Gamergate III: Rise of the Machines

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GL99 said:
Lord knows I agree, but then we come back to money again. Cutting out half the audio means paying the American VAs less, selling content as DLC means you can squeeze even more dollars out of your audience, and when it comes to translation accuracy or characterization, a significant portion of the consumer base won't care about that if you stuff cute memes into the script everywhere, and those savvy enough to actually care are more likely to emulate the games and play the translation patch anyways.

You're exactly right to bring up the example of Wolfenstein 3D as a horrendously failed 'localization,' but unfortunately, things have changed so much since the days of the NES that I'm not sure Nintendo will take the hint from Fates. We can hope they get the message from Twitter or from letters sent to NoA or whatever, but it's more likely, if Fates sells well, that Nintendo will ignore us and think meme-filled "localization" + rubes buying DLC like there's no tomorrow = money, and if Fates sells poorly, Nintendo will think, "welp, Fire Emblem doesn't sell" and just decline to translate the next one without learning any lesson about localization.
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General consensus online seems to be "better dead/stuck in japan than butchered by agenda-driven sociopaths."

It's not like not localizing it will stop the fan community from translating it and playing it anyway.
 
Jaimas said:
It's not like not localizing it will stop the fan community from translating it and playing it anyway.
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Exactly--very aptly put. And I fear that's the greater problem. If the people who care about censorship would mainly have played fan translations for free anyways, it makes more economic sense for Nintendo or any other company for that matter to pander to those who are actually willing to pay--which in this case would be the people who don't care or even outrightly support censorship. I've heard people say they'd go out of their way to buy Fates if 'skinship' or whatever had been removed. Who do you think Nintendo will consider the next time they make localization decisions?
 
This people are the same people that go to threads of games they have no intention to buy just bitch about x stuff is problematic.

People are willing to pay if the localization does an effort to keep stuff in spirit of the original. Is the real reason why localization houses like Atlus and Nisa started to going big even if their translations where not 100 literal or with painful typos or mistakes.

The fact this become as big shitstorm as it is now is because is truly difficult to ignore the localization decisions even for the people okay with the original cut content.

People are willing to pay if there is goodwill in the companies bringing the games.
 

Apparently, the fan fix not only restores the dialogue, but also the head patting minigame. The localization didn't actually remove the code for it, just disabled it, so restoring it will be relatively easy.
 
Stay safe said:
[MEDIA=twitter]702158011003858945[/MEDIA]
Just look at all that salt.
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Not gonna lie, watching mombot kick Andrea's ass has been fucking amazing. I haven't seen something quite like this since Vade showed up on the Farms, tried to defend herself, and got ground into the dirt until she cried and self-injured with a toilet bowl.
 
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I'm just gonna leave this here

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So I have a question...

Games have been getting censored or localized in stupid ways for pretty much as long as they've been getting imported. Why are we acting like it's something new? Especially considering that it's Nintendo.

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raymond said:
So I have a question...

Games have been getting censored or localized in stupid ways for pretty much as long as they've been getting imported. Why are we acting like it's something new? Especially considering that it's Nintendo.

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Because previous instances of censorship were internal decisions by Nintendo. In Fate's case we have a very unusual situation where journalists and translators conspired to lie about a game in order to censor content that offended them personally.
 
Ruin said:
Because previous instances of censorship were internal decisions by Nintendo. In Fate's case we have a very unusual situation where journalists and translators conspired to lie about a game in order to censor content that offended them personally.
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We still not sure about that, thought Andrea Ritsu sperging about it doesn't look good in Nich favor.

To many of us, IT WAS a problem that Nintendo self censored a lot of stuff because they wanted to avoid controversy. I get stuff like Jinx as is Pokemon and is sold to kids, but not when you game is a strategy game with dating sim elements or the game that is a Sci Fi anime like gnosis parabole. And how defensive has Treehouse acted and how many journos decided to sell us the idea of "localization" when features are removed, is when people take issue.

StallChaser said:
[MEDIA=twitter]702153640593719296[/MEDIA]
Apparently, the fan fix not only restores the dialogue, but also the head patting minigame. The localization didn't actually remove the code for it, just disabled it, so restoring it will be relatively easy.
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You should note that the one doing the coding is Intelligent Systems, not Treehouse. Treehouse is translates and suggest changes, they don't do programming. Atlus and NISA had localizations cancelled because the Japanese studios where not available to do the programming of their own games. No localization house do programing on their own. This is the kind of shit thatis not helping make this shitstorm something positive than another ProGGVsAntiGG bitch slap.
 
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raymond said:
So I have a question...

Games have been getting censored or localized in stupid ways for pretty much as long as they've been getting imported. Why are we acting like it's something new? Especially considering that it's Nintendo.

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We discussed this several times in just the last few pages.

The issue is not that things got changed, it's a matter of degree. Some level of change is fine or even encouragable as long as it doesn't change the spirit of a work too much; a change to Jynx's color to make it seem less like a blackface characture (for example) doesn't ruin the gameplay or story any and doesn't really take away from anything (and is pretty much exactly what Capcom did with Oil Man in Megaman: Powered Up). Changes here and there to fix stuff are fine. There's a reason that some otherwise considered poor translations (Chrono Trigger) are considered successes despite it all. What got changed didn't destroy the work's content, so it was embraced.

That can't be said about Fates.

We're in a situation here where the changes to Fates backstab, if not flat-out undermine the original spirit of the work. Entire character arcs are blunted, if not removed, and for an RPG that's kind of a big deal. Pointless jokes and references are added where they are neither needed or warranted, seemingly out of contempt for the audience. More than that, it's given what is, essentially, a feature-crippled version of the game in its place (less content, cooldown times added to castles, etc). Some of the changes are so bad as to have people questioning whether or not it was done as a joke translation. The fact that there's people like Andrea Ritsu who've been trying to get the game censored as part of it and who clearly have some level of support from inside the translation pit is pretty chilling as well.

Whilst there's been a lot of cases of games that have had weird translations or bad ones over the years, it's very rare that one reaches the degree of shit-spewing hatred the fanbase has for it that this one has had. Again, the closest analogy I've been able to find in roughly 30 years of playing video games has been what Nintendo did to Wolfenstein 3D on SNES, which is a game that bombed because nobody wanted to play a Wolfenstein game without Nazis or blood or the ability to kill Adolf Hitler.
 
Yeah, Nich donating to Andre Ritsu looks bad in any way. I don't believe in the conspiracy angle, but is gross that a professional and veteran translator (one that worked many years in Atlus, the company whose main video game series is about teenagers summoning demons and killing God, so he knows how hard is preserving stuff that goes against the social status quo of a region) is okay in giving money to a tansexual woman doing choppy sensasionalist and desingenious translations in tumblr while lusting openly for pettanko girls in twitter.
 
Jaimas said:
Again, the closest analogy I've been able to find in roughly 30 years of playing video games has been what Nintendo did to Wolfenstein 3D on SNES, which is a game that bombed because nobody wanted to play a Wolfenstein game without Nazis or blood or the ability to kill Adolf Hitler.
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I hate to be a downer, but it looks like Fates is doing the opposite of bombing.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/ollieba...nch-but-not-without-controversy/#2fabf2a130e3

During its launch weekend in the US Fire Emblem Fates has sold over 300 thousand units, selling five times more than the previous game and making it the best ever launch for the series.
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I think Ollie is either pro-GG or at least neutral, so it's not as if he's gloating about this. It's a lamentable thing, but however great the outcry over the censorship has been online, it either hasn't done all that much or the game did well enough anyway that Nintendo is not likely to pay attention to it in the future.
 
GL99 said:
I hate to be a downer, but it looks like Fates is doing the opposite of bombing.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/ollieba...nch-but-not-without-controversy/#2fabf2a130e3
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Its a downer but it was expected. Is not exactly rare that a game sells well/worse depending of how well recived its predecesor was. The question is going to be how well the third campaign is going to sell or if the succesor of fates will get this numbers again. Assasins Creed 3 was the best selling title of the series and that made AC: Black flag (the one considered superior) selling worse as people hated 3. FE brand got big since Awakening, has a legion of fans and many are going to buy because "I want to see where this smashs character come from" .Don't be surprised if the franchise never pulls this numbers again, specially if Nintendo pulls another stuff like this (shitty anime writting + shitty localization + uncaring japanese devs and amreican localizers) or the fandom starts to becoming Sonic-esque in how is viewed by another video game fans.

The downer is that is going to be used as "look, this 'censorship' doesn't matter" when is clear there still a large meltdown because there is legit complains in the middle of KiA sperging and SJW desingenuity. In the end, what the hell accomplished the removal of that support conversation about "fake lesbians" when the japanese devs will not get why is shitty dumb idea and just thinks "a impenetable joke that the West is not to get, better localized" than thinking "It was a stupid plotline that got axed/hated and you as a writter should do better". Like you said, to them is not censoship but "localized", so is another person problem. The next Fire Emblem will have worse writting, the SJW fans are going to bitch and wonder why they keep doing this while celebrating Treehouse half patching up while Nintendo thinks they can sell the game in 5 parts. If localization, the devs and Nintendo doesn't care about not botching the game to much, why try understand why this kind of anime cliches are mocked? Why the devs should care about how gay people feel about the cliche "fake lesbian girl that is inmmature for being into ladies, she needs a dick" still being a thing in their country?

I think Ollie is either pro-GG or at least neutral, so it's not as if he's gloating about this. It's a lamentable thing, but however great the outcry over the censorship has been online, it either hasn't done all that much or the game did well enough anyway that Nintendo is not likely to pay attention to it in the future.
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Is a long term effect. for better or worse. The aftershock will be visible only after Nintendo needs to bring more Japanese oriented games to get the WiiU in live support or making NX presentable.
 
MiloWuCollusion said:
That will be pretty cool, actually.
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Yeah. That's the nice thing about how easy it is to mod games these days. Don't like an aspect of a particular game? A few lines of code and you can cut it out. Want more of something (same-sex relationships, in this case)? Another few lines of code and a few hours writing dialogue for the characters and you can have it. Everybody's happy.
 
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