🦊 Furry Furry Fandom and Drama General

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The fandom is unique in that we have our fair share of "whitewashers" who try to cover things like this up, however this only occurs in one of two scenarios: Someone in a very high position of "authority" in the fandom fucks up big time and their cronies control the information going out, or one of the millennial "SJW furs" botches something and their hugbox goes on high alert.

In either case there's also the point that a majority of the fandom doesn't put up with shit like this and we usually have no qualms naming and shaming "one of our own". That's what it's slowly coming to, at least.
 
peribot said:
https://twitter.com/2_gryphon/status/721723396417912832

2 Gryphon defends Furry Raiders (Neo Nazi type furry group led by Foxler aka Fox Hitler) and doesnt even do 5 minutes of research. Nothing else is new.
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2 Gryphon is like the furry fandom's Sarah Palin. Goes around spouting moronic nonsense that he never bothered to research, with a group of clueless idiots gobbling his shit up.

The worst part is that he's buddies with Uncle Kage, who makes sure he gets two chances to spew his "edgy" "comedy" on Anthrocon's main stage.
 
The autistic fat fetish furry, Samael D. Butterdragon, who paid to have his furry character put in undertale as So Sorry is upset because Toby had big plans for it, then when he found out it was an autistic fat fetish character he dropped them. He even removed Samael's name from the credits and this is destroying Samael D. Butterdragon's life with anxiety and misery:


Okay, this has been a long time coming. Unfortunately, I wasn’t aware of threading comments on twitter so mostly I’m just grabbing what I wrote there and stuffing it in a text post to get it in one place.

Okay, hoo, here goes. So, seven months since Undertale. As Toby predicted, I was found in under a week - then found out shortly after. Now people say shitty things to me and about me legit all the time. It stings but, y'know, water off a duck’s back. I’m autistic, I’m fat, I’m poly, I might be NB, I have anxiety disorder, I’m on medication. I’m used to getting things slung my way. And I knew that once the connection was made to me in Undertale, it’d be same old story. We both knew how it would go. Toby warned me, expressed his concerns and asked me if I wanted to back down. I said “its worth it to be part of something I love so much”.

The problem is, some stuff had happened preceding that and surrounding that that kind of hurt.

Firstly, he was cool with me, loved my character, said nice things about me, agreed to a unique room, an encounter, a battle and NPC. Then someone said “hey, Sam’s a freak by the way”. I never was told who, only that someone brought it up to him. Ever after, its been pain. Now, unique area, npc, boss fight, encounter - all that stuff went to another backer, who I’ve since been told is his friend?

I didn’t hear much for two years. I waited patiently, hopeful the bad stuff was over, super excited for Undertale. Then one day he messages me near the end of development and asks if he can just shitcan the whole thing, refund the money. All the fun ideas we talked about got scrapped. I stood up enough to say “no, thats real unfair” and that was about it. In the end, we didn’t even get to see the lovely sprite Tuyo did for So Sorry’s front - we only get the back in the game. I think its probably okay for me to share this now - if she says otherwise, I can take it down, of course.

I love the fight, I love the game, but its all tangled up in so much stress at this point. I don’t feel like a “cool secret” as I was told about. I feel like a skeleton buried under the floorboards of a closet. People keep comparing me to Muffet and its not hard to see why. She’s really cool, I love her design and the battle is amazing. But she’s also an external creation and you HAVE to fight her before you are even ABLE to trigger the So Sorry secret for some reason. That and not even getting my name in the credits with the other monster designers it feels like yeah, he didn’t want anything to do with me.

And I’m done, I’m done feeling hurt about it. I’m done with the naysayers being enabled nothin being countered. I’m done doubting myself for ever wanting to be out in the open. I’m a real person. My life has meaning no matter what.

And it would have been fine if Toby had actually ever directly addressed any of it. Instead, it was “don’t harass my backers, no good will come of it” and “all monsters are good”. No good came of it - for me, at least. It wasn’t all your backers being harassed and they weren’t being harassed for being your backers. It was one developmentally challenged guy who wound up with a weird job on the internet. I’ve tried talking to Toby about it, as has Khato, as have a couple of friends we talked to about it. Toby doesn’t want to make a scene. He’s worried about the backlash I think? But he has nothing to lose and I had everything to lose by being so involved. And I’m tired of losing. I’m tired of being indefensible for existing. I already got hit by the backlash. I’m just tired.

Also Toby isn’t bad, I just think how he’s dealt with me has been kind of, uh, a little dehumanizing. Just all this stuff is really contrary to the meaning and moral of his game since I guess I’m the wrong kind of monster. And I’ve spent seven months dealing with the stress. Its affected my health and my work both and there’s no end to it. It feels good to finally get all that off my chest. Its been a long time in coming but its been killing me, very slowly.

tldr: toby was more invested in me being a secret than me being a cool secret and not standing up for me made me feel isolated and hurt

I appreciate all the well wishing by the way. Its been exhausting and the support means a lot to me (by the time of posting it to tumblr, there’s been an outpouring of it on twitter and oh my god I was not ready for that).

I hope one day people like me and my audience get to just be ourselves in our own little corners of the world without being denied happiness.

I don’t think I’m a great person or anything. I try to avoid hurting people. Some times I do. I know I’m not perfect. I make mistakes. But I’d like to think I’m generally an okay person and I just want to be treated with the same amount of respect as all living things

going forward, I don’t know what to do now. I don’t think I can talk to Toby about it anymore than I already have. It hurts too much. I didn’t want a refund, I just wanted to be involved in something that made me feel powerful emotions and give what I could back.

when the game was being kickstarted, I fell in love with it instantly. I spread the word to every person I knew. I explicitly asked if he’d want to do the fantroll thing and he said sure. When it came out, I spread the game to everyone I knew, everyone I cared about and a bunch of people I look up to and respect because the game means so much to me as it is and I wanted to share that good with everyone who might want it. I worked and saved up as hard as I could to be involved - as best as a low rent commission artist CAN do - and I did it again when the game came out and I saw people itching to play it. It means a lot to me - I have a lot of stuff going on in my life but it made me feel like maybe things would be okay.

but the longer I go on dealing with the stress, the less I’m sure things will be.

some people have asked about what the original plan called for. I don’t have it to hand but it involved him stumbling around his art studio, trying to draw a butterfly that wouldn’t keep still. silly and toothless stuff, but thats all the plan was for. Just something light and fluffy. I commissioned some art from Tuyoki of it at the time since she was open and seemed to want to work with me. We didn’t have a whole lot of interaction, but she never did anything that made me feel intensely alienated or anything. Thats the piece at the top of the post - again if she isn’t cool with me sharing the work, I can take it down from the post.

Finally, someone’s told me it may be even more complex and possibly worse than I was aware of. I won’t say anything specifically until I can find out. I don’t know what the case is and I don’t want to say anything based on supposition, only what I’ve experienced or understand. I guess I’ll make an addendum to the addendum if I find out more.

Thanks for listening, folks, and thank you for the kind words on twitter.
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gracious bobbly bits said:
The autistic fat fetish furry, Samael D. Butterdragon, who paid to have his furry character put in undertale as So Sorry is upset because Toby had big plans for it, then when he found out it was an autistic fat fetish character he dropped them. He even removed Samael's name from the credits and this is destroying Samael D. Butterdragon's life with anxiety and misery:

[MEDIA=tumblr]did=000540029f859c9d0dc2781f13e59ae8abdacc97;id=143135058955;key=EjOZlGL030_NwlZCMfBwWA;name=samael[/MEDIA]
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Why couldn't this guy make up a character that wasn't a fat furry fetish? Was it really that difficult?
 
gracious bobbly bits said:
The autistic fat fetish furry, Samael D. Butterdragon, who paid to have his furry character put in undertale as So Sorry is upset because Toby had big plans for it, then when he found out it was an autistic fat fetish character he dropped them. He even removed Samael's name from the credits and this is destroying Samael D. Butterdragon's life with anxiety and misery:

[MEDIA=tumblr]did=000540029f859c9d0dc2781f13e59ae8abdacc97;id=143135058955;key=EjOZlGL030_NwlZCMfBwWA;name=samael[/MEDIA]
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By "someone said hey sam's a freak," I think he means "Toby put 'Samael' in google search and found all my fat fetish porn." It's almost as if people don't like having fetish characters shoehorned into their games, especially games with a lot of minors in the fanbase.

Edit: Turns out just a few months ago, Sam was a-okay with how Toby handled the situation.
Undertale - So Sorry

Already posted much of this on the Steam forums today since questions have come up and a bunch of rumours have been quashed so I figured I’d say a few tings.

tumblr_inline_nwona5WdiT1qzbcet_250.png


This is gonna be a bit essay-ish but I figured I should respond to some questions, concerns and rumours that are goin around. So, full disclosure on the parts I can actually confirm. If you want more, you’ll have to ask Toby and Tem - I don’t know exactly what they think of me and I’m supremely anxious anyway, haha. They’ve been very supportive and kind to me though and I think they’re great people. Anyway, here’s the way of it.

Firstly, So Sorry is the Fan Troll. I has originally backed to design a monster but I thought long and hard and said “Hey, I think Undertale is literally the best, I want to help out, I know its a joke tier but would you be cool with me backing it”. He said yes and was kind of surprised at the time. We started talking about stuff before the Kickstarter ended. It didn’t take long for him to find out who I was, I have an internet presence like a lot of folks, and we got talking about it. I didn’t want my weird, niche interests to have any effect on the game because I had no desire to tamper with the game or anything. That’d be weird. In any case, I do have interests outside of my more peculiar things and Undertale was real important to me. It made me feel things a game had not done for a very long time, if at all.

So, Toby asked me if I’d be cool obscuring the connection since the character is a pre-existing thing. Part of its so the game feels like a self contained unit and give him control as a creator, which I totally get and I was fine with, and part of it was to avoid the issue of people seeing the name, googling it and giving me stick. Which happened anyway cos someone saw the battle in the discussions on /v/ I think and linked my gallery. Part of it is, obviously, so you can search for content of the game and not find my stuff. It isn’t shame, as far as I’m aware, to not want something unrelated associated wih you. Asking for major alterations to the character felt weird, its kind of a part of my identity, y'know? Like if someone asked me if my face could come with detached lobes or green eyes, I’d feel a little comprimised? When I expressed that kind of thing though, he seemed to understand.

I thought a bunch about what I could make work that would keep it distinct but true to the character. The game was full of mom/dad jokes, so I suggested the joke name So Sorry (Hey Mr Sorry, can I call you So?) and he liked it. He also asked if he could remove the hat and I said sure, like, its just window dressing, y'know? A hat’s a hat, not my whole identity. He added it back in of his own accord and added in half a dozen in total I think - I’m not even sure if I’ve even seen all of em. I think my favourite is the party hat though, it always makes me laugh. Otherwise, Toby seemed fine with the character being as they are and I really like the interpretation he came up with. There’s a rumour going around that not only would I not accept any comprimise, I was rude to Toby for asking and I don’t know where that’s coming from. A lot of them seem to be based on me being a secret and Toby hating me but I’m fine with the secret thing and as far as I’m aware, Toby doesn’t think ill of me. You can probably ask him yourself.

In terms of input, the design and general personality were mine. I think I might have come up with the paper ball attack? I didn’t expect it to take up much of the window though, haha. I might be wrong though, its been a couple of years. I think I suggested an attack where the pen chased you like in the game Snake. I didn’t come up with the ‘3D tush wiggle attack’ - that has orange/blue mechanics which I didn’t know anything about til I played the game. He also ran the whole dialogue of both paths by me before the game - I think the Fight version is actually the funnier of the two and I totally recommend people do it at least once, haha.

I think the array of faces So Sorry pulls in the whole thing are hilarious, too, and they’re part of the anxiety dealy I have. That was, by the way, the only real concession Toby asked of me - I think I suggested a dreary or stammery kind of anxiety, but both of those are covered by Napstablook and the character that would become Alphys. In fact, a lot of friends thought Alphys was my contribution due to how her anxiety manifests. I suggested a more desperate and energetic anxiety instead and we went with that!

I’m really happy with how it turned out, despite the abuse people have been slinging my way. Nobody has to look at my work just because I’m in the game - I know my stuff is not for everyone, hence I keep it to the sites I post on and I’m not offended if people don’t like it. My work has no bearing on any discussion of the game though - my interests don’t touch the game, only my identity, and I’m happy to keep it that way.

A lot of people compare my inclusion to Muffet and I think thats kind of weird. Muffet is tied to the intro by way of the bake sale, I’m tied to it by means of bad jokes. I think the Muffet fight is honestly probably one of my favourites, even if it is a little abrupt, its just paced kind of perfectly in its place in the game and the music sells it perfectly. So Sorry doesn’t have any pacing concerns, meanwhile, because they’re a secret and the music feels a little more out of place because it isn’t echoing earlier music - Spider Dance has elements of Dummy and Ghost Battle, I think. In any case, I think Muffet’s design is excellent and it feels a bit weird to compare the loser dragon I designed as a teenager ten years ago and identify with to something an incredibly talented comic artist drafted and designed more recently. I am what I am and a great artist I ain’t, haha. I just wanted to be a part of something I loved. I wasn’t the only one, considering other people opted in to contribute designs to the game. Woshua’s also great.

I didn’t want to interfere with the game any more than I did in the end - I was super excited to see what Toby was going to make. In the end, the whole thing was worth the wait and I’m very happy to have played a very small part in helping the game be. I still have the original sprite I think Tuyoki did for So Sorry on the overworld but I don’t think its up to me to share it without her say so. I’d ask if its cool and link it, but I’m actually kinda shy, haha.

Also I’d like to say people have been, in general, really supportive - especially on Tumblr and FA. Thanks, guys! =3

I think thats most of it though, if I missed anything, feel free to ask.
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plasticine said:
Why couldn't this guy make up a character that wasn't a fat furry fetish?
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Because autism and because he's a gross disgusting creep who has to insert his gross creepy fetish into literally everything he does.
 
gracious bobbly bits said:
The autistic fat fetish furry, Samael D. Butterdragon, who paid to have his furry character put in undertale as So Sorry is upset because Toby had big plans for it, then when he found out it was an autistic fat fetish character he dropped them. He even removed Samael's name from the credits and this is destroying Samael D. Butterdragon's life with anxiety and misery:

[MEDIA=tumblr]did=000540029f859c9d0dc2781f13e59ae8abdacc97;id=143135058955;key=EjOZlGL030_NwlZCMfBwWA;name=samael[/MEDIA]
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Ugh, I love Undertale, but this whole thing just pisses me off. What more does Samael want? Toby put a lot of work into that battle. It's one of the most unique fights in the game, and if it was not based on a creepy fetish it would actually be a pretty cool secret.
But, it's clear that Samael is incapable of separating his own identity from the identity of the character. You'll notice he keeps referring to So Sorry as though it's actually himself in the game, and not a character he created. "Toby was more invested in me being a secret than me being a cool secret and not standing up for me made me feel isolated and hurt..."

So, Samael pays a thousand bucks to get his stupid neckbearded fedora-wearing Mary Sue added to the game rather than just a character he created - like what Muffet's creator did. He admits that Toby warned him several times that this was a bad idea, and also admits that Toby offered to scrap the whole thing and give him a refund.
Now, he's saying Toby ruined his life because everything that Toby warned him about came true?
What an entitled little shit. Toby must be a goddamn saint to be able to put up with this moron.
 
These guys are weird. I have one of them who hates my comic. So much so that he "couldn't get past the first chapter" back when he found it like three years ago, and Tumblraged about it on his Tumblr, mainly because he didn't like the language. But every now and then he tweets about DoU, and how it's "the most horrible thing on the Internet," and how he can't believe "it's still going!" So obviously he checks in on it from time to time, if only to tweet about how "bad" it is, even though he doesn't actually read it. But I can't take him seriously because he's a twenty year old Tumblrina with a fat fetish, and I know damn well if I just drew obese furries he could jerk it to, he wouldn't give a tinker's damn about the language in the comic.
 
Apparently there was a fighting game called Kaiju Combat about giant Japanese monsters beating the shit out of each other and some furry paid a shit ton of money to get a giant green kangaroo and a fat dinosaur in the game. And surpirse surprise they're both fetish characters. Naturally, normal people were not thrilled.
kaiju_combat___macrosaurus_by_kaijusamurai-d5klvi1.jpg

kaiju_combat___duncan_by_kaijusamurai-d5naf1i.jpg

The kangaroo's name is just Duncan. Look out guy Duncan is destroying Japan
 
plasticine said:
Why couldn't this guy make up a character that wasn't a fat furry fetish? Was it really that difficult?
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AnOminous said:
Because autism and because he's a gross disgusting creep who has to insert his gross creepy fetish into literally everything he does.
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It's his OC, of course with the autism that it will be hard for him to use a character that isn't a part of the fat furry fetish. Using his OC may as well give him some sort of validation or something. As @The Lizard Queen said, it sounds like Samael can't separate himself from his own fursona OC despite being warned by Toby Fox many times.
 
Christ, with some of these guys, it's like an onion. Peel away one layer, and there's another layer, and another, and another, each one worse than the one before. I mean, they're furries, okay, but why do so many seem to be fetishists on top of that?
 
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