Marvel Cinematic Universe

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Drag-on Knight 91873 said:
Dramatically, yeah, but Spidey fans would be mad that he spends more time haggling over pay and getting yelled at by his wife than beating up bad guys.

"Gee, maybe Doc Ock was right to rob banks."
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yeah even if it's not specifically Peter Parker The Kosher Spider Ham, but basically doing the same hits as BB and Spidey, especially the part where she eventually finds out and promptly womans the operation into the fucking ground
 
I think there's plenty of middle ground between "literal child in high school" and "archetypal suburban white collar homeowner with a wife and two kids", especially when you consider that a major longrunning theme to Peter Parker's character is not being able to hold onto/maintain a good thing because of the sacrifices he chooses to make in his personal life. I'm perfectly satisfied with the takes where Peter Parker the civilian is ostensibly a washout fuckup who can't hold a job or a relationship because he's constantly sacrificing those things to go out and be Spider-Man under the guise of duty and responsibility and altruism but secretly because he just loves it more than anything else.

It just straight up doesn't make sense to me for Peter Parker to have a normal, traditionally successful Breaking Bad style life; that's not a logical progression for the character, and placing him in that position raises too many questions about how he even managed that in the first place. I think just continuing the same themes and struggles out into adulthood would make for a much more sympathetic and relatable story. I mean it's basically the story of a lot of people's lives; being a nobody at a shit job you don't care about just to keep yourself alive until you clock out and go spar at the boxing gym or play a punk rock show or whatever your actual passion is.

What we're missing is the interim between Peter Parker, the guy reluctantly torn between two worlds/lives/identities, and Spider-Man, the full time hero who lives in Avengers Tower or the Baxter Building and has made the choice to fully commit to the thing he's passionate about at the expense of living a normal life. That's the interesting story that hasn't really been told in film yet because they keep shitcanning the franchise and starting over right when they're about to get there.
 
dick brain said:
I'm perfectly satisfied with the takes where Peter Parker the civilian is ostensibly a washout fuckup who can't hold a job or a relationship because he's constantly sacrificing those things to go out and be Spider-Man under the guise of duty and responsibility and altruism but secretly because he just loves it more than anything else.
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this will sound weird but if anything Peter should probably not even worry about a job anymore, apps like doordash have basically made his ability to make money way easier. delivery went from a job for losers in their 20s to everyone having a "side hustle" and once you add in stuff like "WFH" i'd say a zoomer peter parker is probably the most likely to be able to have a pretty ok life financially and have a girlfriend. even the excuses don't have to be varied. "got an order, sorry!" boom.

just smart phones in general sort of get rid of a lot of the "problems" of Pete. its why somehow the spiderman trilogy doesn't really use them or digital cameras too much. whereas Andrew Garfield's spiderman is using all the latest gadgets.

obviously the kid part will always be near impossible for him, but again, how many new yorkers in their 20s have kids anyways? have him and MJ get a dog, or maybe a giant australian spider as a pet.

In general the smartphone era sort of destroys plenty of superhero ideas, you know every citizen would be recording them and getting audio at all times. chances are there would be a place like kiwifarms trying to figure out each one's identity, honestly surprised no one at marvel has written an issue where Josh Moon gets his ass kicked.
 
Get the rope Macaulay! said:
this will sound weird but if anything Peter should probably not even worry about a job anymore, apps like doordash have basically made his ability to make money way easier. delivery went from a job for losers in their 20s to everyone having a "side hustle" and once you add in stuff like "WFH" i'd say a zoomer peter parker is probably the most likely to be able to have a pretty ok life financially and have a girlfriend. even the excuses don't have to be varied. "got an order, sorry!" boom.
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yeah, and there's a lot of options for a photog to get buyers instead of just dealing with JJJ's bullshit
 
I agree a lot with you guys, but I would posit to keep him going with JJJ in specific, Peter is trying to sell to him for his own ego's sake as much as anything - trying to earn a "respectability" he craves even if it's in his own head at this rate. You can even harken that craving and ego as an echo of the douchey nerd Peter was very, very originally written as!
 
Mayor Cody Travers said:
I agree a lot with you guys, but I would posit to keep him going with JJJ in specific, Peter is trying to sell to him for his own ego's sake as much as anything - trying to earn a "respectability" he craves even if it's in his own head at this rate. You can even harken that craving and ego as an echo of the douchey nerd Peter was very, very originally written as!
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yeah, like he doesn't want to make it "online" because he sees the real prestige in the print dailies (not unlike Stan Lee and the floppies)
 
dick brain said:
I think there's plenty of middle ground between "literal child in high school" and "archetypal suburban white collar homeowner with a wife and two kids", especially when you consider that a major longrunning theme to Peter Parker's character is not being able to hold onto/maintain a good thing because of the sacrifices he chooses to make in his personal life. I'm perfectly satisfied with the takes where Peter Parker the civilian is ostensibly a washout fuckup who can't hold a job or a relationship because he's constantly sacrificing those things to go out and be Spider-Man under the guise of duty and responsibility and altruism but secretly because he just loves it more than anything else.

It just straight up doesn't make sense to me for Peter Parker to have a normal, traditionally successful Breaking Bad style life; that's not a logical progression for the character, and placing him in that position raises too many questions about how he even managed that in the first place. I think just continuing the same themes and struggles out into adulthood would make for a much more sympathetic and relatable story. I mean it's basically the story of a lot of people's lives; being a nobody at a shit job you don't care about just to keep yourself alive until you clock out and go spar at the boxing gym or play a punk rock show or whatever your actual passion is.

What we're missing is the interim between Peter Parker, the guy reluctantly torn between two worlds/lives/identities, and Spider-Man, the full time hero who lives in Avengers Tower or the Baxter Building and has made the choice to fully commit to the thing he's passionate about at the expense of living a normal life. That's the interesting story that hasn't really been told in film yet because they keep shitcanning the franchise and starting over right when they're about to get there.
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Tom Defalco's Spider-Girl comics, beloved by pro-Marriage people, even specifically state that Peter is so chronically obsessed with self-sacrifice the only way he stops being Spider-Man is to lose a leg outright. SO yea i agree it's a bit more nuanced than that, other than that comic and Kraven's Last Hunt there's not been well-written marriage stuff in any Spidey comic (havent read Ultimate)
 
BetterFuckChuck said:
other than that comic and Kraven's Last Hunt there's not been well-written marriage stuff in any Spidey comic (havent read Ultimate)
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Disagree, there's a ton of great stories with the marriage.
- Even before they were married, you had Len Wein's run (ASM 151 - 180), which was the first time Peter and MJ were an actual romantic couple. Wein wrote them as a healthy, mostly normal relationship. His stories lean a bit too far into the Silver Age goofiness but they were still good, especially the second half of his run.
- Gerry Conway's concurrent Spectacular and Web runs (Spec 137 - 172 & Web 47 - 70) are some of my favorite Spider-Man comics and take place during the marriage, featuring it heavily.
- J.M. DeMatteis' Spectacular run (Spec 178 - 203).
- David Michelinie's first few years on Amazing after the marriage are good, though he clearly runs out of steam and ideas in the last few years, probably because he was writing Spider-Man for nearly a decade.
- The two-ish years between the end of the Clone Saga and the start of New Chapter are terrific and probably the last best era of Spider-Man comics. Had stuff like Identity Crisis, wherein due to Spider-Man being a wanted criminal with a giant bounty on his head, Peter decides to forgo the Spider-Man identity for a while with MJ helping him to create four new superhero identities.
- I liked J. Michael Straczynski's stuff up until Civil War.
- Peter David's Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man is good, though suffers from having to tie into Civil War and other dumb shit at the time. Speaking of PAD, he also got a few good stories in Spectacular after the marriage before he got kicked off the title.
- Then there's the already mentioned Spider-Girl, which ran for over 120 issues altogether. Also, he didn't stop being Spider-Man after losing his leg. Reed Richards made him an advanced prosthetic and he continued on as Spider-Man for a while. I can't remember if there is a big event that gets him to stop or if he just naturally winds down due the demands of being a father.

Peter in a healthy relationship can work. You just need writers who don't suck and don't want to turn Peter Parker into their man child self-insert so they can vicariously bang Black Cat and other superheroines.
 
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HeyYou said:
Which is funny because Peter is canonically 30 in the main book but he still acts like a 17 year old. We have genuinely still not recovered from OMD and its cancerous effect on Spider-Man.
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The recent movies have a bit to do as well, because more people watch the movies than they read comics.

In the Raimi trilogy, Peter starts as a teenager, but graduates and goes to college. By SM3, he's already finished or finishing college and thinking about getting married. We know he and MJ are still together and working on it in No Way Home.

In TASM, Peter also starts in high school, and he's graduated and working for the Bugle in the sequel (I don't have more details, I haven't seen it). I know there were planned sequels that didn't happen, but Peter was a young adult already.

SM and Friends (82?) also had Peter being an adult in college living with Bobby and Angelica. IICR, SM94 was gonna marry MJ, I think? Whatever, they're still together as for X-Men 97 and they're probably around the same age as most of the X-Men (around 25 or so).

Current Peter, as for No Way Home, is still in school or just about to finish, though. And unlike the other examples above, he acts like a child.

There is definitely a marketing aspect to keep Peter as youthful as possible because that's what certain audiences demand now, despite Peter being an adult (who's either starting or about to finish college) has been the default Peter for most of his animated or live action versions. People do love adult Peter who's doing young adult stuff, but they need to keep pushing for a character that is still marketable for kids in a way that the other heroes are not.

What's funny to me is that both Maguire SM and Garfield SM are both adults who are shown as being absolutely loved by children in universe, something that we really dont' see much with Holland SM because he's a child himself. The whole speech by Aunt May in SM2 is about how kids needs heroes, which is a different impact if SM is himself a kid or act as one.
 
Fuck parker, my nigga Miguel gets to keep an actual wife for once and lead humanity into the stars, and even when other hacks tried to ruin him they always needed to put the "this shit happened before he became space emperor, he is still a chad in the future" card
 
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That negress looks like someone tried and failed to destroy evidence of foul play on Kermit the Frog's corpse by stashing it in the trunk of a car that was set on fire.
 
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