The Holocaust Thread - The Great Debate Between Affirmers, Revisionists and Deniers

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So, the Holobunga has been heckin' fact checked by all the wholesome sources like Hollywood, which of course never lies nor has any conflict of interest. That's why this thread is full of single-issue shills too.
Or I dunno, how about the own writings of the people who did it. It's so obvious all you can do is claim is what faked by the Allies for some reason or make up theories about the magic number 6 million. Like you do know that if the official number of dead Jews was only 600,000, Jews would still get their own country and gorillions in reparations, right? And it's not like they needed to make up evidence to start hanging people who burned their way across Eastern Europe.
First of all, Stalin was Georgian, Lenin a Churka-Jewish mutt and Trotsky an uberkike. Nothing Russian about the Soviet Union. But nice try, Chaim.
Since the Kulaks and others were mostly illiterate peasants and with Soviet killlers patriotic heroes like Yagoda doing their best to eradicate all traces it's no surprise that there aren't many sources. It's very likely that no one would have known about Katyn, a whole division executed, if the Wehrmacht hadn't discovered it. History is written by the winners.
Don't see how ethnicity matters since Russia had been dominated by non-Russians for over a century given the royal family were Germans and so were like half their generals. High ranking Bolsheviks like Voroshilov, Zhdanov, Molotov, Kalinin, Rykov, etc. were Russians as was Soviet Ukraine's leader Petrovsky.

If it actually happened the way people claim it did, eradicated sources would not be a problem. But instead all that happened was the Soviet economy made the miscalculations inherent of communism due to naturally bad agricultural conditions and by the time they intervened there had been maybe a million people dead in the agricultural regions. This somehow gets spun into hilarious tales about the attempted mass murder of muh Ukrainerinos (this was made up by the CIA and their Nazi collaborator buddies and ignores Russian, German, or indeed Jewish deaths) or how da j00z tried to kill the poor gentiles.
I mean they are all over blown, the Holodomor probably has the most deaths at a few hundred thousands due to miss management and vengeful kikes
Points for honesty.
 
From the article

View attachment 4169469
Actually the guy who wrote that article just didn't read Korherr closely enough

When talking about the numbers of Jews in the USSR, Korherr says "The newly acquired Eastern Territories (except for Danzig) are not included in the statistics. These figures cannot be calculated."

and: "Moreover, it was not possible to count all of the deaths of the Soviet Russian Jews in the occupied Eastern Territories while those in the remaining European part of Russia and on the front have not been included at all."

But this talk of numbers and resettlement I don't find convincing, because even if 3 million Jews weren't "resettled" by Nazis, but 1 million, or even 100,000, there would still be some evidence of their resettlement, just like there is a lot of evidence for resettlement of Jews in Romanian occupied USSR, as Rapechu discovered long ago

PS: We've talked about Katyn and war crime denial laws in this thread so this might be relevant https://polishnews.co.uk/the-czech-...-stand-trial-for-denying-the-crimes-in-katyn/
If the number of statistics keep changing from 6 million to 1 million to 200 thousands. It just truly shows how weak their narrative is and is on the brink of collapse. Also, the 6 million figure was a thing long before national socialism.
 
If the number of statistics keep changing from 6 million to 1 million to 200 thousands. It just truly shows how weak their narrative is and is on the brink of collapse. Also, the 6 million figure was a thing long before national socialism.
If we're only including western historians (who employ correct methodology and are under no coercion from the state) the figure has increased to 5.7 million from the earliest estimates, mostly due to new information about SS police killings. The first historians to cover the subject --Reitlinger and Hilberg-- estimated 5 million or less
 
I would respond here. But am having trouble getting my posts up. Hope to rejoin the conversation soon.
 
don't forget the time I ran cover for Google for changing their dictionary to protect the holocaust myth


In 1943, given widespread reports of mass shootings in the east and numerous extermination centers in Poland, you think it's surprising that a histrionic Jew might think the Nazis had killed virtually all the Jews under their control? (which was indeed around 6 million)


I think we talked about Ignatiev earlier, a conversation you sadly bailed on, but it is telling that even in that vid which seems edited to make him look bad, he calls whiteness a "social category". He's talking about eradicating an idea that he sees (perhaps wrongly) as oppressive, not a group of people.

That soldiers of the Red Army raped women and killed civilians is definitely bad, but why do you think Germany invaded Poland and the USSR? This wasn't even a "reprisal against a whole race", but the geopolitical equivalent of robbery + murder. Plans were made to deport half the population, and use the rest for labor, with predictions of 20-30 million civilians dead. Women were raped as well, or forced into field brothels at the disposal of the Wehrmacht.

This is the other side of the story.


Going back, I've posted a lot about numbers in this thread. What's a single "Soviet source" I've used? Do you think the Hoefle telegram, the most definitive document of this kind, is a "Soviet source"?

Most of this stuff was answered by me already.

Invading poland wasn't robbery and murder. It was ethnic conflict. Poland had invaded all around before, so had the ussr, so had Germany. Poles were no Angels, in fact they were as chauvinistic as anyone. Hitler's aim was to rationalise the area as ive told you repeatedly yet you've refused to respond to.



Wrong. He thinks it's a fake identity and one that exists to confer advantages to people who look a certain way. He contrasts this to Irish and Italian culture

View attachment 4117059

But anyway, his views are not remotely genocidal as @Lemmingwise was suggesting, and he's a piss poor example of Jewish racism against white people. Ignatiev calls out Jewish racism just as hard and also doesn't believe that it is a valid identity

View attachment 4117074

View attachment 4117077

Exactly. He seeks to eradicate identity, he denies the existence of race. He splits whites into its parts in order to undermine it. As in, a soup is not a soup, it is water, lentils, carrots and peas. He obviously would do the same thing with black identity. The only question is, what identity, what reality would he not undermine? At that point, where he stopped. Shouldn't that identity which he holds on to, be it class, familial lineage, local provenance not also be undermined and deconstructed as fake?



Yeah I've read 'Truth for Germany'. I debated this topic with the very knowledgeable Otium on Codoh and this book kept coming up. Walendy thinks the evidence concerning German plans is fabricated and flat out ignores a lot of it.


Well we can see that German minority in Poland was fairly small, and primarily around the Danzig area (almost none in the corridor!)

View attachment 4117149

And we can also see that Germany also had a significant Polish minority. This is of the German empire territory but there were areas with lots of Poles that remained in Germany post 1918, such as Opole in the south east.

View attachment 4117155

If Hitler had really been a fair guy, all about "rationalizing ethnic makeup" of an area, he would have offered to give back parts of the Opole region that were 70% + Polish to Poland in exchange for Danzig. But instead Nazis conducted expulsions in this area starting in 1938.

Walendy probably has good reason to ignore some evidence. As in, he doesn't see it as evidence.

The German minority in Poland was not small to the germans so this point is silly.

Yes, Germany had allowed Poles to settle and live and yet they demanded to give away an important area that Germany had deep connections to. There is no reason that being fair, Hitler would give away his own very materially valuable territory.

From the article

View attachment 4169469
Actually the guy who wrote that article just didn't read Korherr closely enough

When talking about the numbers of Jews in the USSR, Korherr says "The newly acquired Eastern Territories (except for Danzig) are not included in the statistics. These figures cannot be calculated."

and: "Moreover, it was not possible to count all of the deaths of the Soviet Russian Jews in the occupied Eastern Territories while those in the remaining European part of Russia and on the front have not been included at all."

But this talk of numbers and resettlement I don't find convincing, because even if 3 million Jews weren't "resettled" by Nazis, but 1 million, or even 100,000, there would still be some evidence of their resettlement, just like there is a lot of evidence for resettlement of Jews in Romanian occupied USSR, as Rapechu discovered long ago

PS: We've talked about Katyn and war crime denial laws in this thread so this might be relevant https://polishnews.co.uk/the-czech-...-stand-trial-for-denying-the-crimes-in-katyn/

It's silly of you to try and ascribe a holocaust in the east on the basis of not much resettlement remains when firstly the fronts flowed back and forth as did people and in any case there isn't any evidence of mass murder at the AR camps either.

The deaths of millions of Jews in Europe 1933-1945 is far better documented than most supposed genocides. Denying that millions of Jews (and others) died in that period offers a bad explanation of the facts on the ground.

All of these deniers would find more fruitful ground turning their methodology to supposed genocides with far worse documentation with even less evidence like the so-called "Holodomor" under Stalin. There's a far more legitimate case for the actual death toll being far lower. Incidentally, there are many countries where it is illegal to deny the so-called Holodomor and in much of Western academia it is forbidden to question it due to the network of pro-NATO, anti-Russian professors, including CIA-recruited Ukrainians. IMO Pol Pot's so-called "Killing Fields" also make a good case for revisionism.

It's only documented in your mind because you've been told that this is so. In fact it's not documented. The only trial of the holocaust ever conducted where its eventuality was contested exposed this.

But yes, the holodomor is equally poorly evidenced and probably didn't happen either. Same with the Armenian event. Indeed Pol pots crimes are likely also not what they appear to be.

Think about it, lying about genocide is literally cost free and invites the possibility of great reward. Humans have every incentive to create fantastic lies.

Or I dunno, how about the own writings of the people who did it. It's so obvious all you can do is claim is what faked by the Allies for some reason or make up theories about the magic number 6 million. Like you do know that if the official number of dead Jews was only 600,000, Jews would still get their own country and gorillions in reparations, right? And it's not like they needed to make up evidence to start hanging people who burned their way across Eastern Europe.

Don't see how ethnicity matters since Russia had been dominated by non-Russians for over a century given the royal family were Germans and so were like half their generals. High ranking Bolsheviks like Voroshilov, Zhdanov, Molotov, Kalinin, Rykov, etc. were Russians as was Soviet Ukraine's leader Petrovsky.

If it actually happened the way people claim it did, eradicated sources would not be a problem. But instead all that happened was the Soviet economy made the miscalculations inherent of communism due to naturally bad agricultural conditions and by the time they intervened there had been maybe a million people dead in the agricultural regions. This somehow gets spun into hilarious tales about the attempted mass murder of muh Ukrainerinos (this was made up by the CIA and their Nazi collaborator buddies and ignores Russian, German, or indeed Jewish deaths) or how da j00z tried to kill the poor gentiles.

Points for honesty.


What do you mean the nazis deserved to be hanged just for "burning their way across Europe" ??

Did you mean the soviet scorched earth policy? Or the allies carpet bombing French towns? Maybe you got your terminology mixed up. Anyway at this point I view you as possibly equally as stupid as Stan on this thread. Im hoping you can clarify your position and raise my expectation of you and maybe even enlighten me with your knowledge of these events.
 
If the number of statistics keep changing from 6 million to 1 million to 200 thousands. It just truly shows how weak their narrative is and is on the brink of collapse. Also, the 6 million figure was a thing long before national socialism.
Because there actually were 6 million starving Jews in Eastern Europe in 1918, since that was approximately the Jewish population of that region (based on data gathered in the early-mid 1890s, the Russian Empire recorded 5,215,805 Jews in their 1897 census), and many of them were indeed at risk of being murdered because there was. And obviously Jewish newspapers were going to be rather concerned about their starving co-religionists to print that magic number 6 million.
What do you mean the nazis deserved to be hanged just for "burning their way across Europe" ??

Did you mean the soviet scorched earth policy? Or the allies carpet bombing French towns? Maybe you got your terminology mixed up. Anyway at this point I view you as possibly equally as stupid as Stan on this thread. Im hoping you can clarify your position and raise my expectation of you and maybe even enlighten me with your knowledge of these events.
The only "evidence" you have to support your position is saying all the actual evidence is fake/invalid. It's equivalent to creationists and flat-earthers, and just like creationists and flat-earthers have hilariously elaborate cosmologies to make their beliefs valid, you appear to have the wild belief that millions of Jews were resettled across Europe (and then...?) despite not a shred of evidence existing for it.

But tell me, what AKSHUALLY happened. I'm a big fan of kooky beliefs so tell me how the Nazis dindu nuffin.
 
@mrolonzo
Exactly. He seeks to eradicate identity, he denies the existence of race. He splits whites into its parts in order to undermine it. As in, a soup is not a soup, it is water, lentils, carrots and peas. He obviously would do the same thing with black identity. The only question is, what identity, what reality would he not undermine? At that point, where he stopped. Shouldn't that identity which he holds on to, be it class, familial lineage, local provenance not also be undermined and deconstructed as fake?
And he says the exact same thing about Jews, so is he trying to undermine Jews as well?

Hitler's aim was to rationalise the area as ive told you repeatedly yet you've refused to respond to.
His aim is stated clearly in numerous pre-invasion documents (read Walendy to find out), and affirmed by actual policy like the mass deportation of Poles from traditionally Polish territory, as well as numerous plans by the RSHA to ethnically cleanse the entire region, so I'm gonna go with that over your fan fiction, sorry lol
 
@mrolonzo

And he says the exact same thing about Jews, so is he trying to undermine Jews as well?


His aim is stated clearly in numerous pre-invasion documents (read Walendy to find out), and affirmed by actual policy like the mass deportation of Poles from traditionally Polish territory, as well as numerous plans by the RSHA to ethnically cleanse the entire region, so I'm gonna go with that over your fan fiction, sorry lol

Jews? Yes of course. Leftists of all kinds have tried this almost since their inception. In this discourse everything, every category, is essentially fake. Except ones that they like of course, such as how much money one has at one time or another.

Which again buttresses my point. He is rationalizing the area. Maybe not in ways polish people or Ukrainians etc would like but nevertheless that's the aim. As such the various peoples will end up together without the endless problems of having minorities in your own territory. Ive told you this a number of times now. Yet still you refuse to respond to this. I can only assume you implicitly accept this.

Because there actually were 6 million starving Jews in Eastern Europe in 1918, since that was approximately the Jewish population of that region (based on data gathered in the early-mid 1890s, the Russian Empire recorded 5,215,805 Jews in their 1897 census), and many of them were indeed at risk of being murdered because there was. And obviously Jewish newspapers were going to be rather concerned about their starving co-religionists to print that magic number 6 million.

The only "evidence" you have to support your position is saying all the actual evidence is fake/invalid. It's equivalent to creationists and flat-earthers, and just like creationists and flat-earthers have hilariously elaborate cosmologies to make their beliefs valid, you appear to have the wild belief that millions of Jews were resettled across Europe (and then...?) despite not a shred of evidence existing for it.

But tell me, what AKSHUALLY happened. I'm a big fan of kooky beliefs so tell me how the Nazis dindu nuffin.

Reports of Jewish suffering in Russia are likely greatly exaggerated. But tell us, how far back does this six million number go?


Obviously, our position is the more reasonable and realistic by a vast margin, especially given the evidence we have.

What actually happened is that no one was ever gassed and shootings by nazis were mostly for legitimate reasons as this thread details. Chugger and co tried all kinds of tricks to get kiwis to believe in the holocaust but it was exposed as rubbish by referencing authors who are reverting to primary sources - this is the fundament of actual historiography and something neither you or your fellow travelers can compete with.

You will dodge and prevaricate, you will insult: this is all entirely expected. You have no other choice.
 
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We can see here what mrolonzo means exactly by "rationalizing".

RSHA produced 6 versions of its colonization plans. The last 3 revisions call for deportation of 85%, 90%, and 95% of all Poles. Before the war against the USSR opened up more prospects for mass deportation, Himmler penned this document (and showed it to HItler, who heartily approved)

Treatment of Alien Races in the East (1940)

In it he says,
"What I want to say is that we are not only most interested in not unifying the population of the East, but, on the contrary, in splitting them up into as many parts and fragments as possible.

But even within the ethnic groups themselves we have one interest in leading these to unity and greatness, or perhaps arouse in them gradually a national consciousness and national culture, but we want to dissolve them into innumerable small fragments and particles."

And later that eventually the ethnic concept of Poles and Ukrainians should "disappear" altogether.

Ignatiev anyone? Actually even in mrolonzo's entirely speculative universe Ignatiev doesn't go this far.
 
We can see here what mrolonzo means exactly by "rationalizing".

RSHA produced 6 versions of its colonization plans. The last 3 revisions call for deportation of 85%, 90%, and 95% of all Poles. Before the war against the USSR opened up more prospects for mass deportation, Himmler penned this document (and showed it to HItler, who heartily approved)

Treatment of Alien Races in the East (1940)

In it he says,
"What I want to say is that we are not only most interested in not unifying the population of the East, but, on the contrary, in splitting them up into as many parts and fragments as possible.

But even within the ethnic groups themselves we have one interest in leading these to unity and greatness, or perhaps arouse in them gradually a national consciousness and national culture, but we want to dissolve them into innumerable small fragments and particles."

And later that eventually the ethnic concept of Poles and Ukrainians should "disappear" altogether.

Ignatiev anyone? Actually even in mrolonzo's entirely speculative universe Ignatiev doesn't go this far.
You shouldn't be mad at us for questioning your perception of the world. You should be mad at those who waged psychological warfare on you and that you bought into this bullshit for so long.
 
You shouldn't be mad at us for questioning your perception of the world. You should be mad at those who waged psychological warfare on you and that you bought into this bullshit for so long.
Where do you get the impression that I'm mad? Maybe amused, to see white nationalists shilling so hard for the most anti-white regime in history (if you consider Eastern Europeans white, which I think you do)
 
Reports of Jewish suffering in Russia are likely greatly exaggerated. But tell us, how far back does this six million number go?
Every single report of "6 million suffering European Jews" before 1945 can be understood in the context of Jewish poverty in the Russian Empire, because the shtetl was a very poor place prone to famine (much like the majority of Russia) and they are using the 1897 Russian census as their reference point for estimating there being 6 million Jews. State-sponsored antisemitism in the Russian Empire (and to be fair, Russian policy was more against Jews as a religion than Jews as an ethnic group) is of course the other reason why there's so many reports of 6 million suffering Jews.
Obviously, our position is the more reasonable and realistic by a vast margin, especially given the evidence we have.

What actually happened is that no one was ever gassed and shootings by nazis were mostly for legitimate reasons as this thread details. Chugger and co tried all kinds of tricks to get kiwis to believe in the holocaust but it was exposed as rubbish by referencing authors who are reverting to primary sources - this is the fundament of actual historiography and something neither you or your fellow travelers can compete with.
You deny every piece of evidence, including primary sources) that doesn't fit your preconceptions. You have as much in common with actual historiography as flat earthers have with science.
You will dodge and prevaricate, you will insult: this is all entirely expected. You have no other choice.
Nice projection. I'm just curious why anyone actually believes this bizarre fantasy world where the Nazis dindu nuffin and millions of Jews were "resettled" without a single trace of their existence and somehow all survived despite their relatives maintaining to this day they are dead. Where are these phantom Jews
 
There's definitely something wrong with this article. So many redundancies!

Treblinka II - Topography of the camp​

The design and construction of the Treblinka extermination camp was carried out by a special SS construction team from the SS and Police Central Construction Board in Lublin led by SS-Obersturmführer Richard Thomalla. The construction work was carried out by two German companies from Legnica and Warsaw. The barbed wire fenced 17 hectares located about 500 m from the main railway road and the Małkinia – Kosów Lacki road. A telephone line was established and a convenient paved road leading from the road through the forest to the camp was built. In June 1942, a small side track was built from the already existing section of the railway line leading to the gravel pit. Materials for the construction of the camp were brought from Warsaw, Sokołów Podlaski and Kosów Lacki. The surrounding Jewish communities were forced to supply construction and installation materials. Jewish prisoners brought from the surrounding towns and prisoners of the penal labour camp were used for this purpose. Officially, the camp was called SS-Sonderkommando Treblinka, commonly referred to as Treblinka II. On 11 July 1942, construction work was completed, and SS-Untersturmführer Irmfried Eberl, a physician, became the camp commandant.
The whole camp was surrounded by a 2.5 m high double barbed wire fence, interwoven mainly with pine branches, so that you could not see what was going on behind it. In the upper part of the fence wire, juniper branches were stuffed into to raise them and mask them additionally. There were anti-tank obstacles and barbed wire coils about 40 m before the fence.

The main gate was on the north side and opened to a road named by the Germans Kurt Seidel Straße – after the oldest member of the German staff of the camp who supervised its construction. The main roads were paved, the others were lined with gravel. Behind the gate, on the right side, there was a guardhouse, and in front of it – the commandant’s office. From Kurt Seidel Straße there was a street to the east, leading to barracks for Ukrainian guards. The first large building on the east side was a dining room with a kitchen and pantry. The next two buildings, located parallel to each other, were residential barracks for guards, the so-called “wachman” (watchmen). Then there were two barracks, also located parallel to each other: the first one was a residential barrack, the second one contained rooms for a physician and a hairdresser. The barracks were named after Max Biala (Bielas). On 11 September 1942, SS-Untersturmführer Max Biala was stabbed by a Warsaw Jew Meir Berliner during the selection process on the roll call square. Berliner, and two prisoners standing next to him, was immediately killed with a spade by the guards. These barracks were inhabited by camp guards, i.e. 80-120 people.

Another object in the area of the barracks was the ZOO. There were forest animals, such as roe deer, foxes, pigeons and two peacocks. Next to the ZOO, there was a valuables sorting square. The Goldjuden unit comprising about 10-12 people registered and packed valuables, mainly money, gold, diamonds and jewellery. Their leader was SS-Unterscharführer Franz Suchomel. The Goldjuden were specialists in their sector and privileged prisoners in the camp.

Next to the commandant’s office, there was a building for the Germans, which housed a shelter, an isolation room, dentist’s and hairdresser’s offices. Behind, there was a barrack for Polish and Ukrainian women who served as cleaners and servants. Three Polish women cooked meals for the Germans.

In the prisoner part of the camp, there were barracks for prisoners called ghetto, camp 1 or lower camp. The Germans called it Wohnlager – a residential compound inhabited by 700-800 prisoners. The barracks were arranged in a horseshoe shape. All the buildings mentioned above, as well as the fuel station, the garage in which cars were kept, including the armoured car, and the coal storehouse, formed the so-called administrative and residential compound.

Another part of the camp consisted of the so-called reception area described by the Germans as Auffanglager – a transit camp. It consisted of a ramp, an undressing area for women and children where there was also a hairdresser, and the so-called cashier’s booths, i.e. a place where valuables were stored. On the opposite side there was a men’s undressing area. The undressing area was additionally fenced with barbed wire. From here, there was an arched road leading into the gas chambers called der Schlauch by the Germans, and by prisoners Himmelfahrtsstraße – the road of ascension or Himmelweg – the road to heaven. Fenced on both sides with barbed wire, it turned almost at right angles so that the influx of people into the gas chambers could be interrupted at the turn.

At the ramp, there was a large barrack where the belongings of victims were sorted. This warehouse looked similarly to a railway station from the side of the ramp and tracks. There was a large sign “Ober Majdan”. The barrack had a fake ticket window and a fake clock painted on top. The hands pointed in the direction of the alleged change of trains to Białystok and Vawkavysk and in the direction of the bath house.
An important object was the so-called “lazarett”. It was not used for treatment, but on the contrary – for killing. Above the building there was a white flag with a red cross. Behind it there was a pit in which documents, photographs, diplomas and religious objects were burned. The sick, elderly, disabled, unaccompanied children and those who could delay the pace of “work” were led to the edge of this burning pit to be quickly killed. The people brought here were seated on a bench and killed with a shot to the back of their heads. Next to the lazaret there was a pit in which the bodies of those who died during transport were buried.

The basic task was fulfilled by Totenlager – the extermination camp, referred to by the prisoners as camp 2 or upper camp. The name “upper” was derived from the terrain. It was located on a small hill, in contrast to camp 1 (lower camp) located at the bottom. The most important buildings here were the gas chambers. At the beginning of the functioning of the camp, three buildings were built, later referred to as old buildings. There is no precise information about them. Most probably they looked like in Bełżec. The barrack – 4 m wide, 8 m long and 2 m high – was built of double walls made of planks. The space between them was filled with sand to make the building airtight. The internal walls of the barrack were covered with tar paper, and the floors and walls up to a height of 1 m – with galvanised sheet metal. All doors were made of thick boards and protected from the outside with heavy wooden bars placed in iron clamps. The door, sealed with rubber, opened outwards. Next to the gas chambers there was a room with an engine, most probably dismantled from a Russian tank, and a generator that supplied the camp with electricity. The outlet of the engine’s exhaust pipe was connected to the underground pipe and opened into all three chambers. The pipes ran along the chambers, just below the ground, and their branches were directed upwards and went out at a height of 1 m from the floor to a hole in the inner wall of the chamber. These chambers were surrounded by a high fence. Death was caused by carbon monoxide poisoning, which caused paralysis of the central airways. The corpses were pulled out through manholes opened from the outside onto the ramp. They were loaded on wagons, which drove on special narrow tracks. After turning the wagon, the bodies were thrown down and the wagon was pulled for the next bodies. However, the chambers turned out to be draughty, and it took too much time for the bodies to be taken away with the wagons. As part of the reorganisation of the camp, which took place in August and September 1942, the new gas chambers were built. At Totenlager (extermination camp) there was a fenced barrack for prisoners who were used to bury and burn the bodies. There were about 300 of them. In this part of the camp, there were several deep pits for the bodies, dug mainly with the help of excavators (baggers), brought here at the end of July 1942. The trenches reached a depth of 10 m.

Initially, the murdered were buried, then burned on grates. They were built in the spring of 1943 by cremation specialist SS-Oberscharführer Herbert Floß, who came to Treblinka. To cover up the traces of the crime, a method of burning the bodies with petrol and diesel oil was introduced, and ashes mixed with sand were buried.
 
Show us 6 million corpses.
It's more likely we'd find 6 million corpses then find the ruined resettlement camps where the Nazis resettled millions of Jews . Of course, we know the ghettos which the Germans razed and emptied of their inhabitants in a TOTALLY PEACEFUL AND NORMAL MANNER (as I've been told), but where are the other places housing millions of Jews? Like you do know that thousands of small resettlement towns and villages are going to leave a lot more trace than compact death camps or camps where people starved/died of epidemic disease?

Is this actually the theory you people go with to defend your meme ideology when saying "they died" is far and away the most logical answer? It reminds me of the complex cosmologies and physics reworks created by flat earthers.
 
We can see here what mrolonzo means exactly by "rationalizing".

RSHA produced 6 versions of its colonization plans. The last 3 revisions call for deportation of 85%, 90%, and 95% of all Poles. Before the war against the USSR opened up more prospects for mass deportation, Himmler penned this document (and showed it to HItler, who heartily approved)

Treatment of Alien Races in the East (1940)

In it he says,
"What I want to say is that we are not only most interested in not unifying the population of the East, but, on the contrary, in splitting them up into as many parts and fragments as possible.

But even within the ethnic groups themselves we have one interest in leading these to unity and greatness, or perhaps arouse in them gradually a national consciousness and national culture, but we want to dissolve them into innumerable small fragments and particles."

And later that eventually the ethnic concept of Poles and Ukrainians should "disappear" altogether.

Ignatiev anyone? Actually even in mrolonzo's entirely speculative universe Ignatiev doesn't go this far.


This is instructive about the actuality;

"Facing the prospect that the whole resettlement programme would end up depopulating the Reich's new eastern borderlands by getting rid of Poles before enough Germans had been found to come in, the local authorities in the Warthegau moved back towards an assimilation policy and sought to introduce new citizenship guidlines in order to work out whom to give German ID papers to. Less dogmatic than Himmler, Hitler himself understood the problem and once he clarified that he tolerate some degree of assimilation the guidlines were finalized. "

[...]

Hitler humself thought Himmler's race mysticism was impractical, and while hostile to serbs and Russians in general, he felt differently about other groups of Slavs. He praised the Czechs as "industrious and intelligent workers' and speculated that blue eyed Ukranians might be peasant descendants of German tribes who never migrated'. In fact, he came round to the view - common among German anthropologists - that there was, racially speaking, no such catergory as 'Slavs': it was a linguistic term, nothing more. That did not stop it contunuting to be used. But it helps explain why the Fuhrer allowed Himmler and Forster each to define Germanness in his own way."

Mark Mazower, Hitler's Empire Nazi Rule in Occupied Europe (Penguin Books, 2008), Pp. 194, 198

Where do you get the impression that I'm mad? Maybe amused, to see white nationalists shilling so hard for the most anti-white regime in history (if you consider Eastern Europeans white, which I think you do)

Ah yes. 'Going to war with whites makes you anti white etc ' therefore self defence and the pursuit of national interest is disallowed on that basis.

Is this actual pro white argument?

Are you going to stand by that again Chugger or are you giving this point up?

One more thing. If you came across a room full of nazis and saw that only a few of them were blond and blue eyed. Would this disturb you and make you think something was amiss?


Every single report of "6 million suffering European Jews" before 1945 can be understood in the context of Jewish poverty in the Russian Empire, because the shtetl was a very poor place prone to famine (much like the majority of Russia) and they are using the 1897 Russian census as their reference point for estimating there being 6 million Jews. State-sponsored antisemitism in the Russian Empire (and to be fair, Russian policy was more against Jews as a religion than Jews as an ethnic group) is of course the other reason why there's so many reports of 6 million suffering Jews.

You deny every piece of evidence, including primary sources) that doesn't fit your preconceptions. You have as much in common with actual historiography as flat earthers have with science.

Nice projection. I'm just curious why anyone actually believes this bizarre fantasy world where the Nazis dindu nuffin and millions of Jews were "resettled" without a single trace of their existence and somehow all survived despite their relatives maintaining to this day they are dead. Where are these phantom Jews

Right. So they're basically just picking a useful and familiar number rather than empirical data.

What evidence do I deny? Would you like to discuss any of it? Or is it more the 'concomitance' that you insist upon?

We already know Jews went all around the world and the numbers accessible are fudged and hidden. You simply assume they're murdered because you've been told to without ever having seen anything.

As for phantom jews, this has been addressed on this very thread. By me. That you're too lazy to read this excellent thread says more about you than us.


It's more likely we'd find 6 million corpses then find the ruined resettlement camps where the Nazis resettled millions of Jews . Of course, we know the ghettos which the Germans razed and emptied of their inhabitants in a TOTALLY PEACEFUL AND NORMAL MANNER (as I've been told), but where are the other places housing millions of Jews? Like you do know that thousands of small resettlement towns and villages are going to leave a lot more trace than compact death camps or camps where people starved/died of epidemic disease?

Is this actually the theory you people go with to defend your meme ideology when saying "they died" is far and away the most logical answer? It reminds me of the complex cosmologies and physics reworks created by flat earthers.


Ok then. Go ahead and show one gassed person. In fact just describe how let's say a batch of 400 people were gassed. How did these weak and infirm people even get in the chamber ?

Alot of traces?
What exactly are you talking about? Describe these traces. The dead by typhus did indeed leave large traces.... their bodies. Where are the dead by gassing and shooting?

You seem to think our side is telling a fantastic tale when it's in fact you who has lost this debate over and over again. Our side is merely telling you that the fantastic tales of mass murder didn't happen and couldn't have happened.
 
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Where do you get the impression that I'm mad? Maybe amused, to see white nationalists shilling so hard for the most anti-white regime in history (if you consider Eastern Europeans white, which I think you do)
It's a life advice I gave you.
 
It's more likely we'd find 6 million corpses then find the ruined resettlement camps where the Nazis resettled millions of Jews . Of course, we know the ghettos which the Germans razed and emptied of their inhabitants in a TOTALLY PEACEFUL AND NORMAL MANNER (as I've been told), but where are the other places housing millions of Jews? Like you do know that thousands of small resettlement towns and villages are going to leave a lot more trace than compact death camps or camps where people starved/died of epidemic disease?

Is this actually the theory you people go with to defend your meme ideology when saying "they died" is far and away the most logical answer? It reminds me of the complex cosmologies and physics reworks created by flat earthers.
I haven't advanced any theory, and even assuming that I did, all you could possibly do is attack my assertion. That my theory may (or may not) have an evidentiary basis has no bearing on anyone else's theories, unless they substantively overlap. Since your theory is oppositional, they are disconnected. You are shifting the burden and acting as though you don't need to present your own, independent proof.
or:
🤡 "There is no confirming evidence that positively demonstrates every detail of a position I assigned to you, therefore you are wrong and I am right."
🤔 "Uh, that's cool and all, but then where is your positive evidence proving your thesis?"
🤡 "There is no evidence, therefore you can't disprove my thesis."
🤔 "You just said a second ago that a lack of positive, detailed evidence demonstrates probable falsity, so how can you-"
🤡 "SHUT UP IDIOT, THERE WAS NEVER A MOON RUSSIAN RESETTLEMENT AND YOU'LL NEVER PROVE YOUR CONSPIRACY THEORY, RETARD!"
 
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