock new paths with certain powers but all of its designed is undermined by blink, in fact every aspect of the game becomes worthless when you effectively have console commands on.

Also no I hadn't said anything 50 different ways, I said exactly what I believe variety to be.

Versatility=/=variety.



stealth and "action"(combat) would still just be combat. You're not interacting with the world in any different way because you unlocked a skill that makes your gun hold 5 extra bullets or enemies dont detect you faster. Again, since nobody seems to read it: its arbitrary but if you're going to tell me you dont understand why these games are classified together then I think you're being obtuse on purpose.

Genres as a whole are abitrary classification and only serve to give a short hand statement about a title. Any time any genre term is used that's all it's there for.

The fact you feel that you can pick and choose what is or isn't an immersive sim gives credence to how ridiculous of an idea it is. You don't see people debating if Call of Duty is a first person shooter or not, because it makes perfect sense to place it within that genre. It doesn't make sense to place Dishonored, System Shock, Elder Scrolls Oblivion, Deus Ex, Thief all in the same genre and then have spats to determine who the real immersive sim is. Genre is NOT arbitrary and represents key and distinctive elements of a game which are clear cut

 

[Scarthew]

The fact you feel that you can pick and choose what is or isn't an immersive sim gives credence to how ridiculous of an idea it is. You don't see people debating if Call of Duty is a first person shooter or not, because it makes perfect sense to place it within that genre. It doesn't make sense to place Dishonored, System Shock, Elder Scrolls Oblivion, Deus Ex, Thief all in the same genre and then have spats to determine who the real immersive sim is. Genre is NOT arbitrary and represents key and distinctive elements of a game which are clear cut

Again all genres are arbitrary. Is "first person shooter" a genre? or it a mechanic? Doom and counter strike are far more different than they are similar and that definition gets really stretched when you include a game like PVK or chivalry. Counter strike and CoD are both modern military tactical shooters. Yet people tend to only like one or the other.

But if you like deus ex you'll probably enjoy system shock 2 or prey or thief or new vegas. My arbitrary label is far more useful than yours. Because if I want to find a game like system shock 2 I can plug it into various search bars and find new games I'll enjoy.

Good luck finding a new game to enjoy typing in "first person shooter". Categories being arbitrary doesn't make them any less useful. They're short hand labels for defining a game's primary appeal or selling point. All yours tells me if you shoot things(maybe). Alien isolation is a first person shooter yet if you play the game correctly you never have to shoot anything. If I play doom with just fists am I still playing a shooter? What if I ignore all the enemies and just run through levels is it still a shooter?

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

stealth and "action"(combat) would still just be combat. You're not interacting with the world in any different way because you unlocked a skill that makes your gun hold 5 extra bullets or enemies dont detect you faster. Again, since nobody seems to read it: its arbitrary but if you're going to tell me you dont understand why these games are classified together then I think you're being obtuse on purpose.

Genres as a whole are abitrary classification and only serve to give a short hand statement about a title. Any time any genre term is used that's all it's there for.

"Stealth is combat", are you purposely being retarded? The "interacting with the world" is also nebulous as shit, when exactly is the line? How is Dishonored not an immersive sim where your action literally shape the world through the Chaos system, but CS, where every level is static and you only unlock what might as well be Metrodivania power ups, is?

And moving the goalposts that AKTUALY genre is just a statement is admitting its all elitism since even the vague as shit definition is completely inconsistent and only depends on how much reddit likes the game.

 

[Scarthew]

"Stealth is combat"

It is. The line has long since been blurred anyway by this since you're mostly talking Ubisoft outpost simulators which have all used the last known position mechanic introduced in splintercell blacklist. But what I mean is that both are just methods getting around the obstacle that is an enemy which is very different from bypassing an area entirely by unlocking a door or using an enhanced jump

Chaos system

The chaos system is a binary morality which functions as a dynamic difficulty setting, while its good that its transparent it ultimately fails because there's no way to get a harder stealth game playing the game correctly. Meanwhile more enemies is exactly what a player would want if theyre just playing a murder sim, its not a punishment because your character 1 shots every enemy. Lastly it encourages just not engaging with the game at all since just blinking from vantage point to vantage point as you go straight to objectives is thus the encouraged way to play since blink is overpowered and and has infinite uses even if you spam it you'll always be able to blink after about 4 seconds, faster if you have bone charms. I can't say any of Dishonored's mechanics work together at all the tools you're given are designed to allow for stylish combos, but you're "punished" for kills and you're not rewarded for style so why would not just use one of your dozens of 1 shot kill options? Of course you can just play the game as a sandbox and mess around which is how I tend to play the game but at that point you're ignoring the game entirely and you're going to get a bad ending.

but CS

Never said cruelty squad is an immersive sim just it had elements of one.

genre is just a statement

I said from the start that genres are arbitrary, if I was going to have a detailed discussion about a game it would just be in the context of itself but if I'm advertising a game a quick boiler plate identification is perfectly suitable. Again the issue I have is when you're going to pretend you don't understand at all why these games get grouped together.

 

[Lurkerish Kandor]

This Steam Discussions thread of some turdburger raging over achievements being added gave me a good chuckle.
For me, it's peak Poe's Law, to the extent I wonder if all the posts further into the thread are simply people making it into a copypasta joke, or if they're alt accounts the OP is using to spam it after he got banned because he's still at maximum seethe.

Spoiler: Screenshot of the OP

 

[Meltryllis]

This Steam Discussions thread of some turdburger raging over achievements being added gave me a good chuckle.
For me, it's peak Poe's Law, to the extent I wonder if all the posts further into the thread are simply people making it into a copypasta joke, or if they're alt accounts the OP is using to spam it after he got banned because he's still at maximum seethe.

Spoiler: Screenshot of the OP

View attachment 5708196

Did the dev finally get cucked into adding achievements for the soy achoovement hoonters? I'm genuinely disappointed.

Achievements RUIN the original vision. And for what? To attract more brainless achoovement hoonter cucks who only care about displaying their stupid squares on their main profile. Have you seen what these people play? Their accounts are full of 1000 achievement hentai bejeweled clones and lazy puzzle games that award you 500 cheevos for 10 seconds of gameplay. "I-I'm achoovingg I'm achooovinng!!!!"

THIS. This is why the gaming industry is collapsing. Devs who just do everything the players tell them to to make more cash. How can you ruin something so great for profit? How can you betray the original fans that were there from the beginning for some stupid demographic that doesn't even CARE about the game's quality? I'm never buying anything by this developer EVER again.