Bad webcomics

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Source, JollyJack
The comments are mostly spergefests about being anti-Trump, nothing about how this is a “very interesting piece of political parody” or something. I’m sure JollyJack has been in here before, if not, welcome him with open arms. I could write a whole autistic post about him because he’s quite the interesting fellow who suffers from TDS as a European, the worst kind of TDS.
 
Frightened Rabbit said:
Ancient Greece is known for being progressive aren't they?
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Aristotle never was an Athenian citizen and was completely ineligible for political office (due to being born in Stageira). In general the Greek poleis did not mutually recognize citizenship, moving from your home polis to another city would turn you into a free alien resident (metic/perioece/xenoi).
 
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Ice Mountain said:
Vivziepop has what is genuinely one of the most headache-inducing artstyles on the planet, and I have no idea how people manage to find it appealing in any way. I physically cannot stare at this image for longer than five seconds at a time, otherwise my brain will begin to melt. Even in the actual comic, if there's more than one character in a panel, I've gotta tap out. It is so fucking hard to tell what's going on with any of these guys.
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Thank god someone said it. Out of all of Vizzie's criticism I have read online, the one I don't see enough is her atrocious art.
It's just instinctual, I cannot stand looking at it, the shapes are wrong and the color gradient makes my head hurt. Does a character have 4 arms or 3? when they are sitting, is that a knee or an elbow? am I looking at the front or the back? Why is it that you can have hour long explanations on why her scripts are bad but no one calls a spade a spade: her art is bad, it's both unpleasant to look at and unclear what you're looking at.

There was a video that used Team Fortress 2 as a standard for good art design, from both a gameplay perspective as well as mise en scene.
 
TopTierHealer said:
Thank god someone said it. Out of all of Vizzie's criticism I have read online, the one I don't see enough is her atrocious art.
It's just instinctual, I cannot stand looking at it, the shapes are wrong and the color gradient makes my head hurt. Does a character have 4 arms or 3? when they are sitting, is that a knee or an elbow? am I looking at the front or the back? Why is it that you can have hour long explanations on why her scripts are bad but no one calls a spade a spade: her art is bad, it's both unpleasant to look at and unclear what you're looking at.

There was a video that used Team Fortress 2 as a standard for good art design, from both a gameplay perspective as well as mise en scene.
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In the land of beanmouth, the spindly twisty sexyman is king.
 
The greater a'tuin said:
There used to be a comic called Krrobar. It looked like this
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(more is archived on an ancient deviantart page)
One day the creator abruptly posted this
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then fatally shot his wife + himself
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You would think that someone with enough darkness in his heart to carry out a murder-suicide in a public place would also be capable of making a comic that wasn't the blandest thing I've ever seen. I thought he would just troon out.
 
TopTierHealer said:
Thank god someone said it. Out of all of Vizzie's criticism I have read online, the one I don't see enough is her atrocious art.
It's just instinctual, I cannot stand looking at it, the shapes are wrong and the color gradient makes my head hurt. Does a character have 4 arms or 3? when they are sitting, is that a knee or an elbow? am I looking at the front or the back? Why is it that you can have hour long explanations on why her scripts are bad but no one calls a spade a spade: her art is bad, it's both unpleasant to look at and unclear what you're looking at.

There was a video that used Team Fortress 2 as a standard for good art design, from both a gameplay perspective as well as mise en scene.
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Sadly people have criticized it. Since 2011. She has some Dobson in her. That's for sure BWW literally stated she sperged before they finished the review.
 
Hakase Shinonome said:
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Source, JollyJack
The comments are mostly spergefests about being anti-Trump, nothing about how this is a “very interesting piece of political parody” or something. I’m sure JollyJack has been in here before, if not, welcome him with open arms. I could write a whole autistic post about him because he’s quite the interesting fellow who suffers from TDS as a European, the worst kind of TDS.
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All I remember of Jollyjack is the blatant giantess fetish with weird body proportions, and that he would die screaming rather than cop to being a furry (he obviously was). I think there was an ED article on him, too.
 
TopTierHealer said:
There was a video that used Team Fortress 2 as a standard for good art design, from both a gameplay perspective as well as mise en scene.
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I found two. First one focuses on silhouettes and color, whereas the second goes more into how the shapes accurately reflect characters' hitboxes and the like.

This might be bias talking because the game taught me to like clean, simple designs, but I still consider the base game to be the gold standard in art design. Not just in longevity (it started to show its age a couple years ago, but that's not bad for a nearly two-decades-old game) but in terms of integration and direction. They put so much thought into it, from themes to silhouettes to values to focal points, that the second accessories got out of control it hurt the careful balances all the more. This is because, at the time, Valve understood that in design, especially game design, everything has a purpose.

To bring this post back on topic, I understand that designing for video games is different from comics, animation, etc. Whether you think it's to craft an experience or say something about society (bottom text), it's not about playing dollhouse with your OCs and doing whatever you want. It's "does this do anything." Does it work towards conveying what you're trying to say? Does it hold up under scrutiny, or does it work against you? That's what any artist should ask himself. I have half a mind to show that Dobson comic about the audience seeing apples vs pears but I can't find it.
 
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invisibult plus+ said:
I found two. First one focuses on silhouettes and color, whereas the second goes more into how the shapes accurately reflect characters' hitboxes and the like.

This might be bias talking because the game taught me to like clean, simple designs, but I still consider the base game to be the gold standard in art design. Not just in longevity (it started to show its age a couple years ago, but that's not bad for a nearly two-decades-old game) but in terms of integration and direction. They put so much thought into it, from themes to silhouettes to values to focal points, that the second accessories got out of control it hurt the careful balances all the more. This is because, at the time, Valve understood that in design, especially game design, everything has a purpose.

To bring this post back on topic, I understand that designing for video games is different from comics, animation, etc. Whether you think it's to craft an experience or say something about society (bottom text), it's not about playing dollhouse with your OCs and doing whatever you want. It's "does this do anything." Does it work towards conveying what you're trying to say? Does it hold up under scrutiny, or does it work against you? That's what any artist should ask himself. I have half a mind to show that Dobson comic about the audience seeing apples vs pears but I can't find it.
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That's the one I was thinking of, or at least it sounds the same. It's been a few years.

As much as people say that AI will democratize art that's not true. A bad designer with AI tools will still make shitty art. Someone with no aesthetic sensibilities will only be able to make slop, there's a little je ne sais quoi needed to transfer what's in your head to the paper and make it pleasant, palatable and insightful. Do you remember being in school and having a kid that could not draw to save his life or someone who just couldn't understand geometry? No matter how many hours he would sink into it, he would be getting a passing grade at best.
The more I grow up, the more I understand that a million hours on MS paint can't overcome raw talent. You can't train to become Mozart, you need to be born as one.

Vizzie is a bad artist (drawing and writing) and it's time to stop with the bad news sandwich. Youtubers try to search for a silver lining in her writing when it's not there, they're just convincing themselves of something that isn't there or a reference that's purely in their head (some of the videos kept trying to talk about her character's arcs, etc, but I don't think she's capable of writing one).
 
Dr. Arinsu said:
Did someone talk about Ava's Demons here. I found out she submitted Muffet to undertale recently which is fucking crazy.
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Not for a few years. I checked it just now and she's focusing on side character Excessans. I think it's to show what a non-binary civilization would be like, how connection works to Excessans and how Titan impacted ones who aren't elites, but it's been almost 14 years. I kept an eye on it during the droughts, and while it's been "written down" for a long time, she's been trying to remove herself from the personal issues she's based it on by calling herself non-binary among other things. I don't know if I've lost the plot, or has she. The story is nearly old enough to go to high school and I can't bring myself to care much anymore.

TopTierHealer said:
The more I grow up, the more I understand that a million hours on MS paint can't overcome raw talent. You can't train to become Mozart, you need to be born as one.

Vizzie is a bad artist (drawing and writing) and it's time to stop with the bad news sandwich. Youtubers try to search for a silver lining in her writing when it's not there, they're just convincing themselves of something that isn't there or a reference that's purely in their head (some of the videos kept trying to talk about her character's arcs, etc, but I don't think she's capable of writing one).
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The part about needing to be born with ability made me think of niches. Part of me wants to be cynical and talk about how virality beats quality in some demographics, or that YouTubers want to look reasonable and kosher, but another thinks that the sunk cost fallacy is at play. If you can convince yourself that something has potential, it’s easier to tolerate spending hours making and editing a video about it. Especially if you’re not about just ripping into something because it sucks. Speaking of niches, Vivzie’s niche is to latch onto people and throw them away. See the artists she plagiarized, the voice actors she wouldn’t keep, and practically everyone who worked at Spindlehorse. She’s incapable of listening to criticism or even writing a character arc because she’s spent her whole life failing upwards, insulated from the consequences of her actions.

You can't write development when you never had to develop in the first place.

I remember this diagram about how, in drawing techniques like FORCE, you need to be “truthful.” Getting the whole truth is impossible since everyone has his own blind spots and biases, but if you learn enough about your subject to have an informed opinion about it, you’ll be closer to the truth than if you make assumptions. You may know more about a subject, or grasp it more easily, but those blind spots make things like criticism and studying particularly important. Other people can see things you can't, or convey them in ways you don't quite know yet, while studies help you learn for yourself when done properly. It's one thing to be bad because you simply don't know any better. It's another when you're in your thirties, with advanced "artist age," and keep relying on those assumptions. To the point where you think people getting annoyed with your protagonist being a fuckup means you wrote her effectively.

Which video was the one? Both are ~6 years old.
 
I saw a video the other day that was all about how to use AI to make comics. One problem with AI is that even with the same prompts, you get different looking characters. It was shilling for one of the AI companies that boasted a consistent character tool. Then this chick talked about how she used ChatGPT to write the script FOR her! It came up with everything, including the title of her comic and pretty much everything else. Then she went on to brag about all the time she saved making this comic, and all I could think of was how this was the death of art. Bad enough she didn't draw anything, but not to even write the thing herself?! Jesus wept!
 
invisibult plus+ said:
You can't write development when you never had to develop in the first place.
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Yeah, I was going to talk about Gene Roddenberry as a counter to Vizzie but the thread has been derailed enough so let's get back to basics.
Speaking of unlikeable assholes who live in their bubbles , Least I could do is still updating.

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I remember back in the day this was a sex comic about a guy who nailed 3 women a day, when did it turn into Cathy?
 
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