Star Wars Griefing Thread (SPOILERS) - Safety off

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The last three episodes were great, but my one niggle is tthat though the stormtroopers/ISB marshalls acted competently, their armour seems to be useless and they were one-shotted by handguns.
Partagaz went out on his own terms and the irony here is: rebelled by denying the Imperial machine the triumph and satisfaction
I suspect Partagaz developed some rebel sympathies by the end. Who made Dedra get the emails, who gave Lonni Dedra's password.
He's old enough to have spent most of his career working for the Republic too.
Andor having such a heavy focus on the dykes
One scene where Vel and Cinta meet again after so long, Another where Vel gets angry at the guy who shoots Cintra, and a line at the wedding party saying childhood arranged marriages are bad for teh gays.
Thinking about it, Vel may have chosen to be a rebellion agent because she wouldn't be happy living a traditional Chandrillan life.
how lenient the """canon""" rebels were
The notFrench resistance trusted Syril because he was sacked for insubordination.
 
I suspect Partagaz developed some rebel sympathies by the end. Who made Dedra get the emails, who gave Lonni Dedra's password.
He's old enough to have spent most of his career working for the Republic too.
Alternatively he realised that something big as the Death Star can't be hidden forever and that some day someone is going to take the fall for it. Usually the bullet gets eaten by the commanding officer, so I think Partagaz distributed that risk as best as possible, making sure that if he goes down most of the ISB will be destroyed in the process and that only midwits will inherit the ashes.
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It's kinda interesting at least in modern Star Wars (don't have a good memory of the EU era), that a big part of how the Empire failed is how quickly they lost so many of the more competent officers and Death Star within such a short amount of time.

You can even kind of feel it in the Original Trilogy since even in the Empire Strikes Back, while the Empire got some small victories, they really didn't achieve much.

As a side note, its really funny in contrast how the entire Sequel Trilogy takes place in one year

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Sequel Trilogy takes place in one year
this is a fucking kicker that really made the whole thing dumb to me, like Rey has had at most a year of Jedi Training and is somehow able to defeat Palpy by blasting back his force lightning at him with Lightsabers, makes no sense, like at least The Prequels and the Original had timeskips when it made sense, like theres 10 years in between Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones
 
One scene where Vel and Cinta meet again after so long, Another where Vel gets angry at the guy who shoots Cintra, and a line at the wedding party saying childhood arranged marriages are bad for teh gays.
Thinking about it, Vel may have chosen to be a rebellion agent because she wouldn't be happy living a traditional Chandrillan life.
That's just going to end with a Stormtrooper putting a blaster bolt in her by the end. People who do things just to avoid a boring, comfy life tend to get what they asked for, just not in a way they'd think.

The only way Dedra could realistically live is if she just goes with the flow and pretends she was actually doing things for the rebellion just to survive, given how lenient the """canon""" rebels were with Imperial officers after Return of the Jedi.

Otherwise, she definitely committed suicide like her superior
She probably threw herself on the bug zapper floor until she died.

Alternatively he realised that something big as the Death Star can't be hidden forever and that some day someone is going to take the fall for it. Usually the bullet gets eaten by the commanding officer, so I think Partagaz distributed that risk as best as possible, making sure that if he goes down most of the ISB will be destroyed in the process and that only midwits will inherit the ashes.
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I think it's more that he knows he's going to get sacked for letting Luthen's assistant escape and bring word to the Rebels about the Death Star, so instead of letting the Empire throw his ass in jail or have a Sith slowly torture and kill him, he opts to die on his own terms, kind of like a Japanese General after the surrender was signed at the end of WW2.

The ISB still exists by the time of the OT; Colonel Yularen heads it, and he's on the Death Star.

It's funny how Dave Filoni tried to characterize Yularen as someone who is "among the Nazis, but not one of them" when the dude literally heads the Space Gestapo agency. That's as Nazi as you can get. Not to mention that even TCW establishes him as a friend of the Chancellor in that one episode with the cloaked ship and the spider-admiral. So not only does this dude lead the Space Gestapo, but he's one of the Fuhrer/Kaiser's close friends.

Speaking of Filoni, looks like there's trouble in paradise.........



Apparently, there's a turf war in Disney Star Wars between Tony Gilroy and Dave Filoni, with the latter not liking Andor because it doesn't suit his vision for Star Wars. (Remember how Filoni tried to absolve the clones of guilt, yet one of the memorable scenes in Andor was when Andor's dad got executed by clones.) Gilroy apparently used his connection with Kathleen Kennedy to bypass Dave trying to gatekeep him from shaping his own SW show.

I can understand where both men come from. Gilroy wants to produce what amounts to an adult HBO show with Star Wars characteristics, Dave wants to keep Star Wars in a childish level similar to the 80s cartoons. Notice how both treat the Empire; Gilroy wants to portray the Empire as a genuine threat, whereas Filoni makes them into bumbling morons. The way Gilroy wrote the ISB scenes are far smarter than the way FIloni wrote Thrawn in Rebels and Ahsoka.
 
Notice how both treat the Empire; Gilroy wants to portray the Empire as a genuine threat, whereas Filoni makes them into bumbling morons. The way Gilroy wrote the ISB scenes are far smarter than the way FIloni wrote Thrawn in Rebels and Ahsoka.
The way Gilroy writes Krennic and the ISB Supervisors compared to Filoni writing Thrawn brings up this old copypasta

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Something I noticed with Partagaz's suicide and Dedra's fate is how it retroactively adds meaning to the Grand Inquisitor's death and the whole "there are some things more frightening than death" line. Seemingly everyone in the Empire lives with that weighing on them, not just the people involved in the mystical Dark Side aspects. Whether you're going to be tortured by your wizard boss or sentenced to a lifetime in the worst prison imaginable, in the empire, death is a mercy if you fuck up.
 
I found this gem on reddit.
As a piece of literature, Andor is genuinely exceptional. I’d contend that it’s a landmark in how it approaches character construction and steps away from conventional monomythic frameworks, devices, and narrative contours. And its core message is startlingly prescient. And I’m not necessarily referring to its overt commentary on authoritarianism—at least not directly.

We live in a culture where “humble” nearly functions as a pejorative. The incentive architecture of social media has elevated grandiose narcissism and performative behaviour into routine, even celebrated, traits. Phrases like “NPC” or “do it for the plot” have bled into common vernacular.

Andor actively rejects this.

Cassian is more than the archetypal reluctant protagonist—he’s wilfully passionless (outside of familial ties), and absent traditional charisma. Notably, he is written with a degree of passivity that would typically be frowned upon in screenwriting. For much of the series, he is swept along by the inertia of others—those with ambition, influence, and presence. He actively dismisses any suggestion that he is destined for something. And in what is functionally the finale of his story (Rogue One), he, the titular character, functions as a supporting character to Jyn Erso, who by birthright assumes the lead.

In truth, Andor’s plot is driven by its supporting characters, developed with more depth than I’ve encountered in nearly any series. One of the franchise’s most quoted lines is delivered by a nameless hotel clerk. In contrast to many of these side characters, Cassian’s own backstory is relatively boring. These minor characters, in several cases, contribute more directly to the Death Star’s destruction than even Cassian does.

The series doesn’t just explore the “banality of evil” through the ISB—that’s fairly evident—it also illustrates a “mundanity of heroism”. Moments that, in any other setting, might be utterly forgettable. In some instances, the acts are even passive: the hotel clerk who simply doesn’t log Cassian’s name; the hangar tech who looks the other way as Cassian steals prototype Tie fighter. Or Brasso inventing an alibi for Cassian, then later feigning betrayal to protect his farmer neighbour. Or marrying your daughter off for political gain or Lonni reading his colleague’s e-mails.

These are not acts of traditionally heroic swashbuckling. But they grow. Slight gestures compound, each one a little bolder, more costly, more resolute. They layer into something formidable. The message is quietly radical: the power of unremarkable, decent, quietly determined people—many of whom possess no extraordinary skills, abilities, no ambition, no hunger for credit.

And often their ends are brutally unsentimental: Nemik crushed in a loading mishap, Cinta struck down by a stray shot, Lonni’s corpse found by a dog, Kino unable to swim. There’s a striking contrast here between romantic, virtue-signaling grandiosity and the unsung grunt work that truly moves the needle. It’s an empowering presentation of the accessibility of heroism.
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Another redditor was the typical midwit, whinging that Tony Gilroy forgot that blasters have a stun setting.
Yes, but the show never uses magic tech if it doesn't help the story, stunning would make the choices too easy.
The prison arc revolved around electrified floors and insulation boots. But it explores a lot about human compliance.
The robot made sense, as realworld guerillas and special forces sometimes use captured enemy equipment to infiltrate.
 
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Watching the Ghorman massacre sequence, I have a heightened case of the same feeling I got from the end of Season 1. It is as if deep down the script writers know that your average "peaceful protest" consists of armed thugs and smoothbrain fodder cynically brought by said thugs for no purpose but to serve as some combination of expendable human shields and sacrificial pawns to give material for atrocity propaganda, and so that's what they reproduce on screen... they can't quite put their finger on why it is a bad thing. At least this time they had brains to make sure the confrontation is not entirely the rebels' fault.

Also, the whole series still has a really bad case of a mini-Galaxy. The original EU Ghorman Massacre became a landmark accident, remembered completely out of proportion (a few hundreds to thousands dead, the world entirely intact, basically nothing compared to dozens of population centers orbital-bombarded by the Empire later), because Tarkin got promoted for a completely one-sided act of cruelty, and that was when the Rebellion's founders decided that they cannot expect fair governance from Palpatine. But this accident... really is a very minor shout-out that the Empire can plausibly present as suppression of an armed revolt. It is entirely unclear how it can mobilize anyone, who is not already a committed rebel. The whole affair is just so tiny and muddled.
 
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Watching the Ghorman massacre sequence, I have a heightened case of the same feeling I got from the end of Season 1. It is as if deep down the script writers know that your average "peaceful protest" consists of armed thugs and smoothbrain fodder cynically brought by said thugs for no purpose but to serve as some combination of expendable human shields and sacrificial pawns to give material for atrocity propaganda, and so that's what they reproduce on screen... they can't quite put their finger on why it is a bad thing. At least this time they had brains to make sure the confrontation is not entirely the rebels' fault.
The entire thing reminds me of the false flag on Maidan square a decade ago: you have a massive protest, you have semi-militarised police trying to keep things calm (the unfortunate squad commanded by Imperial Sarge "I look out for my men, because they deserve good leadership) and you have a false flag planned by the alphabet soup to justify a crackdown (snipers on the roofs going after Imperial Sarge) - and the actual military with orders to shoot at everyone who's not wearing the uniform.

Personally, I've rarely seen anything like this done reasonably well in a television show. A lot of thought went into this to make sure it's realistic, and gets the point accors that the Empire means business when the gloves truly come off. I mean, regardless of the propaganda they do in preparation for this, up until that point the Imperial forces on Ghorman do not act unreasonably cruel or are generally in the "we gonna slaughter the whole lot of you because we CAN"-mode you'd expect from a government run by an evil space wizard. It's much more nuanced than that, because you also have a Imperial civilian admin post trying to coordinate with whatever local government the Ghormans have. And Krennic also mentioned that they try to find substitutes for the material they needed, before they forcibly mine the planet for it.
 
Watching the Ghorman massacre sequence, I have a heightened case of the same feeling I got from the end of Season 1. It is as if deep down the script writers know that your average "peaceful protest" consists of armed thugs and smoothbrain fodder cynically brought by said thugs for no purpose but to serve as some combination of expendable human shields and sacrificial pawns to give material for atrocity propaganda, and so that's what they reproduce on screen... they can't quite put their finger on why it is a bad thing. At least this time they had brains to make sure the confrontation is not entirely the rebels' fault.
That's because you're dealing with liberals. Lucas included; they think a bunch of people rioting against an armed force puts them on the moral high ground, just as Lucas thought pacifism automatically puts you on the moral high ground. But the problem is, both the Ghormans and the people of Ferrix put passion in front of reason. They have no real strategy to drive the Empire offworld outside of just rioting, or rioting with guns. Which of course, just gives the Empire the excuse to spray and pray, knowing that they have the legal right to do so. I'd have thought the Ghormans would riot and fire upon the Imperials as a distraction so that they can send their people and their spiders offworld. Then before you know it, the Rebellion has 800,000 new recruits, and some stylish new threads for the officer class.

As for the people of Ferrix, again, they tried to attack an armed Imperial force with no guns; what did they expect the blaster-wielding Stormtroopers to do? Stand down and fight hand-to-hand? They should've at least brought blasters; there were enough rioters there that if they did have blasters, it would've been an even fight that they could've won.

Also, the whole series still has a really bad case of a mini-Galaxy. The original EU Ghorman Massacre became a landmark accident, remembered completely out of proportion (a few hundreds to thousands dead, the world entirely intact, basically nothing compared to dozens of population centers orbital-bombarded by the Empire later), because Tarkin got promoted for a completely one-sided act of cruelty, and that was when the Rebellion's founders decided that they cannot expect fair governance from Palpatine. But this accident... really is a very minor shout-out that the Empire can plausibly present as suppression of an armed revolt. It is entirely unclear how it can mobilize anyone, who is not already a committed rebel. The whole affair is just so tiny and muddled.
That, and if we look at the actual show, most people bought the Imperial line that the Ghormans were the assholes. People already hated them for being stuck-up and for defying the Empire, and the riot in Palmo Plaza proved the Imperial propaganda's veracity in the eyes of the populace. Your average John Q. Senator was more than happy to take the Emperor's bribe and speak of the Ghormans in a negative light. Even alien senators got into the act. And given that most of the Imperial army is made up of recruits and conscripts, the fact that Ghorman didn't trigger any coups or mass desertions anywhere means that the people were OK with what happened.

If anything, as far as the galactic populace is concerned, this legitimizes the crackdown operations the Empire performs upon rebellious planets galaxywide, because it just proved to the populace that a firm hand is needed to keep these "violent dissenters" in check.

The Ghorman Massacre was more like Mon Mothma's tipping point. The event that triggers her to openly defy the Empire and hand Palpatine the divorce papers. To the rest of the galaxy, it's a case of uppity Space Frenchmen getting their just desserts. So what if the Empire jackhammers their planet to collapse? As far as the rest of the galaxy is concerned, the Ghormans can get fucked.

Personally, I've rarely seen anything like this done reasonably well in a television show. A lot of thought went into this to make sure it's realistic, and gets the point accors that the Empire means business when the gloves truly come off. I mean, regardless of the propaganda they do in preparation for this, up until that point the Imperial forces on Ghorman do not act unreasonably cruel or are generally in the "we gonna slaughter the whole lot of you because we CAN"-mode you'd expect from a government run by an evil space wizard. It's much more nuanced than that, because you also have a Imperial civilian admin post trying to coordinate with whatever local government the Ghormans have. And Krennic also mentioned that they try to find substitutes for the material they needed, before they forcibly mine the planet for it.
Said evil Space Wizard was a master of politics. Even without his Force powers, he's the kind of guy that would make Frank Underwood and Tywin Lannister look like a joke. He knows how to present the narrative to further his goals.

I'm guessing that by the time Death Star 2.0 was made, they did find a substitute for the Ghorman Kalkite. It's bigger than the first.

Honestly, I'm sad they killed my nigger Cyril.
He just wanted to prove himself a good man. The Empire didn't give a shit about the Ghormans, the Rebels just wanted Ghorman to rebel so they can "burn bright" as Luthen said. Syril was the only one who saw that this was wrong, aside from Andor.
 
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Just finished Andor, extremely full of itself show. Not really much more to say than what has already been said.
 
Said evil Space Wizard was a master of politics. Even without his Force powers, he's the kind of guy that would make Frank Underwood and Tywin Lannister look like a joke. He knows how to present the narrative to further his goals.
For me it raises a series of (maybe?) ludicrous questions: What did Palpy do all day after he achieved the goal of becoming Emperor of most of the galaxy? What was his daily routine? What did he do in his free time, if any? Hobbies other than searching for arcane Sith artifacts? I like the idea of him sometimes having a nostalgic streak, remembering the days when everything was difficult, dangerous and one tiny mistake could have unravelled everything. Personally I think dealing with all the bureaucracy and actually doing the government-stuff would utterly bore and frustrate him...

What do you do when you win a game nobody else was playing competently?
 
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