💬 Off-Topic Random Trans Thoughts, Musings, and Questions - For all your armchair psych and general sperging

[bouquetnine]

The biggest troon demand is "perceive me as I imagine myself and treat me as I want you to, not as I am."

I wish people would do that with me. But respect is earned, not given, so if I want to treated respectfully I have to take care of myself, limit my food intake, dress nice, etc. Troons think they are exempt from this and can bully people into fulfilling their wishes.

 

[General Zoider]

I swear the number of times i see trans ask why dont people take them seriously only for me to point to the examples is getting way to high.

 

[ephermeral]

Have any of you been able to come up with a good elevator pitch for why you are a TERF? Anytime I try to explain myself it’s always on borrowed time, which makes me anxious and it snowballs into me just, giving up? Not spergily necessarily, more exhaustion due to being assumed for the worst.

 

[General Zoider]

Have any of you been able to come up with a good elevator pitch for why you are a TERF? Anytime I try to explain myself it’s always on borrowed time, which makes me anxious and it snowballs into me just, giving up? Not spergily necessarily, more exhaustion due to being assumed for the worst.

for me I make use of my own experience of dealing with lots of women who were victims of Sexual Assault, so I just say something like "women, especially women who are victims of SA, need safe spaces and having any men invade those spaces is dangerous to both the women and the men. "

 

[Thiletonomics]

So I just ran into this thread and was wondering, do yall think troonism is finally on its way out? I think the whole identity politics angle of the democrats is going to be/has been taken out back and shot. Probably because outside of issues like immigration, I think troons and their actions(going after kids,sports,bathrooms etc) did more to sink the democrat platform than anything else. Forcing people to accept troons doesn’t work, because 99.9% of people on a subconscious level find them completely fucking revolting, at least the MTF variant.

There are still other countries that continue to double down on troonism, i.e. Canada. And there's still the chance of a Democrat re-take of the House, Senate, and Presidency, and they'll push the troonery shit on even harder.

 

[2SLGBQTIA+ 2 Furious]

Have any of you been able to come up with a good elevator pitch for why you are a TERF? Anytime I try to explain myself it’s always on borrowed time, which makes me anxious and it snowballs into me just, giving up? Not spergily necessarily, more exhaustion due to being assumed for the worst.

I'll put myself on the clock. 5 minutes starting now:

There are two sexes in humans, the fact that other species like some fish can change sex is proof that humans can't. There is no good scientific evidence that so-called gender affirming care improves mental health outcomes; no good research has been done on this but anecdotally they seem to kill themselves just as much after chopping their cocks off. Patients at the Tavistock were 10 times more likely than the general population to have a registered sex offender as a parent. Self-ID results in No True Scotsman absurdities like male rapists in women's prisons that are already happening at scale across the western world.

Time up. Those are the strongest arguments that come to mind and I didn't even get on to the impositions on free speech.

 

[Anasa Tristis]

Have any of you been able to come up with a good elevator pitch for why you are a TERF? Anytime I try to explain myself it’s always on borrowed time, which makes me anxious and it snowballs into me just, giving up? Not spergily necessarily, more exhaustion due to being assumed for the worst.

I have two:

1. If a single woman objects to a troon in her restroom, I'm behind the woman. 100%. No exceptions. No explanations needed.

2. Human society runs on a shared, objective reality. On trust. On certain absolutes, like sexed bodies. Male and female impersonators larping about undermine that shared reality, that shared trust. They create chaos and inflict real harm.

 

[The Poopsmith]

Time up. Those are the strongest arguments that come to mind and I didn't even get on to the impositions on free speech.

The free speech argument is my go-to because I beleive it has to go both ways. You want the freedom to put on makeup and a dress and prance around singing "I'm a pretty lady"? Fine by me, as long as it's also my right to tell you exactly what I think about such behaviour. This line of reasoning will open up a good-faith discussion with someone who's reasonable, or out the other person as a hypocritical authoritarian.

 

[Tragi-Chan]

Have any of you been able to come up with a good elevator pitch for why you are a TERF? Anytime I try to explain myself it’s always on borrowed time, which makes me anxious and it snowballs into me just, giving up? Not spergily necessarily, more exhaustion due to being assumed for the worst.

I do not believe that transitioning makes people happier or more successful, or that trans people behave like their “true” gender.

The trans community as a whole has a problem where violent, predatory, self-destructive and sexually inappropriate behaviour is tolerated, even celebrated.

I came to this conclusion from social media produced by and aimed at trans people. I advise you to look at this for yourself rather than media produced for general consumption.

 

[2SLGBQTIA+ 2 Furious]

The free speech argument is my go-to because I beleive it has to go both ways. You want the freedom to put on makeup and a dress and prance around singing "I'm a pretty lady"? Fine by me, as long as it's also my right to tell you exactly what I think about such behaviour. This line of reasoning will open up a good-faith discussion with someone who's reasonable, or out the other person as a hypocritical authoritarian.

It's such a simple thing but anyone on this website will know that "I'd like you to refer to me using the pronouns commonly associated with the sex I am not, but it's entirely your choice" is not something we generally hear from trans people.

The free speech argument is probably more obvious to Americans. As we've seen with the fallout from the Supreme Court ruling, there is confusion on this in the UK thanks to wishful thinking by troons and allies, disinformation by organisations like Stonewall and institutional capture among PMC and HR types.

You just need to know stuff. Know the law, know your rights. In the UK, the Supreme Court ruling means "sex" in the Equality Act refers to biological sex, with the obvious implication that single-sex spaces actually have to be single sex. Employers and public bodies are now pontificating about how the law is unworkable because, while they won't admit it, they have centered men and their falsehoods and disregarded women and the truth. Wannabe activists predictably whine about this but it's been six months since the ruling and there's no concentrated campaign for the law to be changed because all polls show there is no public appetite for changes which undermine single-sex spaces.

The Forstater judgement means gender critical beliefs and their manifestation are protected under the "religion or belief" characteristic of the Equality Act, so you can't be discriminated against for holding or voicing them.

I'd be most likely to use the free speech argument with a leftist critical of police crackdowns on Palestine protests. Would they like the police to stop arresting people for holding signs saying "I oppose genocide" while continuing to unlawfully arrest people for tweeting "men aren't women"?

 

[bouquetnine]

I'd be most likely to use the free speech argument with a leftist critical of police crackdowns on Palestine protests. Would they like the police to stop arresting people for holding signs saying "I oppose genocide" while continuing to unlawfully arrest people for tweeting "men aren't women"?

How quaint that you would expect ideological consistency from leftists.

 

[Twix Eatr]

Have any of you been able to come up with a good elevator pitch for why you are a TERF? Anytime I try to explain myself it’s always on borrowed time, which makes me anxious and it snowballs into me just, giving up? Not spergily necessarily, more exhaustion due to being assumed for the worst.

I'm not a feminist, much less a radical one. There's no such thing as trans, so they're not excluded from anywhere. I am pro-reality, which means I require evidence to shift my understanding of it. Early hominids understood male and female, so society pretending it's a meaningless construct is just retarded.

For a quick pitch, it depends on what your views are or what they're asking about. People have uncritically accepted "trans" as valid, making it nearly impossible to discuss without sounding crazy. Unfortunately, this means you'll always talk past them when you're coming from a place of knowing it's bullshit. When given a choice of either accepting that every institution we rely on is compromised or writing off a friend as crazy, uninformed, or "transphobic," most pick the latter. Being called anti-trans is the worst insult, btw, because there's no such thing as trans!

I'd just say that even if there were evidence for such a thing, which there isn't, it wouldn't come close to justifying everything we've had to give up. When pregnant mothers lack necessary support, society simply cosigns murdering her baby as an acceptable, moral decision. I find this awful, tbh. Troons saying they'll die if they don't get to masturbate in the ladies room or w/e should be a, "don't just talk about it, be about it" scenario comparatively.

Yet TPTB decided we'll reorient society, enforce curriculum in every public school, invest billions into promoting all of this nonsense, destroy women's rights, wreck child safeguarding, tone-police everyone to death, shift our entire fucking language, etc. If our friends can't see this is a concerted effort with a plan, not a grassroots "civil rights" movement, we just sound crazy pointing it out to them. Ignorance is bliss.

In my experience, most people don't care about anything. They're aggressively performative with an extremely light amount of information, but go to war like they're defending family honor. When it's something "moral", such as fighting for the underdog, they'll go even harder with no information. This is especially true for women. Given we're starting at an impossibility that they're defending for woke points, it's nearly impossible to "win" them over. Fuck are you going to say, men aren't women? These kinds of people know, but only pretend not to because they think that's what everyone else is doing.

At least that's my experience. It sucks.

If your friends aren't retards, just say, "validating an unfalsifiable mind state like 'gender identity' is incredibly unwise, unscientific, and unhealthy. By giving it the same legal weight as an immutable trait like biological sex, they've introduced a legislative loophole that destroys all sex-exclusive safeguarding for women and children. Predictably, men can now serve rape sentences in women's prisons by simply declaring themselves women. When zero evidence for 'trans-identities' exist, none of the 'treatment' provided actually helps, and we're consistently called hateful bigots for expressing discomfort, what exactly are we supporting?"

Or something like that. I don't know. Pick that or one of the other 8547544474747402075 evil things this movement represents. People probably don't want to realize that 'gender identity' was created solely to plant the seeds for normalizing adult/child sexual relationships.

I do not believe that transitioning makes people happier or more successful, or that trans people behave like their “true” gender.

You should familiarize yourself with the term "iatrogenic." That's what "trans" is.

 

[Stabby_Pencil]

I'm starting to wonder if 'gender dysphoria' is just medicalized internalized sexism. If you listen to them long enough you realized they are basing their identities off of flawed sexist stereotypes.

 

[Paper Machete]

I'm starting to wonder if 'gender dysphoria' is just medicalized internalized sexism. If you listen to them long enough you realized they are basing their identities off of flawed sexist stereotypes.

They seem to have a myopic view on either sex and are generally self-loathing (which is why it's easy for them to begin collecting humiliation/degrading kinks/fetishes like cheap Pokemon), add a splash of personality disorder, perhaps a dash of tism and it's off to the races.

 

[Twix Eatr]

I'm starting to wonder if 'gender dysphoria' is just medicalized internalized sexism. If you listen to them long enough you realized they are basing their identities off of flawed sexist stereotypes.

The DSM-5's criteria for "gender dysphoria" are purposely flimsy bullshit, like "your little girl played with a Tonka truck for a year." It’s the perfect weapon for psychotic mothers with Transhausen by proxy or Marxist groomers to indoctrinate your child. Read about Queer Theory or Critical Race Theory, and it all makes sense: they're trying to drive kids away from their parents to create perfect little foot soldiers.

The idea that a child just spontaneously says, "I'm not a girl. I'm a boy!" is retarded. Any parent who doesn't respond with, "No, honey. You're a girl, and girls can play with trucks," is also retarded. Instead, we're not only the ones introducing the confusion to begin with, but we're now affirming it as a legitimate identity.

So why the fuck is it even in the DSM? If the "treatment" is for us to embrace their "true, authentic self," it sounds like they're pathologizing society's "transphobia," not their mental disorder. We'd never treat an anorexic like that. It's setup to maximize diagnoses and once you begin "transitioning", especially with PBs, you're basically in for life. The system prevents any natural pushback, both socially and legislatively. It's all so fucked.

Many of these kids are just autistic or same-sex attracted, and when they're given an "out" for not fitting in or for their internalized homophobia, they take it. A little nudge from teachers or the media is all it takes: "Of course I don't fit in with boys, I'm actually a girl," or "I'm not a gay boy sinning, I'm a straight girl trapped in the wrong body."

This becomes pure insanity when doctors are forced to affirm the gender identity ahead of other mental health comorbidities, and the kid is kept riding high on cult-like love bombing: "You're so brave, Xander!" It's all based on rigid, dated stereotypes. Dozens of studies show that upwards of 90% of these gender-stressed teens grow out of it if you just let them go through puberty. That's the fix. The whole thing is manufactured on purpose.

 

[vanilla_pepsi_head]

If you are a business owner or manager, go out of your way to avoid hiring troons.

The vast majority of places already don't. Many employers made the mistake of hiring a tranny once, learned their lesson the hard way when it wound up being an entire shit show, and the whole experience left enough of an impression that they'll never do it again. You may get the occasional institution that keeps one around to signal to the public how diverse they are, but only if they consider that important enough to warrant paying a troon they know will fuck around, do nothing, cause drama, and be a useless liability in general.

I don't actually think I've ever met an obvious, fully-fledged tranny that wasn't either on welfare/disability, a junkie/homeless/hooker mostly relying on charity programs, or a NEET parasite supported by a spouse or parents. Can't find any good statistics but maybe you can check that one off your list. If you exclude cases where an employed person trooned out but hasn't got fired yet, I wouldn't be shocked to learn that the percentage of gainfully employed troons is already very close to zero.

SRS: Personally, I'm willing to sacrifice whatever good comes out of elective, purely cosmetic, non-reconstructive surgeries. That's a personal problem I'm willing to allow for the sake of the protection of everyone else. I don't care about people who don't like how they look. I agree it's hypocritical to care about "passing" at all and I don't see this as an argument, just a weird thing some people do.

Even cosmetic, non-reconstructive surgeries aren't a good analogy, because we still make fun of people who take it too far. Over-reliance on it can turn you into a horrifying monstrosity.

The difference is that cosmetic surgeries do not, by design, deliberately destroy systems or organs that were previously functioning perfectly fine. Sure, operations do get botched or something otherwise goes incredibly wrong on occasion, the risk is never zero, but most of the time it's because an unethical quack deliberately chose to operate on a patient they should know full well was a piss poor candidate. That doesn't warrant entirely banning cosmetic surgeries imo, because holy shit is that an even bigger problem for probably every other type of elective surgery. Cosmetic surgeries shouldn't be covered by insurance, but even then I am okay with limited exceptions. People born with legit deformities, especially face stuff (including cleft palate), burn victims, veterans who took a grenade to the face, whatever - if a good plastic surgeon can make them look less horrifying, by all means do it! I'll go to hell for this, but frankly I don't want to look at that shit, and I'll put my insurance premiums where my mouth is on that. I am not the only one, and I can't imagine life is a party for people like Juliana Wetmore either. It kind of has to be taken on a case-by-case basis, some bullshit will always slide through but putting ethical plastics on the same level as full-fledged troonery butchers is unfair.

Informed consent for medical procedures is necessary in medicine, but is not meant to be a full-on substitute for a doctor exercising honest and appropriate judgement about risks/benefits to decide if they will agree to perform a procedure. If you don't do that, you're just some ghoul playing Chinese checkers with delusional peoples' organs because you like money. Part of that with cosmetic surgery especially is at least attempting to gauge how realistic the patient's expectations are, and be mindful not to oversell and underdeliver. Troonery surgeons are... really not doing that. All surgeons deal every day with uninformed people who have entirely delusional expectations of surgery in general. To them, surgeons are basically wizards: from their perspective, a surgery is just being unconscious for a bit then waking up a little sore with some sutures, an opiate Rx, and an annoying medical issue or deformity magically fixed. People seeing it like that is a testament to the fact surgeons usually do their jobs well! Since it's that easy, it follows that people without the relevant experience are probably dogshit at appreciating risk or tempering their expectations, but you're the surgeon, it's your job to fucking know better! No matter how out of control your God complex might be, you can't seriously believe anything you can do to a man's skull without killing him will make some Leno-looking fucker look like a kawaii anime girl. "Gender" surgeons are fucking up ethically in just about every way you can at a level far beyond the scummiest of non-tranny cosmetic surgeons. It's not even close.

I still can't even believe this shit is a problem in scale. What a timeline

 

[Hinttitroniikka]

People born with legit deformities, especially face stuff (including cleft palate), burn victims, veterans who took a grenade to the face, whatever

What is the term by which you'd have understood that's exactly what I was talking about in the bit you quoted from me? When I said elective and non-reconstructive, and I'm not trying to be an asshole and say you have no reading comprehension, but I'm really asking what would have been the right way to phrase my stance so that you understand that I don't care about ugly people born ugly with just the problem of being ugly, but I do care about people whose long-term health is at risk, and people who were in terrible accidents or attacks and don't want to see that moment over again every time they look at themselves? I'm sure some of that is technically classified as elective in particular legal terminology in whatever place, but in the parlance of a casual forum, how can I say that I am ok with fixing cleft lips, but I don't care about whether or not someone is attractive, without using a hundred words?

 

[Alcohol is my fren]

I wish people would do that with me. But respect is earned, not given, so if I want to treated respectfully I have to take care of myself, limit my food intake, dress nice, etc. Troons think they are exempt from this and can bully people into fulfilling their wishes.

They treat being troon as a cheat code. These four categories are 95% of troons today:

1. The pooners think becoming “men” will make life easier because “muh patriarchy”, “women are put down “, (In this one, it’s normally BS but it seems like a small but relatively noticeable amount ov women have a trauma response to being assaulted and then maladjustedly deal with it by pooning out.. I won’t shit on them. It’s a real trauma response.. but it’s a minority of the people I’m mentioning in this section.)

“I lovvvvee yaoi and Heartstopper. Imma cut my hair short and crush my breasts and be an UwU boi.”

the groomed young faggots think it’s going to make liking men easier cause now they’re “straight”

The AGP freaks just want their fetish acknowledged. It’s probably the only thing that gives them dopamine besides drugs.

 

[Miriam Margoyles]

I think I just had a bit of a fucking revelation, and I'd like you guys' take on it.

You know the whole 'trans puppygirl' thing that you see, increasingly, in tranny circles on social media?

I genuinely think they just want to fuck dogs, and that that's a more acceptable way of openly expressing it.

No, seriously, hear me out.
Those men are AGPs. AGPs are straight. They identify as women because they are unattractive and undesirable heterosexual men who want sexual attention. And because women are what they want to fuck, in their autistic, lack of theory of mind having brains, that means that if they become a woman, everybody will want to fuck them, too.

Now, apply the trans puppygirl framework over this line of thinking.

Then consider the fact that furries swear up and down that their disgusting degenerate fetish totes mcgotes doesn't mean they're attracted to animals, guys, for cereal, even as furries are regularly exposed as having had sex with animals.

Then consider that most of these puppygirl trannoids either are or are the sort of nerds who would have been furries, ten to fifteen years ago.

They want to fuck dogs.

 

[Twix Eatr]

I have no idea wtf a "trans puppygirl" is, but yeah, it wouldn't surprise me. It's a predictable outcome of queer theory. They just like fucking children. Queer theorists believe infants are inherently sexual beings and not allowing them too experience pleasure is evil and oppressive and needs to be stopped. It also includes bestiality, too.