[Dec 15 2019] Foreclosure Saga - http://civilinquiry.jud.ct.gov/CaseDetail/PublicCaseDetail.aspx?DocketNo=FBTCV196091825S

[tzgnilki]

The foreclosure was filed in December 2019. In his Chapter 7 filing, he only was able to reaffirm his WA condo; he surrendered the CT condo, so Midfirst should already have it. What's happening now is either Midfirst trying to grab the deficiency out of his Chapter 7 (presumably because they filed first) or just some residual court processes that won't amount to anything because of the Chapter 7. We'll probably get another 5 weeks of speculation before a nothing judgment - I'm looking forward to it.

need to remember midfirst were granted a relief from stay, they were approved to continue debt collection efforts

whatever happens, we have front row seats, massive salt is a bare minimum, he was already worried enough to contact someone about it who said he doesn't have to worry

I predict it'll be his bargain bin lawyer's fault if he ends up owing money, either from the HoA fees, or a deficiency judgement

 

[Surly Muppet]

Phil addressed the foreclosure during the prestream and insisted he 'surrendered the property' during the bankruptcy, and is therefore not obligated to pay (or be sued for) the deficit on the condo. Legal entities have told him the sky is not falling, and it's business as usual. Midfirst cannot pursue him for any deficit.

You can hear his rant at the end of this section of Dark Dave's stream - it was broken up today, I guess with internet issues.

He referred to it as 'the foreclosure saga' and bashed us as well. You can roll back a little to hear that. And you weren't granted bankruptcy because we 'made stuff up', Phil. You committed fraud.

He also again said he hadn't paid his federal taxes for two years. Nice, Phil. You realize you openly "fundraised" to pay for those several times? Anyone who just listens to you is a retard at this point.

 

[KillDeer]

Is he still paying the condo fees for CT? He stopped paying the mortgage in April 2019 but he was still paying the Condo fees up to and through at least February 2020

 

[ReentryPhantom]

Is he still paying the condo fees for CT? He stopped paying the mortgage in April 2019 but he was still paying the Condo fees up to and through at least February 2020

He has to still pay the HoA fees because he's responsible for the property.

 

[DarkSoulsPhil]

All my legal knowledge says Phil should be fucked for around 60k

But my legal knowledge said he should have been fucked with his bankruptcy so...

 

[Alt+F4]

Phil addressed the foreclosure during the prestream and insisted he 'surrendered the property' during the bankruptcy, and is therefore not obligated to pay (or be sued for) the deficit on the condo. Legal entities have told him the sky is not falling, and it's business as usual. Midfirst cannot pursue him for any deficit.

You can hear his rant at the end of this section of Dark Dave's stream - it was broken up today, I guess with internet issues.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=KB18UIhHrlg:3179He referred to it as 'the foreclosure saga' and bashed us as well. You can roll back a little to hear that. And you weren't granted bankruptcy because we 'made stuff up', Phil. You committed fraud.

He also again said he hadn't paid his federal taxes for two years. Nice, Phil. You realize you openly "fundraised" to pay for those several times? Anyone who just listens to you is a retard at this point.

need to remember midfirst were granted a relief from stay, they were approved to continue debt collection efforts

I am looking at this thinking why did Midfirst try and get that relief from stay. Does that just mean nothing? Like what was the point of getting that if they can't try and sue/get something from the pig.

Can we get a Minnesota layers perspective on this please.

 

[AnOminous]

He has to still pay the HoA fees because he's responsible for the property.

Any new fees that accrue are new debt and not discharged in bankruptcy.

I am looking at this thinking why did Midfirst try and get that relief from stay. Does that just mean nothing? Like what was the point of getting that if they can't try and sue/get something from the pig.

If they weren't planning on pursuing a deficiency judgment, it makes no sense to have filed in court in the first place. They could have just foreclosed nonjudicially and immediately obtained the property (or at least quicker than the glacial pace of these proceedings). The only difference in terms of remedy is they wouldn't have been able to pursue a deficiency judgment.

He has to still pay the HoA fees because he's responsible for the property.

Any new fees that accrue are new debt and not discharged in bankruptcy.

Midfirst ask for stay and wins by default since Phil did nothing

Amazingly, there's been a pending motion for default since May, and the court has done nothing. Utter bullshit. Maybe the judge is in a coof coma. Who knows?

 

[DukeMorty]

Ok, Dave said he "Surrendered the Property" and that is why he won't have to pay the deficit of the loan. Now I looked all over his Case Detail page and read all the documents and couldn't find it anywhere that said he surrendered the property. If anything the documents say he never appeared or responded to any of the summons he had. He even tried to have an "automatic stay" but Midfirst jumped on that and demanded that the stay be removed and since Dave didn't respond to that then the court ended the automatic stay and continue on the FORECLOSURE. That is another thing I found interesting, it kept mentioning that it was a FORECLOSURE, and nowhere it stated a Surrender. Now I don't know Bird Law but would a statement of "surrendering the property" show up in a FORECLOSURE process or is that separate?

So either Phil thinks not responding to summons means he "surrenders" his property and is getting FORECLOSURED and has to pay the deficit and court costs; he did surrender the property but the documents for that are somewhere else or won't show up until the end of the FORECLOSURE; or his Chapter 7 prevents him from getting FORECLOSURED even though the court removed the "automatic stay"?

 

[TankMelee]

Ok, Dave said he "Surrendered the Property" and that is why he won't have to pay the deficit of the loan. Now I looked all over his Case Detail page and read all the documents and couldn't find it anywhere that said he surrendered the property.

It's surrendered in the Chapter 7 filing. The foreclosure is the bank's effort. Remember, his plan as of early last year was to stop paying CT mortgage and give the bank the cold shoulder until they took it from him, apparently thinking he wouldn't be liable for the deficiency. It was only later that he found out he still had to pay for HOA fees and his mortgage black hole.

He even tried to have an "automatic stay" but Midfirst jumped on that and demanded that the stay be removed and since Dave didn't respond to that then the court ended the automatic stay and continue on the FORECLOSURE.

Well, it's automatic, so it happened as a feature of the bankruptcy. I was under the impression that the relief from stay was only for the bank to reclaim the property and not for the deficit, but the wording is vague to my untrained eyes. The reasoning they used for the relief from stay is that he had no equity in the property so the court couldn't sell it to repay his creditors, not that the entire lien was exempt from the bankruptcy proceedings.
If his bankruptcy was declined, then the foreclosure would have continued as normal and he'd pay for it (assuming he kept sticking his head in the sand), but because he was given Chapter 7 I doubt the bank can get the deficiency.

 

[AnOminous]

Well, it's automatic, so it happened as a feature of the bankruptcy.

It's automatic, but without actually notifying the court of it, they have no way of knowing that and will proceed as if it doesn't exist. Hence, DSP filed it in the foreclosure case, and Midfirst moved to lift the stay and proceed with the case. Considering how bullshit the court is being, and doing absolutely nothing for months with a pending motion for default, which should just be automatically granted, they might as well have not bothered. The dipshit court didn't do anything anyway.

 

[An Avenging Bird]

With the way the courts out in the Pacific Northwest are releasing people without bail who are arrested for felony riot and fighting with cops, is it any wonder they let this pig fuck skate on his responsibilities?

 

[DukeMorty]

Again I don't know Bird Law so this information I found could be wrong. So I found this from a lawyer site,

"The deeded owner of the property is responsible to pay HOA dues and assessments. Even if the debtor is surrendering home in chapter 7 bankruptcy, the owner is still personally liable for HOA dues and assessment that come due after the bankruptcy filing date. In addition, if the bankruptcy debtor moves out of the property, the deeded owner is responsible for any fines or assessments for violations such as overgrown grass, painting, etc. Since a bankruptcy does not remove the debtor’s name from the title, the debtor is responsible for HOA dues and property upkeep.
As a practical matter, once the debtor’s lender gets around to foreclosing, the lender will pay the HOA. However, that could be many months to many years down road. In the meantime, the HOA can pursue the owner for collection and if state law allows, sue the owner
The deeded owner of the property is liable to pay property tax. So, even though the debtor is surrendering home in chapter 7 bankruptcy, the debtor is still liable to pay property taxes for taxes that come due after the bankruptcy filing date. However, just as with HOA dues, the foreclosing lender will eventually pay the property tax. Until it does so, the county assessor will pursue the owner for payment of property taxes."

I guess Dave got Scott free from this condo, well besides crippling his credit for the next 10 years, high-interest rates, and difficulty getting a new home or car. Also the strain it might have put on his marriage. That being said I did read somewhere that a lender could still be sued after a Chapter 7 and property surrender but doesn't happen often. Honestly, at this point, I am going to wait until the foreclosure is done and see the results. Who knows maybe the court will allow Midfirst bank to get their deficit amount for some odd reason. And no DSP I am not upset that you won't pay the deficit just disappointed we didn't get a long begging segment of you crying about paying the deficit.

 

[Iron Hamster]

His only choice to select was 'surrender the property' Because "fuck you I'm not paying " wasn't an option.

 

[UncleTusky]

Not a lawyer/lolyer, sorry. I wish I had more to contribute to this thread other than sour grapes, but alas I cannot.

I'm not a lawyer but I did read state foreclosure law and thought of funny Lionel Hutz quotes for the occasion.

According to Connecticut law, the condo itself was/is part of the bankruptcy estate because the foreclosure was not finalized before the discharge (the term the state uses is "Law Day"). Where things get unhelpfully vague is whether the deficiency judgment is considered a new debt or part of the Ch7 discharge and none of myself, AnOminous, or the other internet legal eagles can figure that out for certain. This site makes it sound like a deficiency judgment entered before bankruptcy would be part of the estate but I can't find anything for the life of me that discusses a deficiency judgment after bankruptcy (ostensibly because Ch7 is meant to void all debts), all the examples were ones where the deficiency suit was already filed. I think MidFirst is trying to "create" the deficiency as a new debt independent of the bankruptcy but this is such a non-issue (either due to the odd combination of factors or because the idea it wouldn't be discharged in bankruptcy is too silly to seriously consider) that nobody has gone out of his or her way to discuss it.

The other issue is that even if Phil is liable for the deficiency the most likely outcome is that the bank would just file a lien on the WAKhando-filing a lien is cheap and easy and then they'd just wait to collect when Phil sells the place even if they're within their rights to force a sale. Since Phil claims to have no intention of ever leaving Renton (and I believe him here, he's too complacent to move) all it really means is that the equity he can tap for loans/lines of credit/a reverse mortgage will be reduced and MidFirst will have a claim against his estate when he dies. Considering he's already looking at a foreclosure judgment on top of his bankruptcy it's not like his credit can dip any lower; there's also a strange double standard where his responsibility for the lien never goes away but it will be scrubbed from his credit reports after about 7-10 years, the same timeframe as the foreclosure + bankruptcy. The realistic worst-case scenario would be that he might have to liquidate it sooner than expected to pay for an old age home or that it may be more difficult or impossible for Kat to inherit it if they're still married when he dies.

tl,dr: This is basically a nothingburger even if Phil's wrong and the Connecticut court orders a deficiency judgment.

 

[QwahlityKahntent]

Where things get unhelpfully vague is whether the deficiency judgment is considered a new debt or part of the Ch7 discharge and none of myself, AnOminous, or the other internet legal eagles can figure that out for certain

whatever works out best for phil is what will happen.

 

[AnOminous]

The realistic worst-case scenario would be that he might have to liquidate it sooner than expected to pay for an old age home or that it may be more difficult or impossible for Kat to inherit it if they're still married when he dies.

tl,dr: This is basically a nothingburger even if Phil's wrong and the Connecticut court orders a deficiency judgment.

They could actually continue to try to collect in any other way they have available just like any other judgment, by whatever methods are available in Washington. Or against his parents' estate if he inherits anything. And unlike before his bankruptcy, he has years before he can do that again. So if they sell it to some really scummy and aggressive collector, he might at least have a persistent nuisance for several years, or they might get lucky and pop one of his bank accounts when it has money in it.

 

[DarkSoulsPhil]

Can midfirst tell the court 'we dont want a lien, we want cash. And here is evidence of Phil never intending to sell the property so the lien is useless to recoup the debt owed'?

Because if I was a judge and this came across my desk, I'd tell Phil to cough up 50k and to go fuck himself. Something about being scummy and disrespect (outright contempt in this case) of the law really gets my goat.

 

[Freshtodeath]

I am just speculating but his tips are clear as day on his stream. Midfirst bank could track his income like Actually does and present it to a judge. "hey this guy is making bank he can pay us". I honestly don't know but if you were in a situation where you there is a small chance you have to pay a judgement maybe you should set aside some money. I would assume if DSP set aside an amount less than the 70k and was easy to work with they could settle. But that ship has probably sailed and DSP is allegedly broke.

 

[actually]

I am just speculating but his tips are clear as day on his stream. Midfirst bank could track his income like Actually does and present it to a judge. "hey this guy is making bank he can pay us". I honestly don't know but if you were in a situation where you there is a small chance you have to pay a judgement maybe you should set aside some money. I would assume if DSP set aside an amount less than the 70k and was easy to work with they could settle. But that ship has probably sailed and DSP is allegedly broke.

Shit, they could just use his bankruptcy documents that clearly show him making well over $100k in 2019, and if they realize the same "mistake" he made for 2018, they can see that he made at least that much in 2018 as well. Then, as you note here, if they were to step through any of his recent streams, they would see the hundreds of dollars he pulls a day.

 

[harbinger]

As a practical matter, once the debtor’s lender gets around to foreclosing, the lender will pay the HOA. However, that could be many months to many years down road.

This what I would do in MidFirst’s place. I’d sit on the property until the value bounces back in 20 to 30 years and let Philip pay the HOA fees during that time.