Law Trump admin imposes bumpstock ban unilaterally - Hawaii judge, where you at?

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WASHINGTON — The Trump administration on Tuesday issued a new rule banning bump stocks, the attachments that enable semiautomatic rifles to fire in sustained, rapid bursts and that a gunman used to massacre 58 people and wound hundreds of others at a Las Vegas concert in October 2017.

The new regulation, which had been expected, would ban the sale or possession of the devices under a new interpretation of existing law. Americans who own bump stocks would have 90 days to destroy their devices or to turn them in to the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives. The Justice Department said A.T.F. would post destruction instructions on its website.

Bump stocks work by harnessing a firearm’s recoil energy to slide it back and forth to bump against a squeezed trigger, so that it keeps firing without any need for the shooter to pull the trigger again. The Justice Department said that this function transforms semiautomatic weapons, like assault rifles styled on the AR-15, into fully automatic machine guns, which Congress sharply restricted in 1986 — allowing the ban.

“With limited exceptions, the Gun Control Act, as amended, makes it unlawful for any person to transfer or possess a machine-gun unless it was lawfully possessed prior to the effective date of the statute,” the new regulation states. “The bump-stock-type devices covered by this final rule were not in existence prior to the effective date of the statute, and therefore will be prohibited when this rule becomes effective.”

A senior Justice Department official, briefing reporters about the new rule on condition of anonymity, said that it was believed that tens of thousands of bump-stock devices are in circulation, but that more exact figures are unavailable. The official said the department expected that most owners of the devices would comply with the new regulation, and that A.T.F. would investigate and take legal action against those who violate it.

After publishing a proposed version of the rule earlier this year, the government received 119,264 comments in support of it and 66,182 expressing opposition to it, the Justice Department said.

The regulatory move may face a legal challenge. The Justice Department had initially decided that the executive branch lacked the authority to ban bump stocks on its own under existing gun-control laws, and that action in Congress — where it is politically difficult to enact new gun-control legislation — would be necessary to curb legal access to the devices.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/18/us/politics/trump-bump-stocks-ban.html

Bumpstocks are a somewhat popular firearms accessory that attaches to several popular guns in place of the normal stock and more or less uses the recoil of the firearm to allow you to fire quickly. They're impractical, silly, and mostly just for dumping a few magazines very quickly at milk jugs and soda bottles.

Supposedly, the vegas shooter had one in his possession when he COMP'd an entire country music festival. It has since come to light that while he may have, he also had more effective and already illegal machine gun conversions on hand anyway (a sort of ghetto lightning link sort of device, but I don't want to drift too far off topic). Bump stocks remained relatively obscure outside of a few calls for their banning.

Donald Trump, bizarrely, decided to make it a bit of a personal crusade to ban them, and has been at it for about a year or so now, generally agitating for it after the parkland shootings, which tragically missed david Hogg and also more bizarrely did not involve a bump stock which makes it even more of a head scratcher.

As of today, POTUS has finalized a rule, signed by his acting AG, that states bump stocks are now machine guns and anyone owning them has 90 days to turn them in or destroy them.

Mind, these are not $10 or $20 parts- they generally went for $200-400, and the expectation is that they be destroyed without compensation. And also, the determination that they are illegal comes after the Obama era ATF specifically determining that they were, in fact, legal, and that banning them would require legislative action and be beyond the purview of a regulatory agency.

As a result, multiple organizations have already filed for injunctions against the act, with more to follow. For an extra twist to an already bizarre legal game of twister, the NRA came out in favor of a bump stock ban after the vegas shooting.

Link to a press release from the Gun Owners of America, who largely pushed what became DC v Heller, aka the SCOTUS decision which enshrined the individualist second amendment (thanks, Scalia!).

(CORRECTION: that was the second amendment foundation, not GOA)

https://www.gunowners.org/goa-file-bump-stock-suit.htm

Direct link to the text of the ATF rule change banning bumpstocks within 90 days.

https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/5635249/Bump-Stock-Final-Rule.pdf

For those concerned, binary triggers and "gatling" type devices are made mention of and specifically exempted... until next week, when the government decides they are also machine guns after going on record stating to the contrary.

Additionally, nobody knows how many bumpstocks there are, as several companies made them. I have seen estimates from 200-450k. You can't go to a gunshow without seeing dozens of them.
 
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I'm starting to think the NRA is going to decide 80% receivers isn't the hill to die on either. If I have to turn in my pew-no pew lower I'm never giving them another cent.
The receiver bit would be a bit harder to get. Federal law doesn't prohibit you from building your own firearms as long you follow the NFA and are not intending to sell the piece you make. The bumpstock has the flimsy logic of being simulated full-auto. Ghost gunning would be harder to get passed.
 
You're allowed to sell one self-manufactured firearm per year without registering with the BATFE, iirc.
I believe you are correct. My point was that it's a bit different than something that is clearly a loophole around the heavy restriction on full-auto.
 
Between crap like this and the general failure to implement his border policies I'm souring on Orange Man again.

Oh well, at least he's still better than Hillary.
 
You're allowed to sell one self-manufactured firearm per year without registering with the BATFE, iirc.
not quite. you are prohibited from engaging in the business of firearms (or alcohol or explosives, et c) without a Federal Firearms License. self-made firearms that are marked as required (https://www.atf.gov/file/55476/download) can be sold infrequently, and not for the purpose of business, then firearms you manufacture and properly mark can be sold like any other firearm.

in my experience this is vague and flexible on purpose, but if you're not earning a living and doing so infrequently, then it gets a pass.

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/does-individual-need-license-make-firearm-personal-use
https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-i...text&node=27:3.0.1.2.3&idno=27#se27.3.478_192
 
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This flies in the face of the entirety of the Constitution. Since when could the, say, FBI "interpret" the law? This is a clear violation of the principle of seperation of powers.

Any agency tasked with enforcing a law by definition has to interpret it. What they can't do (and what Trump has done) is simply make up a law that doesn't exist. That's unconstitutional.
 
Between crap like this and the general failure to implement his border policies I'm souring on Orange Man again.

Oh well, at least he's still better than Hillary.

This is only one of two things he's done that I've unilaterally disagreed with him over, the other was pardoning Joe "Fuck you, courts, I'll jail anyone I want" Arpaio. That was a massive slap in the face to everyone who spent years building and prosecuting the case to get rid of him. Failure to get border policy, including the wall, is an issue of getting it through Congress, not him personally deciding to pussy-out.

You can walk the streets at night now without worrying about being randomly shot it's pretty great.

I shouldn't take troll bait, but, oh well, I can walk down my town's street right now without worrying about that, despite the fact every single house I pass has at least a deer rifle, possibly more, inside. We average one murder a year in this county, and for 3 straight years, it's been in the big, central, progressive, university-town urban area where you can't legally discharge guns and every landlord bans them. Food for thought.
 
I shouldn't take troll bait, but, oh well, I can walk down my town's street right now without worrying about that, despite the fact every single house I pass has at least a deer rifle, possibly more, inside. We average one murder a year in this county, and for 3 straight years, it's been in the big, central, progressive, university-town urban area where you can't legally discharge guns and every landlord bans them. Food for thought.

One murder too many.
 
Failure to get border policy, including the wall, is an issue of getting it through Congress, not him personally deciding to pussy-out.

Good luck with that. He needs the votes of a lot of Republicans who won't even be in Congress next year, and have already gone home, either because they lost because of him, or just didn't run because they were sick of him.

Those guys aren't coming back because they give about as much of a shit about his political situation as he cared about theirs.
 
I shouldn't take troll bait, but, oh well, I can walk down my town's street right now without worrying about that, despite the fact every single house I pass has at least a deer rifle, possibly more, inside. We average one murder a year in this county, and for 3 straight years, it's been in the big, central, progressive, university-town urban area where you can't legally discharge guns and every landlord bans them.
So essentially a federal gun ban wouldn't matter to you
 
Gun control is always bad and Im seriously dissapointed with this administration and the NRA. Good thing Im supporting GOA not the backstabbers of the NRA.
 
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