Anime/Manga - Discuss Japanese cartoons and comics here; NO CULTURE WAR DOOMPOSTING!

[Chocolate Rain]

It came out at the time when the Morbius meme was still somewhat fresh and a bunch of people decided to try to do it again, this time with a manga.

And it actually did work or at least managed to convince Japs that it was worth keeping alive long enough to get a consistent readerbase.

 

[Seminar]

Just finished watching Clevatess it was fun and 2nd season was apparently announced too so good.
And just finished re watching Chaika s1 (i didnt knew there was 2nd one) i guess i will continue watching and there is also an OVA i didnt watch.
.

 

[Chocolate Rain]

All this praise for Clevatess almost makes me wish I had picked it up instead of New Panty & Stocking.

 

[DrearyDoomguy]

Japan definitely spooked them a little hence why the Reze movie has a completely different staff and is staying loyal to the source of material unlike the first season.

They definitely took the wrong approach with S1. They dumped money into making the animation look "cinematic" with the end result being something that cost them more and looked way too clean for the source material in question.

 

[The Lаughing Man]

It's essentially a meme manga that took off because a bunch of bored hood weebs on twitter pushed it as a joke but then people took the joke too seriously you then add in a lot of shilling from Jump and it managed to become a decent hit now content wise it's pretty obvious that this is the author's very first serialization because its insanely rough looking at times, the story is nothing special as is with current shounen slop but it starts off fairly endearing until it becomes clear that the author doesn't really have a solid idea of where to take it so you're mostly just reading for the "aura" moments to compensate for the lack of direction. Overall its another "popular for the sake of being popular" work but its not bad if you come in with the knowledge that it is overhyped.

Standalone complex at its finest.

 

[evilkog]

I know this isn't that big a revelation, but the average anime fan is genuinely retarded, looking through the MAL Top 100 confirmed this. I was going through it, scratching my head, wondering how they deemed Frieren the best anime ever, or HxH 7th.
When I look at IMDB ratings I don't always agree, but I understand. The Sopranos has interesting characters, GoT has intricate world building, Breaking Bad has a compelling story. HxH and Frieren have none of those.
Then I realised, what anime fans consider good is different to normal people. They care about hype moments, fan service, and easy and digestible narratives. Actual substance is secondary. I don't like sounding pretentious, but anyone who thinks Frieren and HxH are among the best anime ever is below me.

 

[Professor Donger]

who thinks Frieren and HxH are among the best anime ever is below me.

The main reason Frieren was so enjoyable for many people (myself included) was specifically because it came out around a time when the only real fantasy anime available were Isekai or just straight-up garbage. It was a breath of fresh air, the characters were interesting, and the setting was fun.

I wouldn't go out of my way to say it's the best anime ever, but it's definitely better than Solo Leveling.

 

[Red Dragon]

They care about hype moments, fan service, and easy and digestible narratives. Actual substance is secondary.

Don't forget the teenager instinct to always be part of a group. I had an argument with a friend who swears Frieren is a groundbreaking anime devoid of any faults, and his reasoning is simply 'it's popular, you're just a contrarian'. The guy can't even explain why it is so great, focusing on the fact I don't follow the rest of the cattle. The same guy is a huge One Piece fan and only watches flavor of the month slop, he follows the pattern to a t.

Simplicity is not even a bad thing when done right: Kaoru Hana is extremely refreshing, and also extremely simple. The execution is well done, and the typical tropes of romance anime don't drag for multiple episodes. It's weird how an anime where people solve their misunderstandings and problems by simply talking and being honest with each other feels different than the rest. The main character fighting his own insecurities and manning up is the best selling point of the series.

I never understood the hype around HxH, looks like a run-of-the-mill shonen with kids.

 

[Professor Donger]

I never understood the hype around HxH, looks like a run-of-the-mill shonen with kids.

I think the people who like HXH, if we're talking about Hunter X Hunter (bear with me, I'm an idiot), is because, like JJK, its power system is interesting, and that's about it.

I had an argument with a friend who swears Frieren is a groundbreaking anime devoid of any faults,

Your friend is a moron. Frieren is good because the story it's trying to tell is decent. There aren't many anime that deal with Elvish semi-immortality all that well and go over the issues of what it's like to be a long-lived species around a species of people that live infinitely shorter lives than you. Dungeon Meshi touches on it in the Manga a bit, with Marcille being upset because she outlived her father, and she's eventually going to outlive her friends as well, and discusses how long-lived races view the shorter-lived races as essentially children. But it's not to the same extent as something like Frieren, where one moment you're celebrating the destruction of the Demon King and the next you're seeing that same party as old men.

You get to see Frieren's change from being this stoic elf who kind of ignores others for the pursuit of magic, to a woman who cares about the people she's been tasked with nurturing and guiding. Her relationship with Fern specifically is fantastic, and it's one of the reasons people argue that Fern and Stark are the main characters of Frieren after they're introduced.

The show is also great because it doesn't try to pull the postmodern bullshit that a lot of shows do nowadays, where they go "oh no, the thing we're fighting is definitely evil." It's one of the reasons people liked Goblin Slayer, even if Goblin Slayer is definitely mid.

Friren IS a solid 8 out of 10 anime. It's not one of the best of all time, nor is it flawless and for everyone, but within the fantasy genre, it's pretty impressive. It doesn't help that if you try to read Western fantasy, you're more likely to encounter Romantasy, which is trash. Then, if you're trying to read Japanese or Eastern Fantasy, you're either getting an Isekai story or a Solo Leveling/Gamer story.

 

[Chocolate Rain]

Frieren is just what Fullmetal Alchemist was for millennials back in the 00s, their first exposure to a popular shounen anime that didn't follow the preconceive notion to what a shounen anime is (back then it was DBZ and Pokemon and now its Demon Slayer and JJK) so for the current zoomers with no exposure to anything that's not spastic aura farming battle shounen its considered god tier. I wouldn't put Frieren in my top three but its way better than a lot of offerings we've gotten this decade thus far.

I never understood the hype around HxH, looks like a run-of-the-mill shonen with kids.

Much like One Piece was in the mid to late 00s it was considered a diamond in the rough for its genre that avoided the same pitfalls of its contemporaries and was seen as a subversion of the genre because the MC was pragmatic and it had a "complex" power system at play which attracted many psuedos to it but unlike Chainsawman there's no irony or thirst posting to any of it.

 

[RSU 1741]

All this praise for Clevatess almost makes me wish I had picked it up

It's a decent fantasy story. It has problems in pacing, exposition, some episodes are really harsh on the animation and some fight scenes are muddled, the "show me your tits woman" scene is in retrospective kind of gratuitous.... but it's a solid 7/10 fantasy anime. I've realized that despite all its numerous faults in exposition it manages to reach some basic objectives well, like a old fantasy novel that you gladly read until the end. The adaptation has a 2-3 narrative arcs and we're given a good idea of how the world functions on the cultural, political and magical level.

Plus Alicia goes into "angry warrior woman" stereotype category and I'm a sucker for those. They were cowards and didn't keep Nell in her ..... disheveled real form (that had some charm and would have been kind of novel, truth be told).

Frieren was so enjoyable

Frieren is a good adaptation. It's very clear that the author had some foggy idea about working on the theme of immortality/mortality and the importance of the moment etc etc but he simply lacks the skills to properly develop such an idea. Frieren isn't a well-made tale about the human condition or mortality and the like: it's a decent fantasy with good animation and likeable characters. It's not groundbreaking, but it's enjoyable, much like Dungeon Meshi.


Going on fantasy trash, I've got a million dollar question. Can someone explain to me why Re-Zero managed to crawl to success? I had the pleasure to watch it with people, and I was wheezing with laughter at the writing. It's like the unholy marriage of poor fanfiction, autism and edge brainrot, how the fuck did it manage to find an audience? Are people simply up for anything with maids?

 

[Red Dragon]

It's like the unholy marriage of poor fanfiction, autism and edge brainrot

You answered your own question right here, the 'standard' anime viewer loves this kind of bullshit - remember how Elfen Lied is celebrated as a great anime, when in truth it's just empty edgy fanservice.

Another one that fits the bill: Made in Abyss. This one is even worse, it focuses on torture and misery porn with kids. Unfortunately, the 'tranime is for deranged people' argument does have some foundation; certain groups watch anime just to live their own inner cruelty and sadism. The japs know that and cater to this audience.

 

[WelperHelper99]

The main reason Frieren was so enjoyable for many people (myself included) was specifically because it came out around a time when the only real fantasy anime available were Isekai or just straight-up garbage. It was a breath of fresh air, the characters were interesting, and the setting was fun.

I wouldn't go out of my way to say it's the best anime ever, but it's definitely better than Solo Leveling.

Frieren came out during the end of the Iseaki boom. For once you had a fucking story that wasn't just loser gets hit by Truck Kun and somehow figures out to rule the world. Nah nigga. Its actual fantasy. That and it was animated by Madhouse on a good day.

Btw Frieren pt 2 is out on Bluray.

 

[Honka Honka Burning Love]

Your friend is a moron. Frieren is good because the story it's trying to tell is decent. There aren't many anime that deal with Elvish semi-immortality all that well and go over the issues of what it's like to be a long-lived species around a species of people that live infinitely shorter lives than you. Dungeon Meshi touches on it in the Manga a bit, with Marcille being upset because she outlived her father, and she's eventually going to outlive her friends as well, and discusses how long-lived races view the shorter-lived races as essentially children. But it's not to the same extent as something like Frieren, where one moment you're celebrating the destruction of the Demon King and the next you're seeing that same party as old men.

You get to see Frieren's change from being this stoic elf who kind of ignores others for the pursuit of magic, to a woman who cares about the people she's been tasked with nurturing and guiding. Her relationship with Fern specifically is fantastic, and it's one of the reasons people argue that Fern and Stark are the main characters of Frieren after they're introduced.

The show is also great because it doesn't try to pull the postmodern bullshit that a lot of shows do nowadays, where they go "oh no, the thing we're fighting is definitely evil." It's one of the reasons people liked Goblin Slayer, even if Goblin Slayer is definitely mid.

Friren IS a solid 8 out of 10 anime. It's not one of the best of all time, nor is it flawless and for everyone, but within the fantasy genre, it's pretty impressive. It doesn't help that if you try to read Western fantasy, you're more likely to encounter Romantasy, which is trash. Then, if you're trying to read Japanese or Eastern Fantasy, you're either getting an Isekai story or a Solo Leveling/Gamer story.

Friren is also helped immensely by the fact that none of the stupid "Subversion" shit crops up.

From the moment the actual goal (Go back to the Demon King's castle because Frieren wants to see if Himmel's spirt will show up) they haven't done a bunch of bullshit with Himmel being a jerk in reality, or Stark and Fern being just friends.

The story is about Friren coming to understand her feelings because she is now watching what was going on in a third person perspective and that is what we are getting thus far.

 

[RSU 1741]

You answered your own question right here

I disagree: MiA ha some excellent parts in the adaptation (good vistas, decent animation, excellent soundtrack) brought low by the fact that it's written by a pornsick pedo freak. If given to another man entirely it would not even be hard to make MiA in a good series about exploring and friendship an' shit. Elfen Lied was lighting in the bottle for its era: entirely working on edge and being "brutal" for the masses that didn't watch earlier stuff. Kind of funny at times in a dark comedy way, I'll admit. They aren't as bad as Re-Zero.


Re-Zero is astoundingly bad. The edge is not going enough to save it nor to attract people, it can't be liked for that reason only, we don't have children or secretaries getting cut to pieces. We have entire episodes following a love story that seems to be written by George Lucas during the Prequels, harebrained plot developments, a world that doesn't make sense, an author hell-bent on making his own protagonist look like a laughable deranged incel loser and a neverending cavalcade of senseless, useless characters that exist for ??? reasons.

I am puzzled.

 

[Chocolate Rain]

You answered your own question right here, the 'standard' anime viewer loves this kind of bullshit - remember how Elfen Lied is celebrated as a great anime, when in truth it's just empty edgy fanservice.

Elfen Lied had a very divisive reception when it was first released and people were shitting on it for the exact same reasons its now become a punchline for edgy anime enjoyers.

 

[Red Dragon]

Re-Zero is astoundingly bad. The edge is not going enough to save it nor to attract people, it can't be liked for that reason only, we don't have children or secretaries getting cut to pieces. We have entire episodes following a love story that seems to be written by George Lucas during the Prequels, harebrained plot developments, a world that doesn't make sense, an author hell-bent on making his own protagonist look like a laughable deranged incel loser and a neverending cavalcade of senseless, useless characters that exist for ??? reasons.

Holy fuck I didn't know it was this bad. The only things I know about Re-Zero are the twin maids and Capella, I just assumed it was the edgy anime of the season.

 

[Chocolate Rain]

I disagree: MiA ha some excellent parts in the adaptation (good vistas, decent animation, excellent soundtrack) brought low by the fact that it's written by a pornsick pedo freak. If given to another man entirely it would not even be hard to make MiA in a good series about exploring and friendship an' shit. Elfen Lied was lighting in the bottle for its era: entirely working on edge and being "brutal" for the masses that didn't watch earlier stuff. Kind of funny at times in a dark comedy way, I'll admit. They aren't as bad as Re-Zero.

If Berserk can be heralded as a masterpiece of literature despite the deceased author being a known lolicon who even used the "um actually" defense for it including statistics about the number of sexual assaults involving minors in other countries versus Japan Im not sure why MiA isn't also given the same status since its not like the content between the two is any different.

 

[I Know 孤独のせい]

I never understood the hype around HxH, looks like a run-of-the-mill shonen with kids.

Sounds like you didn't read/watch it ? I do like it, but it is quite the rollercoaster. Jumping between run-of-the-mill and quite interesting. I think most people like it due to its power system and one or two particular arcs.

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

Considering Demon Slayer being a blockbuster, how far do you think Madoka Magica would fair in comparison?

Just finished watching Clevatess it was fun and 2nd season was apparently announced too so good.
And just finished re watching Chaika s1 (i didnt knew there was 2nd one) i guess i will continue watching and there is also an OVA i didnt watch.
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I really liked Chaika, great "heroes are the villains" plot without making the heroes too villainous, also actually had a good ending.

If given to another man entirely it would not even be hard to make MiA in a good series about exploring and friendship an' shit.

In practice it never happens, the freaks are good in making cool shit thay doesn't appear generic.

Re-Zero is astoundingly bad. The edge is not going enough to save it nor to attract people, it can't be liked for that reason only, we don't have children or secretaries getting cut to pieces. We have entire episodes following a love story that seems to be written by George Lucas during the Prequels, harebrained plot developments, a world that doesn't make sense, an author hell-bent on making his own protagonist look like a laughable deranged incel loser and a neverending cavalcade of senseless, useless characters that exist for ??? reasons.

When the author kills a love interest since she was too popular you know the series is doomed. Funny people complained how the first series abridged a lot of thing, but when it stuck to the LN the pacing got glacial.