Brianna Wu / John Flynt - Original Thread

  • Want to keep track of this thread?
    Accounts can bookmark posts, watch threads for updates, and jump back to where you stopped reading.
    Create account

What are you opinions on GamerGate and Brianna Wu / John Flynt?

  • I am of no opinion towards either.

    Votes: 104 8.6%
  • I am neutral on GamerGate, but think that Brianna Wu is a bad person.

    Votes: 631 52.1%
  • I am neutral on GamerGate, and think that Brianna Wu is just trying to get by.

    Votes: 9 0.7%
  • I am ANTI-GamerGate, but still think that Brianna Wu is a bad person.

    Votes: 112 9.2%
  • I am ANTI-GamerGate, and think that Brianna Wu is just trying to get by.

    Votes: 37 3.1%
  • I am PRO-GamerGate, and think that Brianna Wu is a bad person.

    Votes: 309 25.5%
  • I am PRO-GamerGate, but still think that and think that Brianna Wu is just trying to get by.

    Votes: 9 0.7%

  • Total voters
    1,211
Status
Not open for further replies.
So I tried to stay away from GG and my only source of info on this shit was a friend of mine. But REALLY REALLY?!

A game about depression and another one about teen pregnancy from rape?!

What is this shit ?! I realize I might not be the target demographic , but WHO IS the target demographic? I don't think pregnant teens would want to be reminded they're pregnant and the ones who aren't pregnant have more important things to do than spending time being patronized about rape-gnancy through a "game" that plays like a powerpoint presentation!
 
What's really interesting to me is how badly they want video games to be taken seriously, and how they go about it. There's a name for films that try waaaaaaay too hard to make a point and are clearly made because they want to "change things." They're called Oscar Bait and The Academy openly snubs films that attempt to bait them into being nominated by being "2deep4u."

Basically what I'm saying is that every other industry sees games like that as a further proof that everyone involved in the industry is "See, MOM, games ARE art!" If something like Gone Home or Pregnancy were films instead of games, they would be mocked for their delusion instead of lauded and given tons of awards.
 
But some Oscar Baits actually win awards and even Oscars. Not mention Oscar baits are pushed by big studios with very well known famous actors. This is fresh film student project level, silly and corny but harmless.
 
But some Oscar Baits actually win awards and even Oscars. Not mention Oscar baits are pushed by big studios with very well known famous actors. This is fresh film student project level, silly and corny but harmless.
And on the chance that they do, the Academy is openly mocked for being so easy to fool. Then again with all the decisions the Academy has made in recent years all bets are kind of off.
 
And on the chance that they do, the Academy is openly mocked for being so easy to fool. Then again with all the decisions the Academy has made in recent years all bets are kind of off.
People have mocked the Academy descisions before the internet got mainstream (even 90's cartoon shows did it). The problem is that gaming doesn't even have an Academy.

Games will survive a shitty half assed choice your own adventure being in or out the store. I mean, Steam still sells Bad Rats.
 
So I tried to stay away from GG and my only source of info on this shit was a friend of mine. But REALLY REALLY?!

A game about depression and another one about teen pregnancy from rape?!

What is this shit ?! I realize I might not be the target demographic , but WHO IS the target demographic? I don't think pregnant teens would want to be reminded they're pregnant and the ones who aren't pregnant have more important things to do than spending time being patronized about rape-gnancy through a "game" that plays like a powerpoint presentation!

Before I Even Begin: I'm really sorry, for all of you, that this shit keeps cross-contaminating boards and posts, but this is a fucking nuclear firestorm of an issue and isn't going to be solved any time soon, and since those responsible keep inserting their tendrils anywhere they can, best to buck up and bunker down. This is going to last for some time, and the very nature of the conflict being against corruption means that it's an uphill battle, though ironically enough, one that the GGers are slowly winning.

As someone admittedly Pro-GG, I'm genuinely sorry this shit has to be everywhere. People have the right to stay neutral in this fuckstorm, and more importantly, stay the fuck away from it. That's actually another major difference between the sides, that one can accept the validity of other viewpoints without flying off the fucking hinge, but that's fodder for another thread. Let's get down to brass tacks and ass managers.

The general gist is that, almost to a man, these people hate the fact that people can get what they want. Take a look at the likes of Alex Lifschitz (I.E. Zoe Quinn's current joy-boy) and you'll see that these people believe, violently, that they and they alone should be responsible for what constitutes culture and what constitutes art. It's a natural progression of the same assholes that have been around for literally decades, but Social Networking and the Internet has made them more obnoxious and bigger assholes than ever before. Sit down, fellow Kiwis, and I'll harken to you a tale from my mother. I'm entirely sure I paraphrased this story in the Gamergate thread once, but it remains relevant and I'm hoping you find the parallels interesting.

Years ago, my mom was a very locally-active poet and artist. She had a lot of friends in the industry in Northport (where she used to live), and had been featured in multiple poetry publications and art review sites. At some point, she got involved with the Northport Arts Coalition, a nonprofit that was intended to sponsor the arts in my home town. And though she wasn't aware of it, the heads of NAC were very much what we on the Kiwi Farm would consider so-called SJWs: rich, white, professional victims who painted themselves as societal outcasts, latching parasiticially onto otherwise-good causes not for actually wanting to help them, but for being able to exploit them to their ends. Sound familiar? According to mom, a lot of them used many, if not identical tactics of the so-called SJWs - you can't criticize them, they're gay/trans/etc, even if that has nothing to do with why they were being criticized.

My mom, true to form, was, in contrast, an embittered old-school activist who marched for civil rights, so to say these people would eventually fuck with the wrong lady is a bit of an understatement. But I'm getting ahead of myself. Mom, once on NAC, had a great idea after talking with people at Northport's courthouse/city hall/police station: There was a hell of a lot of unused wall space in the primary court room at the town hall, and this could be a great venue for getting community artists and the like involved with the community. What she proposed was Artists Celebrate Northport, which everyone else on NAC's board thought was an absolutely terrible idea, but mom went and did anyway on her own dime, dragging me along for the ride, because - fuck it, I'm down for giving a bunch of old women a metaphorical finger. So mom managed to get a huge turnout - tons of artists from all over the Northport-East Northport area wanted in, and the only demand for the art we put up was that it had something to do with Northport itself. The works we had were fantastic - photography works showing Northport from the 1800s, paintings of clammers in the harbor, even a really cute picture painted of the geese in the park. The event was monumentally successful, and Mom was asked to rotate in another set of pictures the following month, more than making back the limited money she had spent on the event via community goodwill alone.

NAC was fucking pissed. They'd been shown up by some little Janey-Come-Lately upstart who actually succeeded at their mission statement whilst they'd been content to sit around and circlejerk. The next few times mom ran the event, NAC had to get involved, having a few of their own board members contribute works, or helping to support the event now that mom had already gotten the damned thing off the ground. Mom remained in charge, however, and she would routinely thwart them. Many times, they demanded a piece be in the courtroom show - and mom disallowed it for having nothing to do with Northport. There eventually came a point where NAC had finally had enough of this, and began to essentially wage a war-in-secret on my mom.

It was as inept as could be - attempts to conflate the actions of their own kids (who did such monumentally stupid shit as skateboarding on the front steps of a fucking police station for example) as being something I had done coming most readily to mind, which likely would have been very successful if ours wasn't a town of under 20,000 where literally everyone knows one another.

It didn't stop with shit like that, either - they called mom to try to threaten and harass her into supporting artists they wanted. Mom let them have it - she was tough as balls, and would never back off. Unfortunately, mom also had unstable hypertension and couldn't afford to get angry to this degree repeatedly - something many on NAC's board were apparently sort of counting on, but mom kept going anyway. They accused her of being a homophobe, which likely would have gone someplace if mom didn't have a gay relative she was actively helping. They accused her of being transphobic, which would have also likely gone someplace if the person in question had any signs whatsoever of even having anything to do with being transgender. My personal favorite was when one of NAC's headliners yelled at me for touching the piano at the library, screaming loudly that like someone as lowbrow as me could never understand things like musical instruments, when I then proceeded to play the opening segment from Turkish Rondo, as my mom explained that I grew up in a house with a piano. Good times.

It's amazing how a bunch of rich white people who essentially have more free time than OPL can be this incompetent, but there you have it, I s'pose.

It all came to a head for the first time when NAC wanted to give multiple slots in Artists Celebrate Northport to one Ron Valerio. Ron was an.... Interesting and quite-probably fucked-up artist who drew bizarre, surrealist paintings of shit like naked aliens. For the uninitiated, I barely know how to describe it to you - his art essentially looks like Moleman9000's, with psychodelic colors, full-frontal nudity, and wonky proportions clearly spawned from an unsound mind. Ron Valerio was a major donor to NAC's coffers in the past, and NAC wanted him in the show. Mom outright refused, since (A) his shit had bugger all to do with Northport, (B) Would piss off the village board, and (C) Showed a clear fucking conflict-of-interest, since Ron was financially supporting several members of NAC's board. Mom fought it tooth and claw, but ultimately was outvoted, and one of Ron Valerio's naked alien paintings wound up in the show. Mom had been smart - many of the other artists involved in the show this session were ones that NAC couldn't really afford to piss off. The writing was on the wall, though - NAC was going to do anything it could to get rid of mom at this point. Mom, for all her toughness, had been ground down by this point - she'd happily have, in the words of Jace, finished the fight, but between her unstable hypertension and the fact that NAC was planning to essentially blacklist her outright, mom decided it was time to fuck off. And so she did, without too much fuss.

q93xckb.jpg

This is actually the single least-surreal work of Valerio's I've seen, if you can believe it.

The following months feature a show entirely starring people NAC wanted, and the community feedback was harsh. The month after featured a show entirely devoted to Ron Valerio, and NAC was never allowed to do the event again. Apparently an entire room full of psychedelic naked alien pictures was deemed not really great for a community town hall setting where court proceedings were held. Northport's village council kicked their asses out and now, fittingly enough, runs the event on their own.

In many ways, to hear my mom tell it, the commonalities between NAC and the Anti-GGers were disturbingly similar. Both featured a huge group of rich, white, professional victims who were big on attaching themselves to otherwise-benevolent things (gay rights, transgender rights, etc) and using them as launching points to further their careers and browbeating anyone who disagreed. Once actually in NAC, and once NAC was financed by a grant, none of them had an actual interest in doing much with it - it was all about enriching themselves and their associates, needs of the greater community be damned. For me the biggest commonality is that they considered themselves the sole custodians of culture, and, like the so-called SJWs, were absolute fucking ideologues when it came to identity. Only we are able to say what's good art and what isn't, to hear them put it. And what is often ever-so-coinicidentally happened to be what filled the coffers at the time.
 
I'd like to mention that the whole controversy, and both sides, are something of a running joke amongst actual journalists that I bring the subject up to. Well, that's the positive reaction. Some are really pissed that these people call themselves journalists regardless of their ethics. Journalists have to work with bloggers all the time, but they're sure to call them that: bloggers.
 
I'm gonna expand wider for tweets which seem notable to me for Wu's Twitter from now onwards, so expect huge updates.

Wu tweets about psychology! This time it's not from her blocker
lz8uTFL.png
Murdering and threats! Also, Wu seems to be not reading the word "radical" from the term "radical feminists"
owhkcdQ.png
Yeah, I'm including the ones that she retweets too. Apparently the game industry IGNORES GamerGate (Pretty stupid even if you're against GG), and apparently gamers are scared of change (again).
ZY5mWlx.png
Brianna Wu has also followed Bob Chipman. Also, GamerGate is a symptom and the game industry is a disease. (lol this isn't Plague Inc.)
Y7liyBe.png
Remember to all men, DO NOT DISAGREE WITH WOMEN IN THE GAME INDUSTRY. YOU'LL NEED THAT ADVICE.
CJkNlfp.png
>Wu and McIntosh lololol
4aoP1Cu.png
Wu seems to be a few steps away from Homer in terms of the usage of the words "fake X" and "allies"...
e2lJfyr.png
If game development is really this stressful, then how about taking a break from Twi-- ah, fuck it. I'm mansplaining again.
WAov5D8.png
Woman have been harassed due to GamerGate again! Also, French shoes
7bFWGQU.png
Actually, it's about ethics in fixing the music industry in journalism!
syqoyCK.png
And after all these ramblings, Wu finally posts a screenshot from her latest game (and yes, it's literally targeted towards little kids and it's an educational game)
38iP9h7.png
Full image from the game
T1dVBjQ.jpg
Violence is solved in video games, (lolwut) now let's get to the mechanics of conversation!
RtaxbA1.png
Wu has her new podcast called Rocket
4GTeVS8.png
Actually, it's supposed to be about ethics in PR in video game journalism!
t4Aj17h.png
She can't be serious that the spice girls represent a purer time in music? A team of hot women recruited to be in a major corporate group vs now when people become popular without even getting signed.
Her views on psychology are incredibly naive, they have to be literally made up on the spot. I figured everyone has taken psychology in college.

Wu runs 8 miles a day with no off day? Call me skeptical.
his is what a 30 year old woman looks like after running 8 miles a day.
article-0-1C69049200000578-748_634x1119.jpg
 
Last edited:
Did Wu seriously become a 90's kid too? Christ.
As someone who grew up in the 80s-90s , I have to mention that I never saw what was amazing about that time period except for maybe the cartoons. Fashion was terrible , it was the starting point for reality TV , music contests that make you an instant-star , there was a terrible short-lived 70s comeback , mushroom haircuts parted in the middle , the boy/girl-group saturated second half , weird female hairdos , the "make everything X-TREME " fad that gave us Rob freaking Liefeld. No really , there's nothing to celebrate about the 90s.
 
So apparently it's another choose your own adventure game, but this time it takes the role of a 14-year old being raped and later getting pregnant. So you have to make choices to either abort the baby or stay with the child.​

Here's my thing about this.... And I have a view thoughts on it.

1. The "Not enough gameplay" / "Oh thse "Games" today"/ "This doesn't belong on steam."

1. Don't see where people get the idea that Steam is the holiest of holys, GabeN jokes aside. I've seen the most amateurish of shit on Steam. I've seen crappy games that I see advertised on crappy streaming sites on steam. And yet, far too often, I see this "Doesn't belong on steam!"

If there is this idea that Steam needs to be kept pure, I hate to burst the bubble but the battle was already lost.

2. "WEN I PLAY GAMES I PLAY GAMES TO ________ AND THIS GAME IS NOT __________"

Yes. How unfortunate that the entire video gaming industry is not personally catering to your tastes.

3. "HUR HUR HUR, A FUKIN PREGNANCY GAME HUR HUR HUR, 14 YEAR OLD GIRLS SHOULDN'T BE THINKING ABOUT THIS HUR HUR HUR HUR. THIS IS SMUT AND FILTH."

Going to echo the argument of people in the comments. If you want to give Hatred, where you play as a Wizard who finally snaps, a pass because free speech but block this one off, get stuffed.

4. If a woman needs advice with pregnancy she should speak to a community support group, not play a video game.

Going to agree with this sentiment.

Overall, it has every right to be on steam. Not because it's spectacular, but because steam accepts all sorts.

I have the same attitude as I did with depression quest. It looks terribly underwhelming (Why are all the Social Justice type games like that? It IS possible to combine quality and message.) but so do 50% of the other games I've seen on steam.

At least 50%
 
Fun fact: Spice Girls were recruited and managed by a man. "Girl Power" was a marketing gimmick invented by a guy.
 
Going to echo the argument of people in the comments. If you want to give Hatred, where you play as a Wizard who finally snaps, a pass because free speech but block this one off, get stuffed.

Steam Greenlight is supposedly intended to let the actual users of Steam have some input in what goes on Steam. If one game looks like it is professionally designed and playable, and the other looks like it was slapped together in a text adventure generator by an amateur, it is entirely reasonable to support putting one on Steam and not the other.

(Not saying that's the case for either one, since I've looked at neither, and only looked at a trailer for Hatred.)
 
As someone who grew up in the 80s-90s , I have to mention that I never saw what was amazing about that time period except for maybe the cartoons. Fashion was terrible , it was the starting point for reality TV , music contests that make you an instant-star , there was a terrible short-lived 70s comeback , mushroom haircuts parted in the middle , the boy/girl-group saturated second half , weird female hairdos , the "make everything X-TREME " fad that gave us Rob freaking Liefeld. No really , there's nothing to celebrate about the 90s.
off topic 90s discussion
The 90s had the 90s internet. BBSs, Grunge music. Lots of good movies, much of the fashion was toned down enough to wear today or in 1980. Nice economy, and the president was amusing and not in a sad way. headbangers ball was on mtv, so was beavis and butthead. trolls were funnier, new 0-day came out like every single day, nobody had firewalls, it was cyberpunk as hell. It wasn't real bad.
I counter your parted dickhead haircut with an epic high top fade
house-party1.jpg

optionally with a batman logo carved in the back but i couldn't find a pic
Fun fact: Spice Girls were recruited and managed by a man. "Girl Power" was a marketing gimmick invented by a guy.
I didn't even know that and I could have told you that.. it's absolutely astonishing that wu can't smell that this despite spending a considerable amount of time painting other things as sexist. Also I'm amused by the thought of a teenage gay man wu decked out in 90s fashion going crazy over spice girls. It's a living stereotype.

This and wu's sexist notions about women do this, men do that, being raised with male privilege. Well I don't know what I'm getting at but wu is so lousy at being a feminist, she's just a slightly sexist guy in a dress who speaks SJW lingo.
 
Steam Greenlight is supposedly intended to let the actual users of Steam have some input in what goes on Steam. If one game looks like it is professionally designed and playable, and the other looks like it was slapped together in a text adventure generator by an amateur, it is entirely reasonable to support putting one on Steam and not the other.

(Not saying that's the case for either one, since I've looked at neither, and only looked at a trailer for Hatred.)

This is true. Though in regards to the one guy who was screeching about how 14 year old girls shouldn't be thinking about pregnancy and 18 year old girls shouldn't even be thinking about pregnancy, and how making a game about Pregnancy is the devil, I'm just saying he'd better be full Jack Thompson, and not one of the "Hatred is a beacon of free speech" types.

Quality is an entirely different affair.

Though given the quality of a lot of games I see on steam, I think the Greenlight effort is failing. Unless, of course, those games were pre/never greenlight.
 
Mildly off-topic, but @Jaimas, your mom sounds amazing and take-no-bullshit. Much respect.

As for the pregnancy game ... It seems pretty weird, but being weird and tasteless isn't a censorship offense. Whether it's technically a game--dunno, that's debatable. I'd say to let it go and if the market doesn't want it, it'll die. It definitely does have a whiff of the Oscar bait about it, and that's usually poison to consumers.

And Brianna needs to calm the heck down, buy men's shoes (no shame in that--men's boots are awesome) and eat something besides Soylent. Spending your day venting on Twitter while hucking down soy shakes is pretty much a recipe for frustration and dysfunction.
 
She can't be serious that the spice girls represent a purer time in music? A team of hot women recruited to be in a major corporate group vs now when people become popular without even getting signed.

Spice Girls are what Wu imagines himself to be: feminine, seemingly in control (GURRRRL POWER!), and sexed up to the nines. They are his version of Rosechu.

Didn't one of the eyewitness accounts from Wu's college days say he blasted Spice Girls music all night?

That was Madonna. See a common theme here?
 
Last edited:
It definitely does have a whiff of the Oscar bait about it, and that's usually poison to consumers.

The thing about Oscar bait is it isn't sufficient by itself. Successful Oscar bait is something like Schindler's List where you had a phenomenally talented director who had been snubbed by the Academy time and again largely because most of his works were overtly directed at a mass audience as pure entertainment.

SL was basically his "I dare you not to give me an Oscar for this." You might recall it was up against The Piano and The Remains of the Day, so it wasn't up against chumps.
 
She can't be serious that the spice girls represent a purer time in music? A team of hot women recruited to be in a major corporate group vs now when people become popular without even getting signed.
Her views on psychology are incredibly naive, they have to be literally made up on the spot. I figured everyone has taken psychology in college.

Wu runs 8 miles a day with no off day? Call me skeptical.
his is what a 30 year old woman looks like after running 8 miles a day.
article-0-1C69049200000578-748_634x1119.jpg
Believing in manufactured girl or boy bands is like the equivalent of believing WWF wrestling is 100% genuine.
What's really interesting to me is how badly they want video games to be taken seriously, and how they go about it. There's a name for films that try waaaaaaay too hard to make a point and are clearly made because they want to "change things." They're called Oscar Bait and The Academy openly snubs films that attempt to bait them into being nominated by being "2deep4u."

Basically what I'm saying is that every other industry sees games like that as a further proof that everyone involved in the industry is "See, MOM, games ARE art!" If something like Gone Home or Pregnancy were films instead of games, they would be mocked for their delusion instead of lauded and given tons of awards.
I wish they'd just go all out and make a fun game where you beat up the patriarchy for oppressing and/or manslamming into you.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom