Containment What will happen when Barb dies?

[Marvin]

It can absolutely happen with an arrest. Virginia's policies on NGRI misdemeanors. One can be kept up to a year (that would likely be unusual but as I've said reading these documents is only of limited help as actions on the ground do not line up perfectly with policy, but rather organically work within, and sometimes without, it.)

He does not need to be a schizophrenic to get mental health care. He just needs to be arrested in a situation with enough pressure to make him act really funny to the police and to psychiatric examiners working for the courts.

He also has little chance of "developing" schizophrenia at his age. There's a lot of labels that can be applied to him, that's not one, although I wouldn't be shocked if someone did diagnose him with it on examining him in a correctional setting after an arrest.

It's never been that it can't happen. The rules with crazies are always set up to be subject to interpretation.

It's just exceptionally unlikely to happen with Chris.

Getting off on an insanity plea is incredibly difficult. He's not going to do that for any sort of crime. He doesn't need to just "act funny". Homeless people (who are typically full of much worse mental issues than Chris) regularly get tossed in jail. They're not going to get off unless you can get a shrink to actually write down a serious diagnosis of something like schizophrenia.

None of the rules make it impossible. Just the reality of how the system works in practice makes it incredibly unlikely.

 

[AnOminous]

Getting off on an insanity plea is incredibly difficult. He's not going to do that for any sort of crime. He doesn't need to just "act funny". Homeless people (who are typically full of much worse mental issues than Chris) regularly get tossed in jail. They're not going to get off unless you can get a shrink to actually write down a serious diagnosis of something like schizophrenia.

They usually get tossed in jail for ridiculous crimes much like Chris has been arrested for. Just dumb shit. Like not even really macing someone. The insanity plea never comes up because there's never much in the way of jail time associated with it anyway. By the time a plea agreement gets reached, the sentence is time served anyway.

 

[Spooky Bones]

It's never been that it can't happen. The rules with crazies are always set up to be subject to interpretation.

It's just exceptionally unlikely to happen with Chris.

Getting off on an insanity plea is incredibly difficult. He's not going to do that for any sort of crime. He doesn't need to just "act funny". Homeless people (who are typically full of much worse mental issues than Chris) regularly get tossed in jail. They're not going to get off unless you can get a shrink to actually write down a serious diagnosis of something like schizophrenia.

None of the rules make it impossible. Just the reality of how the system works in practice makes it incredibly unlikely.

I'm admittedly applying some logic from out-of-state here and finding things a little different than I thought once reading. According to this paper, it doesn't look like there is the same thing as what in NY is a 730 (commitment due to incompetency to stand trial followed by restoration of competency, conversion to civil status on a misdemeanor, other progress in the case as a forensic patient) vs a 330.20 (NGRI proper found by trial.) The incompetency-to-stand trial bit doesn't seem to exist in Virginia; it's a determination by two doctors ordered by a judge when a defendant is obviously bonkers, that can commit to a psych ward. 730.40 is for non serious offenses and usually takes you to a state psych center, get put on either voluntary or involuntary within 1-3 days, get considered for quick discharge. There's no equivalent that I see in VA, so here you might be right and I might be wrong. It says there are on average something like 35 NGRIs per year in VA, counting I think both misdemeanors and felonies. Doing a formal NGRI for a misdemeanor is idiotic, NY's approach is cheaper and more humane, but who knows. Some states fared the rigors of deinstitutionalization better than others.

Still though when I was speaking of him getting into it with cops and then being institutionalized, I'm also referring to the fact that the cops will call an ambulance for a clearly crazy person in at least some cases. I surely assume and hope this is the case in VA, although maybe quite considerably less than in NY, I've worked in states with deficient psych services before, it sucks, but they still brought crazy people in by ambulance. The problem is getting them a bed/treatment. But let this happen a couple times with Chris, maybe he gets treatment. A dark horse is what the inevitable fact of the whole staff finding out about his Internet notoriety is. There's a decent chance the reaction would be wanting Chris off their hands absolutely and as soon as possible. That wouldn't serve him at all. Yes, the jails are full of crazy people. But Chris in full meltdown mode would qualify for a trip to the psych ER (I hope!) He might even get a bipolar or schizophrenia diagnosis. Which I wouldn't think valid, but that stuff does get written down for a wide variety of people.

 

[AnOminous]

Chris might fuck up and commit some actually serious crime, probably accidentally. I doubt it, though.

 

[Mason Verger]

I'm admittedly applying some logic from out-of-state here and finding things a little different than I thought once reading. According to this paper, it doesn't look like there is the same thing as what in NY is a 730 (commitment due to incompetency to stand trial followed by restoration of competency, conversion to civil status on a misdemeanor, other progress in the case as a forensic patient) vs a 330.20 (NGRI proper found by trial.) The incompetency-to-stand trial bit doesn't seem to exist in Virginia; it's a determination by two doctors ordered by a judge when a defendant is obviously bonkers, that can commit to a psych ward. 730.40 is for non serious offenses and usually takes you to a state psych center, get put on either voluntary or involuntary within 1-3 days, get considered for quick discharge. There's no equivalent that I see in VA, so here you might be right and I might be wrong. It says there are on average something like 35 NGRIs per year in VA, counting I think both misdemeanors and felonies. Doing a formal NGRI for a misdemeanor is idiotic, NY's approach is cheaper and more humane, but who knows. Some states fared the rigors of deinstitutionalization better than others.

Still though when I was speaking of him getting into it with cops and then being institutionalized, I'm also referring to the fact that the cops will call an ambulance for a clearly crazy person in at least some cases. I surely assume and hope this is the case in VA, although maybe quite considerably less than in NY, I've worked in states with deficient psych services before, it sucks, but they still brought crazy people in by ambulance. The problem is getting them a bed/treatment. But let this happen a couple times with Chris, maybe he gets treatment. A dark horse is what the inevitable fact of the whole staff finding out about his Internet notoriety is. There's a decent chance the reaction would be wanting Chris off their hands absolutely and as soon as possible. That wouldn't serve him at all. Yes, the jails are full of crazy people. But Chris in full meltdown mode would qualify for a trip to the psych ER (I hope!) He might even get a bipolar or schizophrenia diagnosis. Which I wouldn't think valid, but that stuff does get written down for a wide variety of people.

There’s actually some precedence tangentially connected to Chris that pretty much points to him being soft-balled through the system even if he does something really crazy. That kid that took the picture of him in the clinic waiting room was there because he took his pregnant teenage girlfriend hostage in an armed standoff with police. Where did it land him? In a wellness clinic waiting room with Chris.

 

[Marvin]

Still though when I was speaking of him getting into it with cops and then being institutionalized, I'm also referring to the fact that the cops will call an ambulance for a clearly crazy person in at least some cases.

Chris is not clearly crazy in person. Even when he's freaking out. You really need to get to know Chris to realize that he's insane.

But Chris in full meltdown mode would qualify for a trip to the psych ER (I hope!) He might even get a bipolar or schizophrenia diagnosis.

I don't think Chris is schizophrenic. Not even close. He doesn't experience visual or auditory hallucinations. I think he's genuinely crazy and needs to be handled, but I don't think that the facilities in his area are willing to acknowledge his craziness. (like how he got prescribed HRT or how his shrink handwaved away his merge delusions)

 

[AnOminous]

Chris is not clearly crazy in person. Even when he's freaking out. You really need to get to know Chris to realize that he's insane.

I don't think Chris is schizophrenic. Not even close. He doesn't experience visual or auditory hallucinations. I think he's genuinely crazy and needs to be handled, but I don't think that the facilities in his area are willing to acknowledge his craziness. (like how he got prescribed HRT or how his shrink handwaved away his merge delusions)

He's not crazy by the legal definition he'd have to meet to be actually locked up. We all know this.

 

[Mason Verger]

Here’s a practical issue: what judge wants to play “flip a coin” on where to send a LEGALLY certified troon? Either choice is going to stir up some shit for you, somewhere. Best to just catch and release.

 

[AnOminous]

Here’s a practical issue: what judge wants to play “flip a coin” on where to send a LEGALLY certified troon? Either choice is going to stir up some shit for you, somewhere. Best to just catch and release.

Just take them out and shoot them.

 

[Mason Verger]

Just take them out and shoot them.

#Christinedidntkillherself

 

[Mariposa Electrique]

He should be locked up just to protect his anal virginity from the Satanist psycho who is going to penetrate him viciously, over and over, if he ever gets in the same room.

I am convinced no one actually wants to fuck Chris, they just want to be famous.

 

[Gasthefurfags1488]

I think Chris will end up with gov housing which may last for a bit due to his autism, but eventually he's gonna end up institutionalized or something due to without guidance from his mother and no real friends and social ties. The padded cell Saga will eventually happen it's just a matter of when. I'm pretty sure he's developing some sort of schizophrenia possibly.

 

[Spooky Bones]

Chris is not clearly crazy in person. Even when he's freaking out. You really need to get to know Chris to realize that he's insane.

I'll defer to your greater knowledge but I find this a little hard to swallow at the current stage of his life. I think that his insanity would become manifest in an interaction with the police, although on the other hand may be becoming deferential when sufficiently scared even after talking a good fight.

I don't think Chris is schizophrenic. Not even close.

Definitely not. Doesn't mean he couldn't be diagnosed as such either to facilitate treatment or out of laziness. As I've said the labels are as much social constructs as nosologically distinct entities.

 

[AnOminous]

I am convinced no one actually wants to fuck Chris, they just want to be famous.

Cockless has convinced me he actually seriously, really wants to fuck Chris in the ass. Chris had best not be surprised if, when he gets within dicking distance, he gets raped hard. That is not a dude who takes no for an answer, and if he's anywhere near Chris, Chris is getting ass raped.

 

[Marvin]

I'll defer to your greater knowledge but I find this a little hard to swallow at the current stage of his life. I think that his insanity would become manifest in an interaction with the police, although on the other hand may be becoming deferential when sufficiently scared even after talking a good fight.

Not legally actionably insane.

Definitely not. Doesn't mean he couldn't be diagnosed as such either to facilitate treatment or out of laziness. As I've said the labels are as much social constructs as nosologically distinct entities.

A schizophrenia diagnosis is more serious than something like ADHD or whatever. I think it's kind of an uphill climb to accidentally diagnose Chris with schizophrenia. Not impossible, but it'd require Chris to act out pretty aggressively for it to happen.

 

[Spooky Bones]

Not legally actionably insane.

Transport to the hospital after acting out publicly is very different from finding NGRI.

A schizophrenia diagnosis is more serious than something like ADHD or whatever. I think it's kind of an uphill climb to accidentally diagnose Chris with schizophrenia. Not impossible, but it'd require Chris to act out pretty aggressively for it to happen.

Not accidental, but out of laziness and what is at some level desire to upbill. It happens more than people might think.

 

[Marvin]

Transport to the hospital after acting out publicly is very different from finding NGRI.

It's really unlikely.

Not accidental, but out of laziness and what is at some level desire to upbill. It happens more than people might think.

Huh. You think? He jabbered about his stupid beliefs to his last shrink constantly and nothing happened.

 

[Maxliam]

Come to think, I wonder if Chris is still slugging straight Smirnoff like he was during the idea guy saga. Because that reacts really well with Valium. The side effects are pretty much one to one on what Chris describes as his daily life. Seriously, the only ones I can knock off the list are coma and death:

What are the Effects of Mixing Valium and Alcohol?

Because both alcohol and Valium work on GABA receptors in the brain, they induce similar effects, especially at high doses.

www.alcohol.org

He's such white trash that he is shrugging off mixing booze and valium like a trophy wife? God damn, that's a semi-superpower right there.

 

[Spooky Bones]

[Transportation to psych ward is] really unlikely.

[Not-real dx of schizophrenia] Huh. You think? He jabbered about his stupid beliefs to his last shrink constantly and nothing happened.

Are you speaking from personal experience/knowledge re: VA? Because you seem quite confident and I know for a fact if he were in many if not most other states, he would be getting transported to the ER quite a bit if he were on the streets and doing weird shit, talking to himself, and most importantly being uncooperative and getting himself in confrontations with LE/security which is something I can see happening, especially as the cops get to know him as they do homeless people. If he knows how to be quiet it won't happen and some people take the view that he will be able to STFU if homeless but I'm really not so sure about that one.

His previous clinician, seeing him for a court-mandated period of time, has less incentive to give a dramatic diagnosis than an ER or inpatient doctor who is looking for better billing or possibly, if they are being quite the humanitarian, a longer hospital stay.

He's such white trash that he is shrugging off mixing booze and valium like a trophy wife? God damn, that's a semi-superpower right there.

A lot of people mix booze and benzos. Except for causing blackouts and car crashes, it's usually not quite as physically dangerous (as in stopping you from breathing) as claimed until you include opiates, then you die.

 

[Marvin]

Are you speaking from personal experience/knowledge re: VA? Because you seem quite confident and I know for a fact if he were in many if not most other states, he would be getting transported to the ER quite a bit if he were on the streets and doing weird shit, talking to himself, and most importantly being uncooperative and getting himself in confrontations with LE/security which is something I can see happening, especially as the cops get to know him as they do homeless people. If he knows how to be quiet it won't happen and some people take the view that he will be able to STFU if homeless but I'm really not so sure about that one.

He doesn't talk to himself or exhibit any crazy symptoms.