Incel and Lonely Men Debate thread - Defend men giving up or tell them otherwise

[Bloitzhole]

Yeah but to be fair most people aren't autist Dric so it isn't really a problem just picking up on non-verbal cues.

I know way too many horror stories from my female friends about blokes interpreting literally everything as a way to flirt and not fucking off - I think a ton of people don't pick up on the "right" queues so I guess I subconsciously tend to err on the side of caution.

It's weird and unattractive when women are too aggressive.

Eh, I think that depends a lot on what you're attracted to. I want partners that are strong willed enough to be able to challenge me when I'm behaving stupid and I like weightlifting with my girlfriend or at least expect them to be fit and have a passion for a physical activity of their own, so I find a lot of my partners tend to be aggressive "for a woman", though our image of what aggressive behaviour entails might differ ofc.

Also talking about sex beforehand seems really bizarre and unarousing.

It's more little things you pick up on. Like one girl made a joke about how some dudes will be super quiet during the act and it weirds her out, another mentioned she just never got the appeal of oral - giving or receiving. I find it's just stuff that comes up as little asides or jokes during banter, flirty or otherwise, given enough conversation time.

It's not that they try to act to disinterested or unavailable, it's that they don't know how to act, period. To me, there's a rise in people nowadays that never grow out of that high school stage where they can talk but genuinely appearing outgoing is extremely difficult for them

This is a horrific thought (and ofc it would go for younger guys as well) that I wish was wrong, but I can absolutely see you being right.

The first is as you get older, you don't have high school or college or groups to rely on anymore for meeting people

Idk, there's always (dinner) parties where friends bring other friends or various hobby groups if you live in a city. Just gotta be a tad more active, but it's not a huge hurdle.
Recent example: I met a gal I'm having a little rendez-vous with tomorrow at a 33rd birthday celebration of another friend I've known for ages and since we were both on the cooking crew preparing dishes for the 30+ people attending, we talked for like 8 hours and found that we worked really well as a team in the kitchen - which is pretty demanding and usually brings out the best and worst when you're on a tight schedule.

The second is time, life just gets busy and ripping off the band-aid is easier than spending time in an odd limbo-phase. You spend time together while dating doing mutually enjoyable activities, testing limits, etc. no matter what. Adding a "will they, won't they arc" doesn't really do much

I get where you're coming from with this, but I don't see how you can tell compatibility, even just from your side, when you haven't gone through those stages - if you're just looking for a hookup and it's purely about chemistry, sure, then I agree with you 100% - if you want a long term partner, eeeh.

I've found most women who have any interest beyond casual friends will make a scene when they see you frequently

I 100% get what you mean, but I found that to be deeply dependent on where they're from and how they were raised / socialized - there's always super extroverts who act that way, but how frequent this behavior appears is hugely dependent on cultural background, even if the difference is as small as Brits and Americans or French and Spanish (literally neighbors).

 

[Matt Damon]

Ye but the manner in which they make it known usually might as well be a mixture of smoke signs, ancient runes and zulu interpretive dance. I can't pick up on that shit. The only reason I ever know women are attracted to me is because their friends tell me while she's away.

I had a woman I worked with - apropos of nothing - ask me "do you like haunted houses?" in a tone like she was asking a trivia question and I replied "uh, not really" and gave her a weird look. She said "oh, okay" and walked away. I found out later through the grapevine that she was trying to ask me out and I had torn her heart asunder with my response.

So not only are women terrible at communicating their intentions, but they also sperg out when you don't pick up on them.

 

[God of Nothing]

So not only are women terrible at communicating their intentions, but they also sperg out when you don't pick up on them.

yeah, it's really hard to argue against
society has given all the relationship power to women

and they are terrible with it

 

[Protistology]

but they also sperg out when you don't pick up on them.

I always thought it interesting that the same women who go to pride parades and gay bars call you a faggot if you're not interested.

 

[Darkholme's Dungeon]

I always thought it interesting that the same women who go to pride parades and gay bars call you a faggot if you're not interested.

Niggerfaggot
... Sheeet, guess we're both gay now.

 

[Blacklight]

Question for you guys. Do you think someone who's volcel is different than incel?

I'm not trying to power level too hard here (maybe the lack of the farms has made me more introspective), but I'm just getting out of a three year relationship where my GF cheated on me with someone else, and to be honest? I don't quite feel like I NEED a woman in my life now. I have a job, a roof over my head, a pet, and friends (both virtual and real). Adding a woman into this would just take away from time I could put forward toward shit I personally want to do.

 

[Local Fed]

Do you think someone who's volcel is different than incel?

Well yeah, by their definitions they're literally different things. You might as well ask if someone who chooses to be a shut in is different than someone who is on house arrest.

 

[Darkholme's Dungeon]

Question for you guys. Do you think someone who's volcel is different than incel?

I'm not trying to power level too hard here (maybe the lack of the farms has made me more introspective), but I'm just getting out of a three year relationship where my GF cheated on me with someone else, and to be honest? I don't quite feel like I NEED a woman in my life now. I have a job, a roof over my head, a pet, and friends (both virtual and real). Adding a woman into this would just take away from time I could put forward toward shit I personally want to do.

The word "incel" is just a generic insult thrown at men who either aren't dating or precieved to lack social skills. Kind of like nigger for black folk.

At the end of the day, if you're male, you can have viable sperm much later than a woman can have viable eggs. That's just how the biology works and anyone who can deny that reality is a fool trying to delude you. If or if not you use your time wisely while being celibate is up to you.

 

[Kel1 shi1]

The third reason is what I said before, the more time you spend around someone, the lower your chances become. It's just a harsh truth of life. It would be nice to spend years getting to know to someone as your best friend, and then try dating and have it be successful but the reality is that it simply isn't going to happen for most people.

The most important thing I learned back in the day when dating was that women view men life fresh fruit. They lose interest very quickly, but while you are new to them you are put in the pending date material group. After that, friend zoned. I figured out by watching how guys more sucessful with women worked that this period is about two weeks, depending on how much contact you have with them and after that your chances seriously diminish.

After this realization I set a hard rule that if I had not asked out a girl in two weeks I would just move on. I didn't suddenly become a stud but my success noticeably improved.

That long friendship into relationship only realistically works once she's hit the wall her options disappear and either needs a pay cuck or doesn't want to become a cat lady.

 

[ToroidalBoat]

An observation I've made is how "lopsided" relations seem to be.

I think one would have to be fairly delusional or naive to not see how lopsided relations are in favor of women now.

If one pictures America with the sexes reversed, one can see just how lopsided relations are IRL. Like how divorce works. Or how less women get called "creepy" than men.

One can clearly see that relations in the modern world are lopsided in favor of women. All one has to do to see that is to imagine a mirror modern world where guys are in the position of girls. For example, seems that pretty much everything women do that's even remotely sexual could be deemed as "creepy" or "inappropriate" in such a world.

(also when I made that second post I forgot I made that first one lol)

 

[Car Won't Crank]

Question for you guys. Do you think someone who's volcel is different than incel?

I'm not trying to power level too hard here (maybe the lack of the farms has made me more introspective), but I'm just getting out of a three year relationship where my GF cheated on me with someone else, and to be honest? I don't quite feel like I NEED a woman in my life now. I have a job, a roof over my head, a pet, and friends (both virtual and real). Adding a woman into this would just take away from time I could put forward toward shit I personally want to do.

Yes, look at James May from former Top Gear and Grand Tour. He's the only one in the trio who remains single and he's as jolly and amicable as can be. Of course being a successful and beloved host for an immensely popular TV show helps, but he was like that even in the early days of Top Gear back when he was a musician.

 

[ITK]

An observation I've made is how "lopsided" relations seem to be.



(also when I made that second post I forgot I made that first one lol)

Biology is lopsided. Women just can't be creepy. You've got to remember that any given man can easily subdue 90% if not more of women. The only thing stopping any of the countless men women meet daily from harming them are social rules, but criminality does happen. That's why they're hardwired to try to identify any signals of such a person. I think it's gotten much worse, though, because we live in relatively low-trust mass societies where we might meet strangers daily, as opposed to high-trust and tight knit villages or bands of 20-30 people where you'll know the personality of every man in your life and most of them will see you as one of their women and protect you if anything.

 

[God of Nothing]

Biology is lopsided. Women just can't be creepy. You've got to remember that any given man can easily subdue 90% if not more of women. The only thing stopping any of the countless men women meet daily from harming them are social rules, but criminality does happen. That's why they're hardwired to try to identify any signals of such a person. I think it's gotten much worse, though, because we live in relatively low-trust mass societies where we might meet strangers daily, as opposed to high-trust and tight knit villages or bands of 20-30 people where you'll know the personality of every man in your life and most of them will see you as one of their women and protect you if anything.

A woman once held a kitchen knife to me and asked me where the peppers were in my early wage slave kitchen days.
She really needed to work on her jokes, but I thought it was cute in a 'You're supposed to be an adult' way.

 

[Burned CDs]

Incels are just plain retards.

I could always somehow pull women even though I had the incel type dislike of them. One turned me down, I'd had women until i got a shot at another one.

Polishing your social skills, practicing hygiene, having hobbies and goals/dreams is what it takes. You don't have to be extremely good looking. That's what incels don't understand, women do not all have the same preferences or outlooks, they are individuals who are also shaped by life experiences.


I had a friend who was totally awkward and couldn't talk to girls and just put them off. One time i was tipsy as we were riding around and we pulled up on some older women (we were in our early 20s) and i told them to pull over, i didn't think it would work and didn't give a fuck, but they pulled over and i told him to follow along with everything I say and smile and not look lost. I got one of their numbers and i said we'll call them soon and we parted ways. I texted one of them Pretending to be him, and set up a date at a motel with one of them. He ended up going over there and getting laid, and ever since then, has stopped being so fucking awkward. He is happily married now and has a kid.

Realizing the power of not giving a fuck and the power of walking away and not clinging on will change ones life.

Women and relationships are not THAT important, one can live without them. Once a guy realizes that and puts it in practice, he will somehow run into a woman sooner or later.

Love yourself first.

/Sperg.

 

[ToroidalBoat]

The only thing stopping any of the countless men women meet daily from harming them are social rules, but criminality does happen.

If that really is so, then that's yet another reason that if Homo sapiens truly are "made in the image of God", that image seems to be far too often like a demonic funhouse mirror image. Also I still think the modern world may go a bit too far in demonizing men and male sexuality. Like that "#MeToo" witch hunt on "social media".

 

[Matt Damon]

Women and relationships are not THAT important, one can live without them. Once a guy realizes that and puts it in practice, he will somehow run into a woman sooner or later.

That's fucking retarded. I quit dating years ago and haven't been within a country mile of a romantic interaction ever since.

I'm not complaining about that (I quit dating for a reason, obviously), but if you're making no efforts to achieve something, you're very, very unlikely to have it fall in your lap accidentally.

 

[Kill Your Idols]

Question for you guys. Do you think someone who's volcel is different than incel?

The only difference between the two is a shift in attitude for why their lives lack sex. A volcel has an internal reason for avoiding sex, maybe a different purpose or lifestyle where sex isn't a priority. An incel only has external reasons, it's not that they aren't seeking sex, sex is being denied to them.

I wouldn't get too hung up on the terms, if your hearts not in it, you don't need to apply a new label onto yourself just because you're shifting focus on something else right now.

Women and relationships are not THAT important, one can live without them. Once a guy realizes that and puts it in practice, he will somehow run into a woman sooner or later.

Love yourself first.

This kind of advice always sounds nice, but it's highly dependent on actual pursuing or taking part in something that's sexually attractive. You can do all the self-improvement in the world, but if you don't actively make yourself approachable or interesting, you'll still be as off-putting as a basement dweller because nobody will notice you in the sea of nameless faces. You have to give a shit about women to some degree for this to work.

 

[Party Hat Wurmple]

The most important thing I learned back in the day when dating was that women view men life fresh fruit. They lose interest very quickly, but while you are new to them you are put in the pending date material group. After that, friend zoned. I figured out by watching how guys more sucessful with women worked that this period is about two weeks, depending on how much contact you have with them and after that your chances seriously diminish.

I always try to tell people that your chances start out at 50% and they NEVER get any higher. If you don't believe me, go down your friends list and ask out every female friend you have. Once you have done so, go ask out the same number of random girls after maybe a short conversation. Unless you have the social skills of a retard, you'll notice a difference very quickly (even if you're an ugly incel manlet).

 

[Burned CDs]

That's fucking retarded. I quit dating years ago and haven't been within a country mile of a romantic interaction ever since.

I'm not complaining about that (I quit dating for a reason, obviously), but if you're making no efforts to achieve something, you're very, very unlikely to have it fall in your lap accidentally.

Sometimes it does fall in your lap, repeatedly. Maybe I'm lucky. Maybe you just suck. Who knows.

 

[Ughubughughughughughghlug]

I mean this in the absolute best faith possible: some of your posts in this thread come off like a bit of a cuck faggot, and you may wish to consider examining your behavior to see if you might be one IRL.

It's kind of an incel meme bible at this point, but if you read it a bit skeptically, No More Mr. Nice Guy is unironically a decent book for outlining the way you can fall into these traps. If you search "no more mister nice guy filetype:pdf" on your favorite search engine, you can probably find a PDF of the book. After each chapter, reflect on it and honestly think how it might apply to your life. Then, to balance it out, pretend the advice was given to you by some fat faggot like Coach Red Pill, and see if that makes you inclined to disregard part of it. Go back and forth a bit and you might start seeing things in a different light.

If you ever find yourself tempted to become a pick-up artist, just remember that Mystery got committed and Torero probably killed himself. Good luck.

I don't think I am, in part because I don't consider myself particularly nice and the description, at least in the book, describes the sort of approvalcuck that tries to live in harmony with everyone. Which I mean, I would like it if everybody liked me, but I don't censor myself to suck up to others, I'm willing to confront someone on their bad behavior, generally have confidence in my abilities. I can't say as I've seen any benefit to it, standing up to people seems to just run them off - I guess if they run off they weren't worth having to begin with - and people, even the "man's man" types I see, seem to prefer servile spinelessness (and womanly behaviors like backbiting and gossip) to straight talk. I do try to be helpful to people, I like to be helpful. Helped that woman run some errands, but I also told her at the start that she was going to need to figure out how to be self-sufficient (live without someone driving her everywhere), which she did. Helped two of my coworkers move some furniture. Helped many neighbors over the years move in and out. Help coworkers with their work assignments. From as far as I can tell the people around here don't have a grateful bone in their bodies, they just take. Empty flattery from schmoozers appeals more to them than deeds.

I do think people around my work don't respect me much, and I don't know exactly why, but part of it may be that I have a willingness to laugh at myself and to act goofy. There's a dude there who's got a lot in common with me but is one of those haughty-acting, takes-himself-too-seriously "man's men." To me there's a sort of clownishness to him, but I notice that no one ever ribs him like they do me. Little ribbing that didn't seem like a problem at the time, but when people stab you in the back later, you realize.

Other than that, faggot sure, cuck I don't know. I only remember talking about wanting a woman with personality and not knowing how to flirt/being intimidated by women.

A coworker once referred to me as being a big personality. I didn't know and still don't know exactly what he meant.

Spoiler: Aimless ranting

There's a guy I work with and used to be friends with who's a real schmoozer. Superficially friendly, flatterer, but very rude in his behaviors (like constantly being late, or making insulting remarks in front of others), narcissistic, pretentious, strongly suspect he mocks me behind my back. Is phoney as hell, have seen him bitch about people and then greet them like they were his long-lost brother. Fancies himself a future politician, but will act like he agrees with whoever he's around - even to the point of disagreeing with the positions of himself and his friends - and is literally terrified of being found to disagree with professors. The longer I knew him the less I respected him, and then started to hate him, until finally I cut things off.

Faggot once asked me, in a sad and contemplative mood, if I thought everyone liked me. I said, "No. Who cares?"

In some sense, that guy is like a Nice Guy, but he's real charming to most people. Gets what he wants while being a dirtbag at the core. We've got this whole circle of office snakes at work and he's in cozy with them. That's what I see succeeding, socially, in the world around me. Snakes.