Brianna Wu / John Walker Flynt - "Biggest Victim of Gamergate," Failed Game Developer, Failed Congressional Candidate

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Ghostse said:
That's the one I meant.
The one takes place (Well, first one does) in the deep ocean.
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Oh, OK that's actually called the Rifter's trilogy
It's been about 20 years since I read it, but I enjoyed it -- I think he was in his over-extension phase that so many sci-fi authors (and others!) go through where the series degraded and lost focus somewhat.From that persepctive, I saw Blindsight as a tightening of focus along that line.

I though writing was a bit wooden at times (as I find with much of hard Scifi), but I didn't find the perversions to be meant erotic or titillating . He's addressed that criticism before.
I found it it, like so much of his work, stark...very very stark
the sexual component rung as a call back of the circular oscar wildism for me

“Everything in the world is about sex except sex. Sex is about power.”​

as a device, I think it was a shock to the system to crack the habituation to the tropes...Silence of the lamb's Buffalo Bill, after all, was a gender serial killer who was so diluted (less so in the book, but still diluted) that he is sometimes seen as even comedic.
IMO it wasn't the most (or very) sophisticated device,as is a tendency in sci-fi. and it was a brute force method. But I didn't find it pornographic in a prurient sense. I found the sexual component to be much like what Herbert said about the pain box " Pain’s merely the axis of the test."


The vampirism , Starfish was of its time and I found it a refreshing neuro-behavioral take on the "bloodborn disease" that rationalist fantasy/adventure was using at the time. and the vampire mythos is quite old a seeps into our language and societal sense of (figurative) cannibalistic predation "she's an emotional vampire" etc - so i think it warrants visitation especially as used.
but that brings us back to doe as his flogging horse, that authors are wont to have
(I think King is the, um, King of that. The Regulators and Despiration and DreamCatcher)


I suggest we continue this convo but move it off-thread
(though it is a great example to outside readers that KF isn't quite the monolith that certain factions want to pretend)
 
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Well, that was a quick turnabout


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Be kind to one another -- except you are evil and you must obey
 
fuckidunno said:
I suggest we continue this convo but move it off-thread
(though it is a great example to outside readers that KF isn't quite the monolith that certain factions want to pretend)
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I don't think that'd be a particularly useful convo; the guy was going beyond "ok, but look he's REALLY EVIL", beyond cheap titilation, to a real love of the shit including a straight up name dropping of "Screw the Roses" that made me physically cringe when I read it. You don't name drop babby's first guide to introducing S&M to your relationship unless you are preaching to the choir or hoping people go look it up, especially in your future world where presumably other, possibly better guides would exist. You are not going to convince me otherwise. I'm not saying he's the only one by any stretch, but that doesn't change the facts on the ground and that he lacked Kings subtly to side the bits you are popping your degen boner to off the side.
He's also author non grata with me, being he's 4 out of 4 on "solid idea ruined by his inability to rein in his disturbing gore fetish", I am not going to waste any further time reading his material unless its proven that reading it has a better than 60% chance of curing cancer.

If you feel really strongly about belaboring the point or strongly about how I'm incorrect then, read that trilogy backwards: Go 3, 2, then 1. And if you can convince yourself he was not flogging the dolphin to the torture parts and that he was not getting off on the abuse that he shoehorned in less and less subtle ways... I dunno man, congrats on reaching levels of self delusion that approach John believing he passes as woman.
 
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Peace and Harmony said:
Someone tell me wtf a "jag" is.

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jag noun (1)
\ ˈjag \
Definition of jag (Entry 1 of 4)
1a: SPREE
a crying jag

He used and spelled it correctly.
C'mon brah. When John's stopped clock is right twice a day, it just makes everyone look silly when we refuse to acknowledge it.
 
Peace and Harmony said:
Someone tell me wtf a "jag" is.

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On top of the definitions given, it's a stereotypically female phrase. Which means, of course, it never happened. John is so desperate to be seen as a woman it's kind of hilarious. The performativeness of it all is just so, so cloying. I believe he's angry -- his team just took a gigantic L. But scared? Sobbing? Why? The only way John could ever host new life is if he were infected with a parasite, which, given his cooking skills, is actually pretty likely.
 
He is not sad, not even angry. This is just more justification for people to throw money at his scam PAC, and another way for him to act as the savior all women need.
I watched the twit interview, and of course all his "qualifications" were trotted out: Mississippi being the biggest one. When the other bitch dared to suggest that technology could help women talk about abortions in secret, John "with all respect" chided her for thinking people in Mississippi were smart enough to understand cell phones and apps. Because you know, on a show that has the word tech in the title, why the hell should they talk about technical solutions to things? The only way to really help these dumb broads is by donating to the PAC.
Then they had this other british suck-up who got progressively shit-faced as the show went on.
John did admit that while he went to school for journalism he didn't continue it as a career because it wouldn't pay for his porche collection. Which implies he does have some job allowing him to buy himself multiple luxury cars (other than being Mrs Wu of course since he would never admit Frank bought the cars).
 
Ghostse said:
I don't think that'd be a particularly useful convo;
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I think it's a great convo

Ghostse said:
the guy was going beyond "ok, but look he's REALLY EVIL", beyond cheap titilation, to a real love of the shit including a straight up name dropping of "Screw the Roses" that made me physically cringe when I read it. You don't name drop babby's first guide to introducing S&M to your relationship unless you are preaching to the choir or hoping people go look it up, especially in your future world where presumably other, possibly better guides would exist. You are not going to convince me otherwise. I'm not saying he's the only one by any stretch, but that doesn't change the facts on the ground and that he lacked Kings subtly to side the bits you are popping your degen boner to off the side.
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That one point of our disagreement, but that' just disagreement, and the convo is eploritng WHY


Ghostse said:
He's also author non grata with me,
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That's pretty obvious, I'm mch the other way

Ghostse said:
If you feel really strongly about belaboring the point or strongly about how I'm incorrect
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It's just a disagreement.
So I'm just offering the counterpoint
Ghostse said:
then, read that trilogy backwards: Go 3, 2, then 1. And if you can convince yourself he was not flogging the dolphin to the torture parts and that he was not getting off on the abuse that he shoehorned in less and less subtle ways... I dunno man, congrats on reaching levels of self delusion that approach John believing he passes as woman.
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That's a real drag - If e are going down that shit linging route - at first, you were alluding that other people hadn't read it putting yourself in a position of superior knowledge (I guess like John) and you didn't even get the trilogy name right (kind of like John)
 
fuckidunno said:
not familiar with that one, was it before or after the Rifters trilogy?
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I don't think there is any deepwater trilogy, With the specific refs, I think Goatse has gotta be talking about Rifters,


-edit : read the rest of the thread-

Watts was about 4 years out of academia and it read very very marine bio to me. Maybe that's why I think he kind of fell off a little as it got more terrestrial, he got out of his area. When he went back to space in Blindsight, I think he brought it back b/c it's a more like a marine environment with aliens being, well, alien. It's not like calling a character Clarke was exactly a subtle to the A.C. and his diving fiction. Kinda reminds me of Kristine Kathryn Rusch,her stuff is unapologetically wreck diving in space.

I read it as a marine mammals, and the marine environment in general is pretty savage, lots of rape and torture and all kinds of stuff informed a lot of that really raw behavior. He's always been about the dark side of behavior, and he's good at getting outside the socialized human moral biases, you kind of have to when you are a scientific diver. That world works in a way that's difficult for people to process and what it says about ourselves is hard to take.
For divers the characters can be a weird funhouse mirror, in the dive community we joke about how when we were kids we thought it was going to be like sealab 2020 , but it's more like sealab 2021 -- and the weirdness seems to vary with the type, commercial divers, scientific divers, cavers, contaminated water guys, sport diving ambassadors, free divers we're are all weird in their own ways. There really is something to the pre-adapted weirdo thing. I think it's used to being an alien b/c when we're down there we ARE the aliens and we have limited time ...there a saw about saturation divers seem to trade lifetime for bottom time :o

I wasn't bothered by the sexual stuff , it was intense, but biology is and how drives like reproduction create bizarre structures and behavior is really intense.
The really really savage stuff I think is exactly NOT for beating the bishop - in undergrad I remember the 2 classes that always filled up in like 5 minutes were "History of Rock" as a music elective and "The Sex Offender and the Criminal Justice System" . That class was a walk on the dark side, I don't think anyone was jacking it to that and it was all IRL human perversion. It was a reminder that the root meaning of fascinate is to transfix as through evil spell.


I don't think ANY of us need to start slinging insults at KFers
shit, I hate King the guy is a cokehead who just spews his baggae out on the page and he won't get therapy for it...or apparently an editor...cut about 400 pages Stevie
I though that the langoliers and insomnia were good ideas ruined by Stevie doing his shit - but that's just my take. I'm not gonna say other people are stupid or wrong or 'obviously haven't read it' or anything.





Moving : it'd be cool to move it over, I really see his early stuff as heavily marine bio, evo bio, and behavioral evo. Echopraxia seemed to be a couple steps abstracted as he got into the scientific method and epistemology type stuff. So I'm getting some different thoughts on it
The mods merged a couple of my posts, but Im not sure who to contact and if it's an imposition on them to make them do the work and move it.
I'd like to hear more about what everyone thinks, lover AND haters - I thought the Oscar Wilde thing was an interesting take, but admittedly I'm not really up on my Oscar Wilde
 
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Mola Ram said:
Are you fucking serious? Link?

Not that I disbelieve you, but that's a phenomenal piece of John's shithead nature. It must be preserved!
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You know, Mississippi is the state highest in the country of a certain demographic. I think that's what John's talking about.
 
AnOminous said:
You know, Mississippi is the state highest in the country of a certain demographic. I think that's what John's talking about.
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don't you tell me about mississippi I was bon in an old boot floating DOWN the mississippi.
My lived experiences allows me to bag a deer with a moonrock and I was so hungry as a child I only had one Porsche and a merely electromechanical pinbal machine collection

so you hush your mouth
 
Grand Fucktard said:
don't you tell me about mississippi I was bon in an old boot floating DOWN the mississippi.
My lived experiences allows me to bag a deer with a moonrock and I was so hungry as a child I only had one Porsche and a merely electromechanical pinbal machine collection

so you hush your mouth
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and it wasn’t that long ago that you were in a little Lamborghini, sleeping on bookshelves in the Hollywood Hills with only 47 billion dollars in your bank account, and only 47 Lamborghinis in your Lamborghini account, and only 47 hills in your Hollywood account, and only 47 TEDx talks where you talk about Warren Buffets in your TEDx talks where you talk about Warren Buffet account
 
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