<2022-11-17T02:56:26.000Z> dew_the_dew: it always amazes me how malded some people get about me buying and holding this one stock
<2022-11-17T13:23:45.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Really is odd isn't it?
<2022-11-17T13:25:14.000Z> BowsacNoodle: My best friend's dad was an RIA until retirement and I learned a lot from them + my own reading. I don't know how they can get away with what they do regarding gme
<2022-11-17T13:27:15.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Pretty sure White _male works in financial computer science. Would make sense he views this from the "official narrative" respector position
<2022-11-17T13:28:03.000Z> dew_the_dew: i have another HFT frenemy on irc
<2022-11-17T13:28:31.000Z> dew_the_dew: he thinks we may be right but he also thinks the system will never pay us because it's just THAT rigged
<2022-11-17T13:28:52.000Z> dew_the_dew: the traders are little minnows that swim with the big fish that actually move the prices
<2022-11-17T13:34:00.000Z> dew_the_dew: like for instance, my dad was a corporate tax attorney and my conversations with him that may involve how the IRS is an unconstitutional criminal organization go nowhere. 
<2022-11-17T13:34:43.000Z> dew_the_dew: this guy makes his money finding ways to jiggle around bits of information at the right time to make profit.
<2022-11-17T13:48:50.000Z> BowsacNoodle: I agree with that actually
<2022-11-17T13:49:19.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Or at least I know it's a possibility
<2022-11-17T13:51:11.000Z> dew_the_dew: what, that they will never pay us because they have infinite ability to manipulate prices?
<2022-11-17T13:51:22.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Yes
<2022-11-17T13:51:32.000Z> dew_the_dew: yeah i'm aware.
<2022-11-17T13:52:19.000Z> dew_the_dew: i just don't care lol.  i think it's hilarious.  also haven't invested anything i can't afford to lose.
<2022-11-17T13:52:49.000Z> BowsacNoodle: The decision to halt trading on gme was ONLY for the system's benefit. You can't have "read the fine print" caveat emptor + the bullshit line about preventing regular people from losing their ass.
<2022-11-17T13:52:54.000Z> dew_the_dew: the retail-attempting-to-DRS-everything is something that we've never seen before.
<2022-11-17T13:53:17.000Z> BowsacNoodle: I just want to know mechanistically how they do it.
<2022-11-17T13:53:33.000Z> dew_the_dew: that patrick byrne video is a good start
<2022-11-17T13:54:05.000Z> dew_the_dew: like i'm not an uber l33t hacker but i know a little bit and watching that my takeaway was just holy shit it's so exploitable
<2022-11-17T13:54:46.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Typed a good msg just now and my phone ate it. I gotta get the client installed here
<2022-11-17T13:54:58.000Z> BowsacNoodle: I'll watch it. Have it bookmarked for this morning actually
<2022-11-17T13:55:47.000Z> dew_the_dew: like most of the core systems in place now seem to have been hastily coded in the 80s
<2022-11-17T14:10:53.000Z> BowsacNoodle: I'm like 7 minutes in and I'm wondering how widespread this is.
<2022-11-17T14:11:32.000Z> dew_the_dew: the gme people have also dug into some relatively ancient yahoo finance forum posts about 'cellar boxing'
<2022-11-17T14:12:19.000Z> dew_the_dew: which is basically 'we've decided that this company should fail for one reason or another so we're going to short them onto the pink lists so they will never be able to raise capital again and then maybe our backers will buy their IP on the cheap'
<2022-11-17T14:13:36.000Z> dew_the_dew: if a hedge fund pulls this off correctly the company files for bankruptcy and they then 'return' all of the 'shares' that they 'borrowed' for zero dollars and they don't pay any capital gains taxes because it's based on debt that they borrowed.
<2022-11-17T14:14:27.000Z> dew_the_dew: like if i buy a house, rehab it and sell it, i pay cap gains but if i rehab it, rent it, and refinance on it i don't pay taxes on the refi cash because it's debt.
<2022-11-17T16:55:11.000Z> dew_the_dew: btw look at ticker hkd some hong kong company went nuts this summer for no reason and buy button was never turned off
<2022-11-17T18:11:16.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Interesting
<2022-11-17T18:11:35.000Z> dew_the_dew: oh idk if you got my last chat about HDK i was on phone
<2022-11-17T18:11:48.000Z> dew_the_dew: check that ticker
<2022-11-17T18:12:08.000Z> dew_the_dew: like over this summer.  the buy button was never turned off.  people in the gme play suspect it's some sort of weird collateral pump.
<2022-11-17T18:12:21.000Z> dew_the_dew: sorry $HKD
<2022-11-17T18:12:36.000Z> BowsacNoodle: I watched all the way through on that. Surprised to learn about the phantom FTDs
<2022-11-17T18:13:03.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Or rather the homeless ones hanging out forever
<2022-11-17T18:13:20.000Z> dew_the_dew: probably in some pension plan somewhere
<2022-11-17T18:13:40.000Z> dew_the_dew: it's a fucking mess man
<2022-11-17T18:13:47.000Z> dew_the_dew: they're ripping us all off
<2022-11-17T18:13:48.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Possibly. I think the best case scenario is that particular company ultimately gets bought out
<2022-11-17T18:14:00.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Or rather gets tanked
<2022-11-17T18:14:19.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Full bankruptcy and the worthless shares will be a non problem.
<2022-11-17T18:14:19.000Z> dew_the_dew: it's happened with pharma corps too
<2022-11-17T18:14:43.000Z> dew_the_dew: so purdue or whoever can acquire them cheap and get their IP that might actually cure a disease
<2022-11-17T18:14:46.000Z> dew_the_dew: and then bury it
<2022-11-17T18:15:01.000Z> dew_the_dew: it all has to do with how the jews want to funnel money
<2022-11-17T18:15:24.000Z> BowsacNoodle: So essentially private non-voting shares are the only hope for a company interested in raising capital.
<2022-11-17T18:15:33.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Or bonds
<2022-11-17T18:15:34.000Z> dew_the_dew: if you put your shekels in the things they like that serve their agenda your money won't evaporate
<2022-11-17T18:15:40.000Z> dew_the_dew: idk i have to go wagie
<2022-11-17T18:15:47.000Z> BowsacNoodle: That's fucked man
<2022-11-17T18:16:03.000Z> dew_the_dew: i'll ttyl
<2022-11-17T18:16:11.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Alright take care
<2022-11-17T20:00:41.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Man wtf. HKD
<2022-11-18T01:28:37.000Z> dew_the_dew: never marked pco
<2022-11-18T02:56:56.000Z> dew_the_dew: weird
<2022-11-18T02:57:10.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Pco?
<2022-11-18T02:57:22.000Z> dew_the_dew: when i'm on my phone i get your chats and then when i get back they're not in the log here
<2022-11-18T02:57:25.000Z> dew_the_dew: position close only
<2022-11-18T02:57:31.000Z> dew_the_dew: turning off the buy button
<2022-11-18T02:57:31.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Ah
<2022-11-18T02:57:51.000Z> dew_the_dew: yeah like it's fine when HKD this who knows what chinese company
<2022-11-18T02:58:01.000Z> dew_the_dew: i've never even seen a good explanation of what it is
<2022-11-18T02:58:13.000Z> dew_the_dew: IPOs and goes to like $2500
<2022-11-18T02:58:19.000Z> dew_the_dew: but gme hits 400 and SHUT IT DOWN
<2022-11-18T02:58:52.000Z> dew_the_dew: hkd also has a really weird structure where they have like a small fraction of the existing shares as tradeable float
<2022-11-18T02:58:55.000Z> BowsacNoodle: GameStop was specifically because they can't risk another hedgie going under. Can't have more orphaned FTDs in the market. 
<2022-11-18T02:59:23.000Z> dew_the_dew: well the working theory is that melvin passed its bad bets onto citadel
<2022-11-18T02:59:31.000Z> dew_the_dew: and archegos passed theirs onto credit suisse
<2022-11-18T02:59:41.000Z> dew_the_dew: in terms of the reported short interest we know that they can hide that with swaps
<2022-11-18T02:59:49.000Z> dew_the_dew: and that archegos was doing exactly that
<2022-11-18T02:59:54.000Z> BowsacNoodle: So dirty
<2022-11-18T03:00:02.000Z> dew_the_dew: which is why credit suisse was oblivious to what huang was doing
<2022-11-18T03:00:16.000Z> dew_the_dew: it's all kinds of fucked up
<2022-11-18T03:00:24.000Z> dew_the_dew: like trying to explain all this to someone
<2022-11-18T03:00:41.000Z> dew_the_dew: it's really hard to even know where to start and even harder not to sound like a schizo
<2022-11-18T03:01:15.000Z> BowsacNoodle: I follow what you're saying 100%. Some of the acronyms not so much, but I've worked in a related field to this in the past and kept up on it.
<2022-11-18T03:01:23.000Z> dew_the_dew: there have been persistent /GME/ threads on /biz for the past two years
<2022-11-18T03:01:43.000Z> BowsacNoodle: I think that video is really good
<2022-11-18T03:01:54.000Z> dew_the_dew: yeah i'm not like an expert on the market or anything most of what i've learned has been since jan 21
<2022-11-18T03:02:19.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Trouble is it's so long. I want it shorter but I can't imagine what to trim. Like he starts off saying "this is basically a college lecture" and he's right. It's jam packed.
<2022-11-18T03:02:26.000Z> dew_the_dew: i heard about it late and figured it was over and then it was just obvious that the volume wasn't there for them to have closed their shorts
<2022-11-18T03:02:50.000Z> dew_the_dew: so i basically put my stimulus check into it
<2022-11-18T03:02:56.000Z> dew_the_dew: i've since averaged down considerable
<2022-11-18T03:03:14.000Z> dew_the_dew: i loaded up a good bit when it was around 40 in february/march
<2022-11-18T03:03:29.000Z> BowsacNoodle: I mean how does GameStop even stay in business? Realistically
<2022-11-18T03:03:41.000Z> BowsacNoodle: I am totally fine with fucking over hedgies
<2022-11-18T03:03:47.000Z> dew_the_dew: they are transitioning to e-commerce and have put together an nft marketplace
<2022-11-18T03:03:51.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Just like how profitable can they actually be?
<2022-11-18T03:04:06.000Z> dew_the_dew: ryan (((cohen))) who founded chewy bought 10% of the company late 2020
<2022-11-18T03:04:11.000Z> dew_the_dew: and he's now chairman of the board
<2022-11-18T03:04:19.000Z> BowsacNoodle: 🥲
<2022-11-18T03:04:22.000Z> dew_the_dew: it would take a cohen to pull something like this off
<2022-11-18T03:04:31.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Of course.
<2022-11-18T03:04:42.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Golden parachute incoming
<2022-11-18T03:04:57.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Do they want to kill it still?
<2022-11-18T03:05:01.000Z> dew_the_dew: most of the c-suite vested their shares around $210
<2022-11-18T03:05:03.000Z> dew_the_dew: uh
<2022-11-18T03:05:22.000Z> dew_the_dew: there was also a 4:1 split in july
<2022-11-18T03:05:27.000Z> dew_the_dew: but uh
<2022-11-18T03:05:33.000Z> dew_the_dew: in terms of them wanting to kill it
<2022-11-18T03:05:36.000Z> dew_the_dew: it's a matter of survival
<2022-11-18T03:06:08.000Z> BowsacNoodle: How so?
<2022-11-18T03:06:36.000Z> dew_the_dew: they could be forced to buy back all the shares
<2022-11-18T03:06:41.000Z> dew_the_dew: at any price
<2022-11-18T03:06:52.000Z> dew_the_dew: and there is a cult of redditors who have vowed to hold until phone numbers
<2022-11-18T03:06:58.000Z> BowsacNoodle: How so?
<2022-11-18T03:07:13.000Z> dew_the_dew: once their losses on the short position
<2022-11-18T03:07:19.000Z> dew_the_dew: outweigh their other assets
<2022-11-18T03:07:22.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Is the plan to get majority control in direct registration?
<2022-11-18T03:07:29.000Z> dew_the_dew: like they no longer have collateral to balance their books
<2022-11-18T03:07:36.000Z> dew_the_dew: marge calls and it's forced buying
<2022-11-18T03:07:41.000Z> dew_the_dew: liquidating everything
<2022-11-18T03:07:51.000Z> dew_the_dew: this could completely rekt pension plans if it happens
<2022-11-18T03:07:54.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Wait they STILL have the short?
<2022-11-18T03:07:59.000Z> dew_the_dew: that's the whole thesis
<2022-11-18T03:08:02.000Z> dew_the_dew: shorts never closed
<2022-11-18T03:08:05.000Z> dew_the_dew: they can't close
<2022-11-18T03:08:17.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Too much scrutiny on it now?
<2022-11-18T03:08:26.000Z> dew_the_dew: it could be like 300-400% of the float that they have short
<2022-11-18T03:08:44.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Surely they're TRYING?
<2022-11-18T03:08:47.000Z> dew_the_dew: but like i said they can hide it in swaps and you can't really trust the reporting agencies
<2022-11-18T03:08:52.000Z> dew_the_dew: they're trying to shake the longs
<2022-11-18T03:09:03.000Z> dew_the_dew: the shilling is ridiculous
<2022-11-18T03:09:10.000Z> dew_the_dew: the only way they win is if retail capitulates
<2022-11-18T03:09:11.000Z> dew_the_dew: imo
<2022-11-18T03:09:17.000Z> dew_the_dew: s/win/survive
<2022-11-18T03:09:33.000Z> BowsacNoodle: I mean I hope the hedgies eat shit
<2022-11-18T03:09:44.000Z> BowsacNoodle: My concern is if they become "bankrupt"
<2022-11-18T03:09:51.000Z> dew_the_dew: boards.4channel.org/biz/thread/52487866#top
<2022-11-18T03:09:59.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Like if the CEO does some intentionally shitty things.
<2022-11-18T03:09:59.000Z> dew_the_dew: those positions get passed up the ladder
<2022-11-18T03:10:10.000Z> dew_the_dew: they don't just go away
<2022-11-18T03:10:27.000Z> dew_the_dew: they borrowed something that belongs to someone else
<2022-11-18T03:10:31.000Z> dew_the_dew: and sold it
<2022-11-18T03:10:34.000Z> dew_the_dew: they have to give it back
<2022-11-18T03:11:07.000Z> dew_the_dew: (unless they didn't even borrow it which is even worse and is probably actually the case.  or they borrowed a share that had already been borrowed from someone else)
<2022-11-18T03:11:19.000Z> BowsacNoodle: I know that. Ultimately if say 80% of shares become direct registered, they can't realistically force the price down that low. 
<2022-11-18T03:11:33.000Z> dew_the_dew: right now it seems like they are trying to keep it in a sweet spot
<2022-11-18T03:11:52.000Z> dew_the_dew: because if it drops too low reddit can buy and DRS even faster.
<2022-11-18T03:12:02.000Z> BowsacNoodle: 🤣
<2022-11-18T03:12:16.000Z> dew_the_dew: like if they were to manage to drop it to 3-4 dollars the float would be drs'd in a week or two.
<2022-11-18T03:12:26.000Z> BowsacNoodle: So even if they delist it, there's nothing these hedgies can do?
<2022-11-18T03:12:34.000Z> dew_the_dew: why would they delist it
<2022-11-18T03:12:43.000Z> dew_the_dew: this shit doesn't just go away
<2022-11-18T03:12:51.000Z> dew_the_dew: now if they had pulled off the cellar boxing thing
<2022-11-18T03:13:02.000Z> dew_the_dew: where they get it down to like where sears and blockbuster are
<2022-11-18T03:13:10.000Z> dew_the_dew: (they did this to those companies too btw)
<2022-11-18T03:13:21.000Z> dew_the_dew: they could keep those shorts that are in profit open forever
<2022-11-18T03:13:36.000Z> dew_the_dew: and it's basically collateral for them it's a positive amount in their books
<2022-11-18T03:14:12.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Still has margin cost though
<2022-11-18T03:14:23.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Granted they're probably borrowing at libor or something
<2022-11-18T03:14:28.000Z> dew_the_dew: idk
<2022-11-18T03:14:35.000Z> dew_the_dew: the borrow rate has been doing crazy shit too
<2022-11-18T03:14:52.000Z> dew_the_dew: basically to put it as succinctly as i can
<2022-11-18T03:14:54.000Z> BowsacNoodle: So you were also saying it takes more time to get new shares even for you?
<2022-11-18T03:15:10.000Z> dew_the_dew: there is way too much weird shit going on not to hang onto a handful of these shares
<2022-11-18T03:15:12.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Like they're having to track down new shares now basically?
<2022-11-18T03:15:31.000Z> dew_the_dew: i'm not sure exactly how it works
<2022-11-18T03:15:46.000Z> dew_the_dew: but some guy posted that his transfers from fidelity to computershare keep taking longer and longer
<2022-11-18T03:16:22.000Z> dew_the_dew: it's like collapsing a quantum state
<2022-11-18T03:16:26.000Z> dew_the_dew: or something
<2022-11-18T03:16:26.000Z> BowsacNoodle: They have to be trying to figure out how to stop this. Maybe they'll try to accuse it of being a Russian troll scheme 
<2022-11-18T03:16:31.000Z> dew_the_dew: kek
<2022-11-18T03:17:14.000Z> dew_the_dew: like in the broker dealer system the share can exist in multiple places at the same time but when it's DRSd that stops
<2022-11-18T03:17:22.000Z> dew_the_dew: f
<2022-11-18T03:18:26.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Hah
<2022-11-18T03:18:31.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Ending the kiting
<2022-11-18T03:19:23.000Z> BowsacNoodle: I wonder if wsb and biz will turn this into the investments firm theyve long joked about
<2022-11-18T03:19:34.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Like brk type
<2022-11-18T03:19:44.000Z> dew_the_dew: wsb has completely changed since jan 21
<2022-11-18T03:19:46.000Z> dew_the_dew: it's comped
<2022-11-18T03:19:58.000Z> dew_the_dew: so are all the other gme subs to some extent
<2022-11-18T03:20:02.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Too bad. I used to like that place
<2022-11-18T03:20:18.000Z> dew_the_dew: there seems to be a lot of trying to get people to buy options
<2022-11-18T03:20:35.000Z> dew_the_dew: when you buy options and then they expire OTM you are giving money to the MM
<2022-11-18T03:21:07.000Z> dew_the_dew: anyone trying to call dates on this is full of shit
<2022-11-18T03:21:09.000Z> BowsacNoodle: I've done really well with options
<2022-11-18T03:21:52.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Modest amounts but several trades over 100% ROR
<2022-11-18T03:22:21.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Usually just 1-5 contracts at a time. Generally calls.
<2022-11-18T03:22:40.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Starting to do more spreads because the IV is so high
<2022-11-18T03:22:57.000Z> dew_the_dew: i have some reading to do
<2022-11-18T03:23:02.000Z> dew_the_dew: check the /biz/ thread
<2022-11-18T03:24:05.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Will do
<2022-11-18T19:01:14.000Z> dew_the_dew: finance.yahoo.com/news/gamestop-hodlers-keep-hanging-140008382.html
<2022-11-18T19:01:28.000Z> dew_the_dew: press all like 'they don't trust us'
<2022-11-18T22:21:06.000Z> BowsacNoodle: Haha
<2022-11-18T22:26:21.000Z> BowsacNoodle: The press doesn't get that this is as much or more about fucking the hedgies over as it is about making money
<2022-11-18T22:27:19.000Z> BowsacNoodle: It's like a 401k but Better. I Might actually Make money on It and It's Fucking Over A Hedg
<2022-11-18T22:27:41.000Z> BowsacNoodle: My phone is capitalizing every other word and jumping around. I think the jews hacked it
<2022-11-19T05:36:51.000Z> dew_the_dew: so do you think you are going to buy
<2022-11-19T05:37:33.000Z> dew_the_dew: if yes you want to buy on fidelity and then after t+2 for settlement transfer all or a portion of shares to computershare
<2022-11-19T05:37:42.000Z> dew_the_dew: because they do it for free
<2022-11-19T05:38:14.000Z> dew_the_dew: all you have to do is get on the online chat and they are very used to these requests by now and they will probably know exactly which security you want to transfer
<2022-11-19T05:38:28.000Z> dew_the_dew: so they send all your info to computershare and an account there is created for you
<2022-11-19T05:39:23.000Z> dew_the_dew: and then you wait for a letter in the mail with a code or do a standard identify verification quiz with the multiple choice questions about which car you owned or which address is associated with you
<2022-11-19T05:54:33.000Z> BowsacNoodle: I may get on board. Will have to wait s bit for some things to come through on my end.
<2022-11-19T05:55:09.000Z> dew_the_dew: i think it's silly not to throw 100bux at it
<2022-11-19T05:55:21.000Z> dew_the_dew: that's all i'll give as financial advice
<2022-11-19T12:56:42.000Z> BowsacNoodle: 👍🏿